On Wednesday, May 30, 2012 12:43:24 PM Dave did opine: > "Our systems don't run well on phase converters." > > They didn't have any suggestions to make it run better via tweaks to the > 611 ?? Perhaps none are available. > > I bet that drive is going into shutdown mode based on safety shutdown > circuits - loss of phase, etc. > > Siemens does an excellent job of building in protection for their drives > - as I think you are finding out. > > I had a bad axis motor on my lathe that was full of water (literally). > The lathe sat outside in a rainstorm before I got it and somehow water > got into > the Siemens Z axis motor. I actually ran the motor off the 611 drive > with water in the motor (older than yours) for a while but it would > fault out periodically. I simply kept resetting the > drive until it would no longer reset. I bought a new-old stock motor > since I thought the motor was bad, and when I took the old motor off the > machine, water poured out at the drive shaft. At least a few cups of > it. People at the shop still talk about how that motor ran even when it > had water in it. Crazy. > The 611 drive was not damaged through all of that. But the motor was > junk - internal corrosion etc. > > >>as well as we can't run on a Delta system because we need > > the ground reference I think he said.<< > > Yes, they really want a grounded Wye supply on the infeed side. > > >>Additionally he suggested a Delta to WYE step up transformer with > > grounded secondaries between the RPC and the 611.<< > > That has worked for me on a Parker Servo drive system, Siemens VFDs, an > a Italian servo drive (forgot the brand). > > Siemens also recommends a grounded Wye supply for their VFDs, but they > built provisions into the newer VFDs so they can run off a Delta > supply. > > Hmmmm... > > What are you going to do next? > > Perhaps I missed something; Did you figure out if that transformer in > your machine is a Delta-Wye transformer or not?
It can apparently be either, but its all autoformer and doesn't give the isolation required in order to be able to connect its secondary neutral to the house neutral. That is what I was muttering about several messages back after John posted the resistances from here and there. > Dave > > On 5/30/2012 11:26 AM, John Thornton wrote: > > Dave and everyone who has been following this, > > > > I just got off the phone with Siemens tech support and "Our systems > > don't run well on phase converters." was the main theme of the > > conversation as well as we can't run on a Delta system because we need > > the ground reference I think he said. > > > > Additionally he suggested a Delta to WYE step up transformer with > > grounded secondaries between the RPC and the 611. > > > > John > > > > On 5/30/2012 8:27 AM, Dave wrote: > >> Around here (Indiana) they put the HV disconnect on the pole that > >> feeds the underground line that runs to a pad mount tranformer. > >> > >> That way if a short develops in HV feed to the pad transformer, the > >> switch/breaker kicks out. > >> > >> I always figure about 1 KW per HP, but with these more efficient > >> motors these days it is oftentimes more like .9 KW per HP for bigger > >> motors. > >> > >> Dave > >> > >> On 5/30/2012 7:59 AM, gene heskett wrote: > >>> On Wednesday, May 30, 2012 07:15:28 AM John Thornton did opine: > >>>> I don't have a pole can... I live out in the woods and all the > >>>> services are underground and I'm serviced with a pad mounted > >>>> transformer that only feeds my house and shop. I have a 200 amp > >>>> service that is split between my house and the shop and both have > >>>> 200 amp panels with proper size wire. I can spin up my lathe 5.5Kw > >>>> spindle from 0-6,000 while the mill is running and never have I > >>>> seen the lights dim, well when I ran the garage from some direct > >>>> bury 10ga I could make the lights dim but not since I built the > >>>> shop and installed proper wiring. > >>> > >>> Sounds good. It also means the power folks can access the can for > >>> tap changes a lot easier. But if its buried, where is the high > >>> side disconnect? That would need to be done cold. > >>> > >>>> Is the encoder disk problem one of cam or cad? > >>>> > >>>> John > >>> > >>> Lack of the ability to preview the result, I have never been able to > >>> get usable resolution out of openscam. Using a #58 pcb drill as a > >>> mill, my speed& depth of cut per pass capability suffers, so it > >>> take about an hour and a half to make one test disk. With the > >>> smaller bit, I took the slot count up to 47 from 39, but while the > >>> quadrature is usable, its not an even duty cycle, so I need to > >>> figure out if I need narrower or wider slots, plus the center hole > >>> math needs tweaked to account for the bit radii, with the smaller > >>> bit, the hole got very sloppy so that code piece needs tweaked. > >>> Compounded by the thinner material being able to fit into the > >>> thread on the spindle tail where I am trapping it between the > >>> bearing preload adjusting nuts. The 1/16" thick brass didn't > >>> suffer from that as those threads are about 16 tpi there. > >>> > >>> Plus I noted that somehow, in the loop that cuts the slots, which > >>> because of the fragility of that size bit, is a 9 pass loop, > >>> cutting about 3.5 thou deeper per pass, but I seem not to have > >>> properly restored some starting value for the 2nd& subsequent > >>> passes, I can see in the backplot that the length of the slot > >>> changes by about a thou on each end of the slots. I've printed the > >>> code so I can study it better, but I am thinking my next change > >>> will be to make a common subroutine that takes the current angle as > >>> an argument. As is, that math is scattered in about 4 places& > >>> I've obviously an error in one of them. That, and turn the index > >>> pulse cut into an extension of the first cut when the angle is 360. > >>> Some sort of a conditional there because I now have a slightly > >>> wider index pulse than is needed. > >>> > >>> This material I'm using this time came from a dishwashers door > >>> insert, which when I looked, turned out to be two layers of 17 thou > >>> thick alu, painted both sides so you can have your choice of black, > >>> white, or almond. So I have enough to make quite a few. :) > >>> > >>> Time, as long as I'm still sucking air regularly, is something I > >>> have. Other than an occasional bout of loading the dishwasher, > >>> getting Dee whatever she wants to eat& about 6 hours a week > >>> beating back the jungle, I am not otherwise occupied. ;-) > >>> > >>>> On 5/29/2012 2:45 PM, gene heskett wrote: > >>>>> On Tuesday, May 29, 2012 03:10:01 PM John Thornton did opine: > >>>>>> Where should the 208v be? The mains are 244vac. > >>>>> > >>>>> That means your wall socket voltage is about 122. Using the same > >>>>> math in kcalc, I get 211.310198523, but the meter will be great > >>>>> if it actually displays the .3. :) > >>>>> > >>>>> The math is simple enough, sin(120)*voltage, where the 120 is the > >>>>> phase angle under ideal conditions. FWIW sin(120) and sin(60) > >>>>> return exactly the same value because the sin is mirrored around > >>>>> modulo 90 degrees where it is 1.00000, and is zero at 0 and 180 > >>>>> degrees. > >>>>> > >>>>> That is just about 1 step on the taps of your service pole can. > >>>>> The substation regulators can usually do finer work. That pole > >>>>> can, from the looks of this, should be able to feed your place > >>>>> with at least 25kw in order to be adequately 'stiff' enough for > >>>>> this level of load variations. I was bumping the 4 or 5 houses on > >>>>> my can just enough that my eyes could see it, so both the bigger > >>>>> bandsaw, and my 6" delta jointer (the one I trimmed my > >>>>> fingernails with) are now reconfigured for a 250 volt single > >>>>> phase feed. I don't even see the lights in the shop dim now. > >>>>> Its 6 gage buried range-like cable back to the 200 amp house > >>>>> service, nice and stiff. > >>>>> > >>>>> :) My AC has a 2.5 horse 127v motor on it and I need to do it the > >>>>> :same > >>>>> > >>>>> way. > >>>>> > >>>>> Got a summer thunderboomer moving thru, noisy outside, but I am > >>>>> tempted to go setup the mill and see if I can make another encoder > >>>>> disk for the lathe. I have some thinner material now, salvaged > >>>>> from the color panel in the front door of a dishwasher that > >>>>> failed, black but I'll have to magnet test it to see if its > >>>>> ferrous, that if plastic I maybe can carve with a pcb drill for a > >>>>> mill. And I need to modify that code a bit so there is no width > >>>>> discontinuity for the long slot that is the index pulse. > >>>>> > >>>>> I may have to hit up Andy up for some math help because I don't > >>>>> think that code compensates for the mill radius when it tapers > >>>>> smaller at the inside radii of the slots. I get the impression > >>>>> that the taper it uses needs a /2 in order to aim the side of the > >>>>> carved slot directly at the center of the circle. > >>>>> > >>>>>> John > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On 5/29/2012 12:11 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > >>>>>>> gene heskett wrote: > >>>>>>>> I have another wild idea, your Vab, Vac, Vbc voltages would > >>>>>>>> appear to be moderately well balanced, as they should be. The > >>>>>>>> generated C, measured to ground, is quite hot as is also > >>>>>>>> expected. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Perfect should be 208 V, so 212 is quite close. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Jon > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>> ---- -- -------- Live Security Virtual Conference > >>>>>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security > >>>>>>> and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can > >>>>>>> respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile > >>>>>>> security and the latest in malware threats. > >>>>>>> http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>> Emc-users mailing list > >>>>>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >>>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>> ---- --- ------ Live Security Virtual Conference > >>>>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > >>>>>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. > >>>>>> Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and > >>>>>> the latest in malware threats. > >>>>>> http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>> Emc-users mailing list > >>>>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >>>>> > >>>>> Cheers, Gene > >>>> > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> ----- ------ Live Security Virtual Conference > >>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > >>>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. > >>>> Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the > >>>> latest in malware threats. > >>>> http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Emc-users mailing list > >>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >>> > >>> Cheers, Gene > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> --------- Live Security Virtual Conference > >> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > >> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. > >> Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the > >> latest in malware threats. > >> http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Emc-users mailing list > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------- Live Security Virtual Conference > > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. > > Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the > > latest in malware threats. > > http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Emc-users mailing list > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ------ Live Security Virtual Conference > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. > Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the > latest in malware threats. > http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> Call me bored, but don't call me boring. -- Larry Wall in <199705101952.maa00...@wall.org> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
