On Monday 10 April 2017 13:59:37 Todd Zuercher wrote: > Those ammonia cycle refrigerators are pretty common in RVs and > campers. > Uh, no. 99% of those that run on bottle gas are sulphur dioxide based units. Actually quite decent efficiency, but the problem with sulphur dioxide is that its a very unstable gas, seeking out a molecule of water so it can borrow the oxygen atom from it so you have a couple atoms of hydrogen left wondering where their oxygen went, but the oxygen is now part of a sulphur-trioxide molecule. And guess what, sulphur-trioxide is just the technical name for sulphuric acid, CP. So when they gas them up at the factory, the last thing they do is pull the best vacuum they know how to do and heat the coils to drive off all the airborn moisture they can while holding that vacuum for what to the production people think is a waste of time. But anything less will eat their profits in warranty claims. I have read that one molecule of water left in such a system, will corrode itself internally, either pinholing the pipeing someplace, or the corrosion products will block the gas flow, in less than 10 years from the date they seal it shut.
Not to mention that this stuff will do the same thing in your lungs, with often fatal results by stealing the water in the lung tissues to make sulphuric acid right in your lungs. The old monitor top GE refrigerators were filled with that stuff, and they were known to be killers in the middle of the night if you didn't wake up and vacate the premises quickly. I had an aunt and her family that did wake up, but they couldn't really breath easy for several months afterwards. Now you know "the rest of the story" about camper fridges. If you can't hear a compressor running, I'd never sleep in a camper so equipt. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kurt Jacobson" <kurtcjacob...@gmail.com> > To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" > <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 > 12:23:20 PM > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Way OT, Unexpected Result from Refrigerator > > > I am impressed that someone managed to come up with this cycle: > > http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~mnr/fridge.html > > We used to see quite a few ammonia cycle based refrigerators and > central air conditioning units down here in the south (Georgia), but > they are becoming scarce now. They were generally reliable and very > economical to run, although some of the cheaper units had problems > with corrosion in the coils causing them to fail. > > I was interested in the cycle and as a project for an advanced > thermodynamics class I did a detailed analysts of if it with operation > cost comparisons etc. As I recall it came out making compressor based > systems look very undesirable from an operating cost standpoint. The > funny thing is that the power company was offering rebates to people > to encourage them to replace there "inefficient" natural gas powered > refrigeration systems. Now they are offering rebates to replace > "inefficient" gas furnaces with heat-pumps. I think I see a pattern... > > Cheers, > Kurt > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 12:00 PM, andy pugh <bodge...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 10 April 2017 at 16:37, Jon Elson <el...@pico-systems.com> wrote: > > > If the condenser pressure is too > > > low, you won't get any liquid at all, and the Carnot process > > > turns into a really ineffective Brayton (all gas) process. > > > > I am impressed that someone managed to come up with this cycle: > > http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~mnr/fridge.html > > > > > > -- > > atp > > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is > > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and > > lunatics." > > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916 > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > ------------------ > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > > _______________________________________________ > > Emc-users mailing list > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >-------- Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's > most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >-------- Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's > most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
