----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any
advice in this forum.]----
Your last sentence really sums the whole thing up.
"Will pay what the aircraft is worth to me."
If I am a Sport Pilot, consider my options for owning an airplane:
1. I could own an old fabric taildragger without an electrical
system. I can get one for under $20k. Oh boy! I get to prop the plane
when I want to fly!
2. I could buy a new SLSA plane. Oops - $80k.
3. I could build a kit - ELSA. But I'm not a builder, and I want to
fly my plane before I die.
4. I could buy an Ercoupe. It has an electrical system, a starter,
tricycle gear, pretty much the stuff I want. Is it worth more than a
fabric taildragger? It is to me, because I want a plane with an
electrical system and tricycle gear. For me to lose interest in an
Ercoupe, it needs to be more than half the price of an SLSA, in a
condition that satisfies me. I can put my Ercoupe in really good
shape for $40k! And I've still paid half of an SLSA. For me, the old
classic taildraggers aren't even in the equation.
I think the rising cost of Ercoupes has come from this thinking. I
think there will always be a bunch of guys not renewing their
medicals, and new guys not wanting to get one, who have $30k to
spend, who will have their sights set on an Ercoupe.
Just my opinion, natürlich!
Larry
N 99340
On Dec 20, 2005, at 8:14 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before
following any advice in this forum.]----
Very nice Ed. You certainly covered all areas very well.
I still love the Coupe but have a difficult time with SOME wanting
way more
than they are worth because some who are not familiar with the
problems or
cost of owning these older aircrafts are purchasing them. And then
having to
spend a great deal of money to get them as they should or even
worse, will
let them sit and never be completed.
I am like many who have owned and repaired these older aircrafts.
Will pay
what the aircraft is worth to me.
Lee
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Cflyin" <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 6:02 AM
Subject: [COUPERS-FLYIN] LSA as alternative to Coupes
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before
following any
advice in this forum.]----
Lee wrote:
Bob don't know where you are looking, and yes some are that
high, which I agree is too much, but some are in the 50's and
60's. Rans S-6 and the S-7, Pulsar, and Zeneth are all selling
new in the 60's, and for a year or two old comes down into the
40's.
Here are "watch out for"s for those considering any kind of LSA:
SLSA - The $70-$90k LSA aircraft being sold are SLSA - Special
Light Sport
Aircraft. These are factory built to the consensus standard and
must be
maintained by an appropriately rated LSA repairman (maintenance)
or A&P or
higher and the annual condition inspections must be signed off by
those
same
levels of mechanic. Pay close attention to the difference between
base
price versus fly-away price. And watch out because *some* sellers
don't
include shipping costs from Eastern Europe in the prices they are
quoting
you - till after you commit.
By their SLSA status, they are much closer to certificated status
than
they
are to experimental. They MAY be used for commercial instruction
and to a
large extent, that's what they're being sold for. These also have
operating
limits similar to certificated aircraft in that they may fly over
densely
populated areas under the same rules as certificated aircraft. The
manufacturer MAY impose operating limits that are permanent such
as VFR
only
or VFR daytime only - check it out before you buy.
Any aircraft more than a year old cannot be a SLSA - no SLSAs had
been
approved that far back. Buyer beware.
dELSA - Some factories are selling a factory built LSA with only
an ELSA
airworthiness certificate. If it was built by the factory to
their SLSA
standard but issued a downgraded dELSA airworthiness certificate,
it gets
better operating limits than the lower certificates. These may be
maintained by anyone but the annual condition inspection may be
done by
the
owner if he/she has a repairman (inspection) (16 hour course)
certificate
or
by a repairman (maintenance), A&P or higher.
kELSA - The next level of LSA would be kELSA or kit-built
Experimental
Light
Sport Aircraft - if there were such a thing in existence. These
don't yet
exist because the consensus standard for kits has not been
completed and
approved by the FAA. These may be maintained by anyone but the
annual
condition inspection may be done by the owner if he/she has a
repairman
(inspection) (16 hour course) certificate or by a repairman
(maintenance),
A&P or higher.
gELSA - This level is for the never-before-registered ultralight
trainers
and fat-UL aircraft. They must pass an inspection basically
identical to
the ExpAB (Experimental Amateur Built) aircraft. These may be
maintained
by
anyone but the annual condition inspection may be done by the
owner if
he/she has a repairman (inspection) (16 hour course) certificate
or by a
repairman (maintenance), A&P or higher.
Aircraft may only be converted to be gELSA until January 31,
2008. Even
new
aircraft built between now and January 31, 2008 are eligible for this
status.
Up till a couple of weeks ago, these gELSA got the most restrictive
operating limits essentially prohibiting them from ever flying over
densely
populated areas even to land at an airport. But, a few weeks ago,
the FAA
staff had a meeting. Since then, we've seen one newly inspected
aircraft
get operating limits similar to the ExpAB limits with the
inspector saying
these are according to the new guidelines he had received. By
these, the
aircraft may fly over densely populated areas at the direction of air
traffic control or while landing or taking off as long as they
maintain
sufficient altitude to effect a safe emergency landing in the
event of a
power unit failure. We're waiting for publication of the new
change to
FAA
order 8130.2F. Up till now, we've only seen CHG 1. This would be
a CHG
2.
Those one or two year old aircraft being advertised as LSA are often
certified as either ExpAB or dELSA or even gELSA. It is ESSENTIAL
to know
what the operating limits are on the aircraft before you put down
you tens
of thousands of dollars!
Here's a reference showing the privileges of each kind of LSA
aircraft:
http://edburkhead.com/Challenger/LSA_privilege_chart.htm
It's a mess. Buying a Coupe is simpler, if you can find a clean
one (or
like projects).
However, the new crop of aircraft built to be within the LSA
standards to
be
flown by Sport Pilots have better performance than our Coupes.
They're
much
like what Fred would be designing if he were here today.
Fred told me in an interview that he never expected Coupes to be
in use in
10 years. The rate of progress was so fast, when he designed
them, that
he
thought new, clearly superior designs would have taken over the
market.
That estimate was off by 55 years, but it's finally happening.
We can still love our Coupes for their relatively low cost and
intrinsic
value, their historicity and for the family of Coupers that comes
with
them.
Ed Burkhead
http://edburkhead.com
ed -at- edburkhead???.com (change -at- to @ and remove "???")
======================================================================
======
==
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm
Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/
======================================================================
========
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm
Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/
==============================================================================
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm
Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/
