EV Digest 4954
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Walmart Heater Cooks
by "John Luck Home" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Motor-gearbox connection problem + clutchless idea (Don?)
by Richard Bebbington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: Battery monitoring question
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Motor-gearbox connection problem + clutchless idea (Don?)
by Steve O <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Walmart Heater Cooks
by "Dale Curren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Short range vehicles and speed records
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Mike Chancey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Fourth Generation Pot
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by jerry halstead <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Short range vehicles and speed records
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Extra TAX on High-Milage Hybrids ?? WHAT !!
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) EV and Hybrid Rally around the White House this Saturday
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by jerry halstead <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by jerry halstead <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Data collection Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Electric Imp info
by "ProEV" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Tango News ...
by Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Was there ever a definitive answer on the temperature dot question?
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Andre' Blanchard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Great Patrick - I shall go look for a Titan - or similar picture.
Has anyone tried the fan motors on DC ? as I do not even have a blower
fitted.
I know some of the early Chinese wire element heaters had a DC motor and a
simple diode from the AC supply to make DC for the motor.
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Maston" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2005 12:53 AM
Subject: Re: Walmart Heater Cooks
> John, this is the type of thing you are looking for:
>
>
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4100060&cat=133026&type=1&dept=4044&path=0%3A4044%3A133032%3A133026#Features+%26+Specifications
>
> You just want the square heating element, which is the darker area in
> the center of the picture. I cut my heaters open with a cutoff grinder.
> Remove the fan and AC switches (you cannot use the AC switches for your
> DC application - they won't handle the amperage). Connect all the same
> color terminals together: Black to black and red to red and run the
> wires (make sure they're large gauge since you'll be pulling quite a few
> amps if you connect 2 elements together) to your power source through a
> relay or contactor. I secured my heating elements in the stock vehicle
> heater housing with silicone sealer.
>
> Blue skies,
>
> Patrick
>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/30/05 2:42:47 PM >>>
> Patrick - for the benefit of us "Ev"rs in the U.K could you post a
> picture
> or a link to which Walmart ceramic heater you used , so we can try and
> find
> it in our discount stores over this side of the pond. Its getting
> pretty
> cold this time of year without a heater in my ev.
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/668.html
>
> Tks
>
> John
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Patrick Maston" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 5:23 PM
> Subject: Walmart Heater Cooks
>
>
> > After several days on-the-road use, I have to say that the Walmart
> > heater is a success. I took 2 Walmart 1500W ceramic heater cores,
> wired
> > them together in parallel, and installed them in place of the
> original
> > heater core in my Jet Electrica. They are connected to traction
> pack
> > voltage (120V) through a contactor that is activated by a 12V relay,
> > which is in turn controlled by the heater fan switch. This worked
> out
> > well because the fan switch doesn't supply enough voltage to the
> relay
> > until the switch is at medium speed, assuring airflow through the
> heater
> > cores. Temperature is just controlled by the amount of air flowing
> > through the cores, using the fan speed and temperature slide on the
> > regular heater control panel. When I first turn the heater on it
> takes
> > about 20 seconds to start blowing hot air. So I have 3000W of
> > almost-instant heat at my disposal. Nice and toasty! Total cost
> for
> > the system was about $60.
> >
> > Blue skies,
> >
> > Patrick
> >
> >
> > --
> > This message has been scanned for viruses and
> > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
> > believed to be clean.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.10/188 - Release Date:
> 29/11/2005
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.10/189 - Release Date:
30/11/2005
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Victor,
If you want to go clutchless, so as we did for Gary
Graunke's Insight: he uses similar 5105WS12 motor
with involuted spline as well:
http://www.metricmind.com/images/5105shaft.jpg
So I came up with coupler for his transmission:
Drawing
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/insight_coupler.gif
Do you have any of these couplers available as a stock item?
I have a 5105WS12 motor here, and haven't got around to building
it into a project yet, partly because of the difficulty of
getting the exact dimensions of the DIN splines
( I found some info on the Net, but would need full dimensions
to be able to model the part in Solidworks, to then give our
friendly machinist the data for his CNC machine... )
I'd be particularily interested in a version that could
couple the Siemens motor inline onto a Netgain Warp8 or 9 's
auxilliary shaft ( 0.875 inches dia with keyway )....
.... yes it's another of my weird ideas, for a dual-motor AC/DC Supra!
I guess the internally splined part (intended for coupling onto the
transmission
input shaft) could be bored out to suit?
Thanks,
--
Richard Bebbington
electric Mini pickup
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/electric.mini/
www.supralectrix.co.uk
UK dealer for Netgain EV motors!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I think the unit you would be interested in is called BADICHEQ. It is
computer monitoring of a battery pack. From what I read on their website it
looked very promising.
-----Original Message-----
From: Stefan T. Peters [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 12:53 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Battery monitoring question
I was wondering, if you had a device that was accurately monitoring each
batteries individual voltage constantly, as well as the total current
drawn by the string, what would you be able to do with the information?
I'm talking about automatic type stuff...
I have no idea if these are all valid, but here are some initial thoughts:
- Switch out a battery that is about to reverse
- Calculate state of charge
- Periodic logging of "state of health" for each battery, warning driver
to replace bad apples
- Cool compact dashboard display
Any others?
--
Stefan T. Peters
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For my mini I had to link the LEM 2x2 (which had a keyway) and the spline of
the reliant gearbox. I made a flat plate to bolt onto the old clutch plate
which gave me something to work off. There is then a semi flexible couple. The
connector onto the LEM was easily sourced by a friend at Lancereal. He is a
very helpful chap called Nick and he know alot about couplings.
www.lancereal.com
Hope that helps - probably not
Steve
Richard Bebbington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Victor,
> If you want to go clutchless, so as we did for Gary
> Graunke's Insight: he uses similar 5105WS12 motor
> with involuted spline as well:
>
> http://www.metricmind.com/images/5105shaft.jpg
>
> So I came up with coupler for his transmission:
> Drawing
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/insight_coupler.gif
Do you have any of these couplers available as a stock item?
I have a 5105WS12 motor here, and haven't got around to building
it into a project yet, partly because of the difficulty of
getting the exact dimensions of the DIN splines
( I found some info on the Net, but would need full dimensions
to be able to model the part in Solidworks, to then give our
friendly machinist the data for his CNC machine... )
I'd be particularily interested in a version that could
couple the Siemens motor inline onto a Netgain Warp8 or 9 's
auxilliary shaft ( 0.875 inches dia with keyway )....
.... yes it's another of my weird ideas, for a dual-motor AC/DC Supra!
I guess the internally splined part (intended for coupling onto the
transmission
input shaft) could be bored out to suit?
Thanks,
--
Richard Bebbington
electric Mini pickup
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/electric.mini/
www.supralectrix.co.uk
UK dealer for Netgain EV motors!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
** Reply to message from "Patrick Maston" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Wed, 30 Nov 2005 16:21:01 -0800
> John, I don't know if I still have the boxes. I'll check tonight. I
> believe they were "Titan" 1500W heaters.
I bought a Titan heater just yesterday.
Dale Curren
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Robert, the E-meter Mike is using has RS232 output and simply outputs ASCII
information once per second. Mike is using the "HyperTerminal" program that
comes free with Windows to capture the data and save it to the hard disc on
his laptop. This is his data logger. For your Palm, if you get a serial
port adapter (aka RS232 adapter), then you will be able to log the data to
your Palm.
One thing I like to do is to take this data and bring it into excel a graph
it. Good tool for seeing how much energy I use and regen I actually get on
a particular trip.
A word of caution: The serial port on the E-Meter is not isolated,
therefore the ground on the RS232 cable is the same as the battery pack
ground. To avoid potential problems you may want to purchase an RS232
isolator.
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Robert Chew
Sent: November 30, 2005 10:25 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
HI Mike,
I am interested in your data logging program. Mind sharing it. Or explaining
how to program something to datalog on either a palm pilot or laptop.
Cheers
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mike Chancey
Sent: 01 December 2005 15:21
To: [email protected]
Subject: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
Hi folks,
I have been messing about with this off an on for the last few weeks and I
thought I should mention it. My Civic EV conversion is equipped with an
E-meter with the optional serial port. I had planned since I built the car
in 1999 to try some data logging, but it never seemed to work. I finally
dug out Tim Nolan's excellent Homepower article, (on line at:
http://timnolan.com ) re-read it, and discovered the problem. I had missed
the part about it needing a null-modem cable and had used a straight cable.
Add the right cable and away it went.
So here is the current setup:
E-meter connected to $5 antique laptop (Toshiba T4900CT P75 24 Mb running
Win98SE). The laptop equipped with with an eBay special 802.11B wireless
card with a magnetic antenna. I don't actually access the laptop in the
car, when the car is in the driveway or garage, it can be accessed on my
home network via VNC from my desktop or my real laptop. Currently the
laptop is powered from a 300 Watt
12 Volt to 120 VAC inverter, but as soon as I get the isolator for the
serial port working, it will be switched over to a 12 Volt direct power
adapter. The inverter setup wastes too much power. Data is being captured
and logged using HyperTerminal. Even with the tiny (720 Mb) hard drive and
letting it log once per second, the data files have not been unreasonably
large.
I have only done a couple of cycles with the logging on, but I already
identified a charger issue so the Zivan NG5 will be coming out and getting
reprogrammed. My home-built Fair-Radio based charger actually proved to be
doing a pretty good job, and winds up hitting a max of 191.5 Volts at .3
Amps. (156 Volts nominal system) Data on the drive cycles has also been
logged, but only shows these batteries are toast. I should be putting in a
new set this week, so hopefully things should improve.
Basically, I can't see a whole lot of reason to log constantly, but for
diagnostic purposes it sure makes a handy setup. Even counting shipping I
probably only have about $60 in this whole setup (not counting the E-meter
of course). If you are buying a Link 10 / E-meter do yourself a favor and
get the serial port option. It may just prove handy.
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com My Electric Car at:
http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org Join the EV List at:
http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme position.
(Horace)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Letem DQ Tzero. LR..............
----- Original Message -----
From: "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 4:41 PM
Subject: Short range vehicles and speed records
In reading the 'press kit' for this January's centennial celebration in
Ormond Beach Florida of the land speed record of 127mph set in January
1906
by a Stanley Steamer, I find this statement interesting regarding races
after 1906:
"The rules for the Ormond Beach races were changed to exclude short
distance
steam racers"
Let that be a warning to you "short distance" electric speedsters going
against the gassers in bracket racing. Once you start winning, they'll
find
a way to ban you from competing. It happened a century ago shortly after
the birth of automobile drag racing when rules were barely in place. I
can
see it now: a requirement that you carry a minimum amount of joules
onboard
or else you're DQ'd.
-Myles Twete
Ormond Beach "Birthplace of Speed" centennial site:
http://www.birthplaceofspeed2006.com/
Press kit:
http://ormondbeach.org/news/Stanley/PressKit-StanleyBPOS2006.pdf
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Robert Chew wrote:
HI Mike,
I am interested in your data logging program. Mind sharing it. Or explaining
how to program something to datalog on either a palm pilot or laptop.
Cheers
Actually, Tim Nolan's article explains it far better than I ever
could. He also has a couple of small programs to parse the data and
add a time stamp. The article is available as a downloadable PDF at:
http://www.timnolan.com/hparticle/Nolan74.pdf
and includes links to the programs. I haven't used them yet, I just
used the HyperTerminal program that comes with Windows.
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
position. (Horace)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bravo!
that is very similar to what I was thinking of doing. except I wan't
gonna use vnc.
for the curious; I am gonna run linux with apache and write a daemon to
collect the data to a database. Then the car would use the wireless to
provide a web page I can point a browser to.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Anyone ever used the stock throttle position sensor in a conversion from
a fuel injected vehicle?
the benifits I can see are it would be designed for the throttle cable,
great springs,very robust, and the cruise control would connect to it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'd like to hear what you did on the software side. Recently I ran a
test of reading a radio shack meter with a serial port as a daemon in
linux. It worked fine except the data transmitted from the meter is
which elements on the display are on and the meter's resolution is
really too coarse for reading a shunt.
I discovered in windows it takes a fair amount of code to create a
"driver" as they run in "kernel space" but if you don't the program can
be eaisily ignored, shut down, corrupted. And if you do it must be
rebooted to install it or restart it. At least for development the
linux route is simpler, the daemon is startable and stoppable without
reboot because it runs in "user space", I can forego the gui(i found out
how to avoid the gui in windows also) and get a bootable system off of a
floppy( not possible wiht windows) or better a USB drive(no moving
parts) As a really wild idea, people are putting a small linux on used
linksys routers to serve out pages.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Another option is something like Siteplayer (http://
www.siteplayer.com/). Basically a webserver/ethernet on a stick
combo. It's been quite a while since I played with it but it was
pretty easy to make our fridge web-ified:
http://thehowzone.com/how/Refrigerating_The_Web
Of course if you have a whole computer w/network card this would be
redundant.
-Jerry
http://www.evconvert.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
FWIW ASUS makes a lot of cheap wireless routers, etc. that run Linux and
are reprogramable and can run Apache, etc. ASUS even provides information
and source code for rebuilding the kernel.
My favorite (right now) is the WL-HDD2.5, which is a device about the size
of a video cassett, that you install a 2.5" hdd in and it functions as
Network Attached Storage, FTP repository, web server (with reprogramming),
wireless access point or repeater, etc.
Oh yeah, as well as the ethernet port, it comes with a USB host adapter
port. Add a cheap USB to serial adapter and you can connect it to your
E-meter, or any other charger/controller with a serial interface.
I'm thinking it will make an excellent data collection tool for an EV.
Only down side is that it's getting a little hard to find them at
affordable prices. NewEgg used to carry them for $78, but apparently they
don't any more.
> Bravo!
> that is very similar to what I was thinking of doing. except I wan't
> gonna use vnc.
>
> for the curious; I am gonna run linux with apache and write a daemon to
> collect the data to a database. Then the car would use the wireless to
> provide a web page I can point a browser to.
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: Re: Short range vehicles and speed records
> Letem DQ Tzero. LR..............
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 4:41 PM
> Subject: Short range vehicles and speed records
>
>
> > In reading the 'press kit' for this January's centennial celebration in
> > Ormond Beach Florida of the land speed record of 127mph set in January
> > 1906
> > by a Stanley Steamer, I find this statement interesting regarding races
> > after 1906:
> > Hi All;
Didn't Fred Marriot run another Stanley there around 1909 and get
pretty close to 200 mph and crashed for his efforts?That record wasn't
official varifyed. Who'da thunk it back then?The car looked like an upside
down canue in the pix. The streamlining theory was in it;'s infancy, nobody
thought of a wing thing to help hold him down, at those speeds. After all,
nobody else had even come close to those speeds. Steam and electric trains
were only up in the 120's back then!
Siemans Electric had a test RR car,in Germany, a souped up trolley car, 3
phase, no less, that ran in the 120's, but it never cought on. Maybe to
control speed the power plant was speeded up to give it more RPM as it was
an AC car, and AC control stuff wasn't to todaze state of the art.
"The rules for the Ormond Beach races were changed to exclude short
> > distance
> > steam racers"
> >
Gees!? They had Racing Rules, back then?
OLD " He doesn't have any Stinkin' Pistons"!
> > Let that be a warning to you "short distance" electric speedsters going
> > against the gassers in bracket racing. Once you start winning, they'll
> > find
> > a way to ban you from competing. It happened a century ago shortly
after
> > the birth of automobile drag racing when rules were barely in place. I
> > can
> > see it now: a requirement that you carry a minimum amount of joules
> > onboard
> > or else you're DQ'd.
> >
> > -Myles Twete
> > Maybe they'll have moved into the New Century?
Seeya there!
Bob
> > Ormond Beach "Birthplace of Speed" centennial site:
> > http://www.birthplaceofspeed2006.com/
> > Press kit:
> > http://ormondbeach.org/news/Stanley/PressKit-StanleyBPOS2006.pdf
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In WIndoze you do not need to write a driver to read a serial port. Linux
is probably easier for those who are already familiar with it. If you want
some simple code to parse an RS Meter, let me know, I can send you mine, it
is in .Net though, as I use it for a GUI app.
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Shanab
Sent: December 1, 2005 5:50 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: RE: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
I'd like to hear what you did on the software side. Recently I ran a test
of reading a radio shack meter with a serial port as a daemon in linux. It
worked fine except the data transmitted from the meter is which elements on
the display are on and the meter's resolution is really too coarse for
reading a shunt.
I discovered in windows it takes a fair amount of code to create a "driver"
as they run in "kernel space" but if you don't the program can be eaisily
ignored, shut down, corrupted. And if you do it must be rebooted to install
it or restart it. At least for development the linux route is simpler, the
daemon is startable and stoppable without reboot because it runs in "user
space", I can forego the gui(i found out how to avoid the gui in windows
also) and get a bootable system off of a floppy( not possible wiht windows)
or better a USB drive(no moving
parts) As a really wild idea, people are putting a small linux on used
linksys routers to serve out pages.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm just loosely following this so apologies if I'm repeating other
ideas.
In the 90's when EVs were more popular, at least when the manufacturers
were making the EV-1, RAV-4 and Ranger EV, I heard complaints from EV
critics that EVers weren't paying their fair share of taxes for road
improvements which are generally collected through tax on gasoline.
They said we were taking a free ride on paying for road improvements.
But I don't understand the extra tax on hybrids. Hybrids still need gas
so they are already paying the tax and their mileage is still
comparable to the very high mileage gas cars which wouldn't be paying
the EXTRA tax. I was following a Prius the other day in my EV and it
turned into the Shell station. I thought at the time, "they still need
gas."
Once PHEVs become all the rage I'm sure the extra tax issue may become
more popular as these cars get closer to 150 mpg. As an argument, which
may be stretching it a bit, I would say that Hybrids and PHEVs are
saving the roads since they are reducing the need for heavy gas tanker
trucks to deliver fuel. Trucks cause much more stress on the roadways
then cars. If thousands of PHEVs were roaming the roads the demand for
gas deliveries would be less. I know, it is stretching it a bit, but
these anti-EV and hybrid interest groups are also stretching it as well.
I would fight any GPS tracking ideas. That's just big brother watching
and an invasion of personal rights and privacy, which in my opinion is
starting to get out of hand anyway. True, the technology is out there
and being used by trucking, delivery companies and for auto theft
prevention, which is understandable and voluntary in the case of using
LoJack. But to track thousands of private individuals in their cars,
the ACLU and privacy groups would jump right on it and I hope they do.
Chip
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don wrote -
>
> One thing I like to do is to take this data and bring it into excel a graph
> it. Good tool for seeing how much energy I use and regen I actually get on
> a particular trip.
>
Don,
How does one graph the data?
Thanks
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Calling all Electric and Hybrid Car Drivers: The Climate needs your
help!
Electric and Hybrid electric cars needed. 10 AM Saturday, December 3.
Rally near the White House. Assemble at MarcParc lot, 500 New York
Ave, 6th and K/Chinatown, and parade around the White House. World's
largest hybrid parade around the White House !!!!
Questions: Call Ann at CCAN (Chesapeak Climate Action Network,)
301-891-6844.
December 3rd is the international “US JOIN THE WORLD” day to push our
government to recognize and act upon global warming! The technology to
fight global warming is here today! Are you driving it?
If you own a hybrid, join CCAN on Saturday, Dec. 3rd, to show it in the
largest ever EV and hybrid car parade around the White House!
We all know that one of the biggest sources of air pollution and global
warming in America is automobile exhaust. Yet every year, Detroit makes
vehicles which, collectively, pollute more and more, even as affordable
clean engine technology abounds. Now’s your chance to say "Enough is
enough!" We need to join the world in fighting global warming by
starting right here, at home, by supporting federal and state clean car
legislation.
If you or someone you know is an electric or hybrid-electric driver and
would like to have a ton of fun for a good cause on December 3rd,
please contact us and we’ll give you the full details.
The rally will begin at 10:00 am at a location near the White House
with a rally, followed by the EV and hybrid car parade.
For more information, contact Anne Havemann, 301-891-6844,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To start the clean energy revolution and save the climate, we need
EVERYONE to get involved. Here’s a fun and easy way.
Chip Gribben
Electric Vehicle Association of Washington DC
http://www.evadc.org
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Mike Chancey wrote:
> My Civic EV conversion is equipped with an E-meter with the optional
> serial port. I had planned since I built the car in 1999 to try some
> data logging, but it never seemed to work... discovered the problem.
Glad to hear you got it working. Don't forget to get that optoisolator
installed! All exposed metal on the laptop (rear connectors, etc.) will be
tied to the propulsion battery pack negative until you do!
> Data is being captured and logged using HyperTerminal. Even with the
> tiny (720 Mb) hard drive and letting it log once per second, the data
> files have not been unreasonably large.
There are several programs floating around to read E-meter data. I use one I
wrote myself in QuickBASIC.
This bears on a debate we've been having on the evtech list.
Some say the E-meter's format (comma-delimited ASCII) is good because it is
easy to read and save with standard programs like Hyperterminal, and it can
be viewed and manipulated by Word or Excel.
Others say this is pointless; nobody will look at the raw data. There will be
a dedicated program to read, save, and manipulate data. Therefore, the format
should be something cryptic, but compact and efficient.
What are people's thoughts? Would you prefer a generic format for a "data
output" from EV accessories like the E-meter, chargers, controllers, battery
monitors, etc? Or, would you prefer to have special application programs to
read the data (which presumably you'd pay extra for)?
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Robert Chew wrote:
> I am interested in your data logging program. Mind sharing it. Or
> explaining how to program something to datalog on either a palm pilot or
> laptop.
I can email my QuickBASIC program to you (or anyone else who wants it). It
reads the E-meter data, displays a simple graph, and can print or save it on
disk. It compresses the data file by only saving sudden changes or the
average over many minutes. Contact me off-list. You'll need some version of
Microsoft BASIC to run it, which they supplied as part of DOS until version
6.22.
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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On Dec 1, 2005, at 9:15 AM, Lee Hart wrote:
What are people's thoughts? Would you prefer a generic format for a
"data
output" from EV accessories like the E-meter, chargers,
controllers, battery
monitors, etc? Or, would you prefer to have special application
programs to
read the data (which presumably you'd pay extra for)?
Both?
Seriously, if the device has enough smarts you could offer a terminal
command to toggle output mode. Default to the compact, binary
format. For someone troubleshooting their connection/software a
readable output can be a godsend.
That or when the Enter key is pressed spit out a few lines of
readable text.
-Jerry
http://www.evconvert.com/
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All of this talk data logging has me thinking about my lowly little E-
meter without the optional RS-232 interface.
I sent an email to xantrex, but no response yet. Is it possible to
buy/add the RS-232 interface to an existing unit? Or is it a whole
new system inside?
If it's just a matter of making a data level to RS-232 converter then
I'll crack it open and do it myself.
Thanks!
-Jerry
http://www.evconvert.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> This bears on a debate we've been having on the evtech list.
>
> Some say the E-meter's format (comma-delimited ASCII) is good because it
> is easy to read and save with standard programs like Hyperterminal, and
> it can be viewed and manipulated by Word or Excel.
>
> Others say this is pointless; nobody will look at the raw data. There will
> be a dedicated program to read, save, and manipulate data. Therefore, the
> format should be something cryptic, but compact and efficient.
What would be the point in making it cryptic and compact if you're not
going to save the raw data? Speed isn't an issue, so you might as well
make it easy to read and manipulate, just in case someone wants to.
The program that reads/manipulates the data can save it in a
compac/cryptic format if they want too.
Besides the commas can help maintain data integrity. It's easy to tell
when you loose a bit/byte because you KNOW that a comma should be in
position x.
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
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jerry halstead wrote:
> All of this talk data logging has me thinking about my lowly little
> E-meter without the optional RS-232 interface... Is it possible to
> buy/add the RS-232 interface to an existing unit?
The standard E-meter has the same PC boards as the ones with the RS-232
option. The software is already in place, and working. All they do is leave a
few parts off the PC board.
You can add them yourself, but most are tiny surface-mount parts. Going by
memory, I think it takes an LT1081 TTL-to-RS232 driver, four 0.1uf
capacitors, and the 9-pin D connector.
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Hi Everybody,
We added two race reports to www.ProEV.com last week. One is from our May 15
autocross with video, pictures and graphs. The other is from our first road
race at the Homestead-Miami Speedway. We had some problems with a weird
unintended acceleration glitch. Any opinions would be appreciated.
http://www.proev.com/P1RaceH.htm
BTW We have not posted a 2006 schedule yet but we are planning to be at both
the autocross and drag race at Battery Beach Burnout Jan 20-21 at Moroso
Motorsports Park (http://www.batterybeach.com/). Looking forward to seeing
lots of EVers there!
Cliff
www.ProEV.com
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BOY ... I hope Rick or some one gets back to the NY Post, and get's them
to print some corrections....
Like.... The car came from Spokane Washigton
and .... Production Models will not cost $85,000.
and.... George LOVES his Custom Made Tango car !
(I have been talking to Bill Moore of EV-World, and with all his
connections, trying to get Bill to track down George for an INTERVIEW
and Report on how George likes his car ..but I guess he's a pritty busy
guy... Two movies in one year )
Rick Woodbury said:
>> I got a call from a fellow in NY yesterday who saw an article on
George >> Clooney's Tango in the NY Post.
I can't find the NY Post article online, but Google News dug up this one
from UPI, posted yesterday:
http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?StoryID=20051129-012906-5730r
This is the first report I've seen of Clooney's Tango from a mainstream
(non-EV-related) source.
--chris
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
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That is, if one were to affix non-reversable temperature dots to battery
terminals, what would be "too warm" of a temperature?
From reading the posts, and common sense, it seems that a temperature
that's a little above the maximum ambient in your area would be
appropriate. Maybe 125°?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 07:50 AM 12/1/2005, you wrote:
I'd like to hear what you did on the software side. Recently I ran a
test of reading a radio shack meter with a serial port as a daemon in
linux. It worked fine except the data transmitted from the meter is
which elements on the display are on and the meter's resolution is
really too coarse for reading a shunt.
I discovered in windows it takes a fair amount of code to create a
"driver" as they run in "kernel space" but if you don't the program can
be eaisily ignored, shut down, corrupted. And if you do it must be
rebooted to install it or restart it. At least for development the
linux route is simpler, the daemon is startable and stoppable without
reboot because it runs in "user space", I can forego the gui(i found out
how to avoid the gui in windows also) and get a bootable system off of a
floppy( not possible wiht windows) or better a USB drive(no moving
parts) As a really wild idea, people are putting a small linux on used
linksys routers to serve out pages.
I just found this program (DLL) and have not had any chance to look into
how well it works but anyone trying to do low level IO operations from
Windows may want to look into it. The description sounds interesting and
the price is hard to beat, unless you want the source code.
http://www.geekhideout.com/iodll.shtml
__________
Andre' B. Clear Lake, Wi.
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EMeter puts out an ascii, comma delimited file. Capture this in
hyperterminal and save to a file. Open excel and open the file. Select the
columns you want to graph, click the graph con, select line graph.
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Rush
Sent: December 1, 2005 7:12 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
Don wrote -
>
> One thing I like to do is to take this data and bring it into excel a
> graph it. Good tool for seeing how much energy I use and regen I
> actually get on a particular trip.
>
Don,
How does one graph the data?
Thanks
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
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--- Begin Message ---
If people really did not want to use the ASCII coming from devices like
this, Fluke would not make their device 87A ASCII, nor EMeter, nor a
plethora of other RS232 devices.
Use ASCII CSV to communicate between the data capture device and the
dedicated tool (hardware display, software program). Then for those of us
who want to do further analysis or our own custom hardware, we can always
intercept the CSV.
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: December 1, 2005 6:16 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: A Dumb Old Laptop Can Be Pretty Slick Tool
Mike Chancey wrote:
> My Civic EV conversion is equipped with an E-meter with the optional
> serial port. I had planned since I built the car in 1999 to try some
> data logging, but it never seemed to work... discovered the problem.
Glad to hear you got it working. Don't forget to get that optoisolator
installed! All exposed metal on the laptop (rear connectors, etc.) will be
tied to the propulsion battery pack negative until you do!
> Data is being captured and logged using HyperTerminal. Even with the
> tiny (720 Mb) hard drive and letting it log once per second, the data
> files have not been unreasonably large.
There are several programs floating around to read E-meter data. I use one I
wrote myself in QuickBASIC.
This bears on a debate we've been having on the evtech list.
Some say the E-meter's format (comma-delimited ASCII) is good because it is
easy to read and save with standard programs like Hyperterminal, and it can
be viewed and manipulated by Word or Excel.
Others say this is pointless; nobody will look at the raw data. There will
be a dedicated program to read, save, and manipulate data. Therefore, the
format should be something cryptic, but compact and efficient.
What are people's thoughts? Would you prefer a generic format for a "data
output" from EV accessories like the E-meter, chargers, controllers, battery
monitors, etc? Or, would you prefer to have special application programs to
read the data (which presumably you'd pay extra for)?
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
