EV Digest 5665
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: S10 model curb weight(s)
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) EVLN(I'll convert any car for $14k)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) EVLN(Ocean City nEVs in just about any color that you want)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) EVLN(Myers Motors' new NmG: No more Gas)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Exhibitor Staff needed for NEDRA at RPM Tradeshow
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: AC output to rectifier
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Funky Optimas
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) More on the NEDRA Late Night Nationals
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Vectrix giving test rides in Washington DC tomorrow, July 20
by "Charles Whalen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Interesting article on the EV1 and customer support...
by "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Front Wheel bearing grease comparison
by Mike Phillips <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: 1991 G-Van on Ebay, in Mesa, AZ
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Electriccars.com on eBay
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Interesting article on the EV1 and customer support...
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Interesting article on the EV1 and customer support...
by "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: AC output to rectifier
by Steve Condie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Mike wrote:
> In the back of my mind I suspect when I'm done
> experimenting that I'll have the same pack and
> box config as you have.
Some like the scenic route ;-}
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Mike Phillips
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 5:54 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: S10 model curb weight(s)
Cor,
Those scales are just 4 blocks from work. But 28 miles round trip from
home. My range is 14 miles under ideal conditions. Hmmm. I checked
across the outlets at work and found 208vac. Maybe it's time to rid the
truck of the 1300+ lbs of dead lead in the box. That might effect the
range a tiny bit ;)
The fact that Steve and you have the same batterys will make for an
interesting comparison. I guess it's literally a race to the death, of
your packs. Last one there wins. The other big difference will be how
low the soc goes for each of you on average. In the back of my mind I
suspect when I'm done experimenting that I'll have the same pack and
box config as you have.
Mike
--- Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>
> The local Sunnyvale "dump" called SMaRT-station:
>
http://www.sunnyvale.ca.gov/Departments/Public+Works/Solid+Waste+and+Recycli
> ng/SMaRT+Station/
>
> >From 101 take Lawrence north (or if you are coming from Mountain
> view side
> then get off at Mathilda north, past the Lockheed facilities, this
> road becomes Caribbean, make a left at Borregas and bear right to
> Carl)
> http://maps.yahoo.com/maps_result?addr=301+Carl&csz=Sunnyvale+CA
> It is really as close to the bay as you can get on public roads.
>
> Following Lawrence north you pass under 237 and the name changes to
> Caribbean. Make a right at Borregas and bear right onto Carl.
> The scales are at both sides of the street, open 24/7 and it is free
> as long as you do not need paperwork (you need to write down your
> weight
> from the LED display next to the scale).
> Accuracy is in 20 lbs steps if I recall correctly.
>
> I think there are also scales alongside 880, but they are often
> closed
> and I do not recall where they are exactly, so I do not know if they
> are closer to your place.
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Mike Phillips
> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 10:34 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: S10 model curb weight(s)
>
>
> Cor,
>
> What part of town is the scale located in?
>
> Mike
>
>
>
> --- Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Michael,
> >
> > Forgot that you wanted the weights:
> > My 1994 US Electricar S10 weighs 4880 lbs
> > including a pack of 26 batteries of almost 71 lbs each,
> > which brings the weight sans pack at just a tad over 3000 lbs.
> > This includes a 1/4" or so wall thickness aluminum box,
> > a 50 kW Hughes AC motor on the manual gearbox, beefed up springs,
> > the original long bed (standard cab) and steering column shifter
> > (from the automatic) because it is a "single gear" drive,
> > a large 700V 250A AC drive with water-cooling through the
> > original radiator, Power Steering pump, Vacuum braking pump
> > and a foot-long 3-phase 208V 90Amp inductor for the famous
> > fast-charging and Vehicle-to-grid that this controller is capable
> of
> > but that I never use because I have no 3-phase 208V service.
> >
> > Note: because this controller is capable of at least 50kW, it
> > could theoretically charge at 50kW but also supply 50kW to the
> > grid. However, the AVCON connector cannot sustain the currents,
> > even though it is modified to 3 large pins, so the grid power
> > has been limited to 20kW.
> >
> > My EV album listing has the Front and rear axle weights
> > (when going over to the recycling station I could simply
> > stop at the weighing bridge, make a note of the weight,
> > drive forward until only one axle was on the bridge and
> > make another note and turn around. Real simple to get to
> > know the total and per-axle weights....
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Systems Architect
> > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> > Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
> > Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Michael Mohlere
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 8:07 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: RE: S10 model curb weight(s)
> >
> >
> > Steven -
> >
> > Thanks for the input!!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > >From: "Steven Potter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >Reply-To: [email protected]
> > >To: <[email protected]>
> > >Subject: RE: S10 model curb weight(s)
> > >Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 19:13:18 -0400
> > >
> > >Point of reference:
> > >
> > >I recently put my stock '98 Ranger on a truck scale
> (pre-conversion;
> > >full gas tank) = 3320 lbs.
> > >
> > >That total included a fiberglass bed cover which I weighted
> > separately
> > >at 115 lbs.
> > >
> > >I'm guessing the bed/tailgate must add about 350 lbs or more. My
> > >conversion plans at this point include selling the bed and cover;
> > >fabricating a light weight, aerodynamic, tilt up flat bed as a
> > >replacement.
> > >
> > >Steven Potter, Toronto
> > >
> > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >On
> > > > Behalf Of Michael Mohlere
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone have the "curb weights" of the various years the
> S10
> > was
> > > > produced?? Obviously, I am looking for the "lightest" S10 (reg
> > cab,
> > >short
> > > > bed), and am fairly sure it was not one of the recent
> > incarnations of
> > >same
> > > > -
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > >Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > >Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/389 - Release Date:
> > >7/14/2006
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> Here's to the crazy ones.
> The misfits.
> The rebels.
> The troublemakers.
> The round pegs in the square holes.
> The ones who see things differently
> The ones that change the world!!
>
> www.RotorDesign.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(I'll convert any car for $14k)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/features/20060715-9999-lz1dd15curren.html
Workshop teaches how to convert gasoline-fueled cars to battery
power
By Mark Maynard UNION-TRIBUNE WHEELS EDITOR July 15, 2006
[...]
[The] electric car is not dead, according to 30 cal and
out-of-town enthusiasts and teachers who attended a recent
workshop at San Dieguito High School Academy to learn how to
convert gasoline-fueled cars to battery power.
Thirty EV converts in a city of 1,255,240 might not seem
noteworthy, but consider that last year's workshop in Turlock
drew six students. Applicants for this year's program exceeded
class capacity.
The workshop, limited to 20 participants, filled up during the
first week of enrollment and applications were still arriving
from across the country, says Abran Quevedo, master automotive
technology instructor at San Dieguito Academy. The 10-day program
concluded June 30 after a 1990 Volkswagen Cabriolet was converted
to run on 18 lead-acid batteries. It has a range of 50 to 60
miles and a top speed of nearly 110 mph, Quevedo says. The
battery pack costs about $1,300 and will last three years or
longer depending on use.
The cost to build a battery-powered car ranges from $6,000 for a
basic conversion to $12,000 for one like the project car, which
has more power and features.
The project car could be driven daily, but will be used mainly to
showcase the technology at workshops and seminars.
Most participants were from San Diego County and California.
Others traveled from Ohio, Oregon, Arizona, Pennsylvania and
Florida. Among them, a father and son, a son-in-law and
father-in-law, two women, retirees, college students and some who
took time off from work.
Out-of-towners arranged their own transportation and lodging to
attend the program.
George Owayang, 53, drove his 1995 Toyota Tercel overnight from
San Francisco and arrived for the 8 a.m. start of the workshop,
with no sleep and no hotel reservations.
I wanted to get my feet wet, get the basics, he says. I don't
have the money to build a car, but I'm into alternative energy.
Basically, I'm an environmentalist.
Electric vehicles used to be the transportation of choice for
environmentalists. Today, newcomers are motivated by the high
cost of gasoline and even patriotism, hoping to help break the
United States' addiction to imported oil.
Dave Cutter of Carlsbad hosts the Village Energy Web page of
www.pleiades-enterprises.com , which promotes electric vehicles
and posts industry news. He says electric vehicles are redefining
patriotism.
A commitment to clean energy would reduce pollution, create
millions of high-tech jobs, diversify our energy sources, add to
global energy security and save billions of dollars, Cutter
says. He uses an electric bike or electric scooter as daily
transportation and occasionally drives his 1987 BMW 325, which
gets good gas mileage, but is normally covered up and left unused
in my driveway, he says.
Today, while the market for a production-line electric car is
dead, there is a grass-roots movement for home-built EVs.
When I joined the Electric Vehicle Association of [San] Diego (in
1998), we met in a room with about eight or 10 people and now we
meet with 30, says Bill Hammons, the first consumer to buy a
Ford Escape hybrid SUV and who before that drove a Ford Ranger EV
and a Ford Think [nEV] golf cart.
Hammons, who attended the workshop, says interest in EVs has
peaks that follow gasoline prices and Earth Day awareness. Even
the movie Who Killed the Electric Car? will generate a
reaction, he says.
As people become more aware and informed, iseems that they become
interested, Hammons says.
Dave Turbey, a social worker and a backyard mechanic from
Florida, attended with his son, Josh, 16. One day I started
calculating the costs of driving and realized I could save some
money with an electric car, Dave Turbey says.
Charles Beinecke, who came from central Ohio, says he is building
a do-it-yourself workshop on his 10-acre farm that will be
powered entirely by battery, wind and solar sources. He hopes to
set up a range [of] shops to work with wind and solar power,
biodiesel and ethanol and electric vehicles, including carts and
small vehicles for disabled users.
You can actually do something for yourself with this, Beinecke
says of the workshop.
Some of the participants are car enthusiasts, but most don't know
anything about working on cars. Some are veteran EV owners and at
least one participant has solar arrays at home and on the vehicle
to collect free energy.
The workshop was designed for the novice. The class, which had an
initial fee of $300, was later made free by a grant.
Instructional materials were included on the how-to process and
lunch was provided, with a modest donation requested.
At the workshop held in the high school's auto shop, students
were given a hands-on experience. The conversion parts were laid
out on worktables and there were two vehicles to be worked on. A
beat-up VW Cabriolet was used as a demonstrator to show fitment
of parts and to scavenge parts, then the final work was applied
to a painted and detailed car.
Several reference books are available as teaching guides. And
there are kits to adapt electric motors to various car models,
including sports cars and small pickups.
The workshop was sponsored by the San Diego County Regional
Occupation Program with endorsements by the California Industrial
Technology and Education Association and the Electric Vehicle
Association of San Diego.
Next year's program will be held in a rural area of California,
possibly the Imperial Valley, instructor Quevedo says.
He plans to develop more funding sources. Some of this year's
program was supported by school bake sales and the parent
foundation. A grant for $8,000 covered most of the major parts
but not a complete kit, which required the time-consuming
fabrication of some parts.
Quevedo hopes to start the next class with $30,000, which would
also help cover a stipend.
He's also seeking the donation of a Chevy S-10 pickup, aractical
vehicle for rural users.
Moving the workshop to a variety of locales helps spread the
word, says co-instructor Mike Parker, who organized and taught
the first workshop last year.
Parker's goal is to see EV conversion shops as prevalent as
paint-and-body shops in every city.
If you remember the old Earl Sheib ad line, 'I'll paint any car
for $29.95.' Mine would be, 'I'll convert any car for $13,995,'
he says.
If we could roll this out to 2 percent of the vehicle population,
using used-car bodies, we would be doing more than the millions
of dollars spent in grants to study air pollution, he says.
Every EV on the road is a step in the right direction.
Mark Maynard is driving in cyberspace at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] .
RESOURCES FOR ELECTRIC-VEHICLE ENTHUSIASTS
BOOKS
Build Your Own Electric Vehicle,; by Bob Brant, 310 pages with
illustrations. Textbook covers every subject, $13; published
1994.
Convert It, by Michael Brown with Shari Prange, third edition,
128 pages with illustrations. Conversion process explained step
by step; $25; published 1993.
The New Electric Vehicles, by Michael M. Hackleman, 272 pages
with 465 photos. Conversions, solar cars, boats, planes; $75;
published 1996.
COMPONENTS AND SYSTEMS
www.kta-ev.com
www.evworld.com
www.evparts.com/about/index.php
www.metricmind.com
www.electroauto.com
www.go-ev.com
www.ev-america.com
www.austinev.org/evtradinpost
MEETING
The Electric Vehicle Association of San Diego meets the fourth
Tuesday of the month, 7 p.m., San Diego Regional Transportation
Center (in the Autotorium, Interstate 15 and 4100 El Cajon
Boulevard). The July 25 meeting will have a follow-up of the EV
conversion workshop and a video of Monster Garage building an
EV racecar using 420 power-tool batteries.
Meetings are held January through November. Free. Information and
newsletter: www.evaosd.com .
EV WORKSHOP WEB SITE
www.campbellot.com/electric%20vehicle/little%20red.htm
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Ocean City nEVs in just about any color that you want)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.mdcoastdispatch.com/electriccars071406.html
Electric Cars Proposed For Use In Ocean City
Jacob Cook Staff Writer 07/13/2006
OCEAN CITY With bicycles, scooters, surreys, banana bikes,
mopeds and Segways offering alternative transportation at the
beach, will street legal electric vehicles, similar to a golf
cart in size, be the latest fad or the wave of the future?
During the Ocean City Mayor and Council meeting on Tuesday
afternoon, CleanCities.com President and Founder Luis D.
MacDonald unveiled a vehicle that has taken beach communities
around the country by storm recently. MacDonalds company is
spreading the word about GEMs Global Electric Motorcars made
by Daimler Chrysler and he wants the resort area to jump
onboard.
We are the first GEM dealership in the State of Maryland, said
MacDonald. The vehicle has really been embraced by many
communities.
Several town officials and employees were originally introduced
to the emission-free, all-electric vehicle during a Police
Commission meeting. When MacDonald told resort officials he
intended to open a business in conjunction with local communities
to shuttle people from their properties to the beach, employees
from several city departments conducted a further review of the
product.
In Maryland, GEMs are legal on streets with a posted speed limit
of 30 mph or less. But, town officials have the right to
eliminate any problematic areas, regardless of posted speed
limit. State law also allows the electric minicab to cross at
intersections where the posted speed limit does not exceed 45
mph, which includes Coastal Highway. The vehicles are equipped
with more safety features than a typical golf cart, though they
are similar in size, with seatbelts, horns and lights.
Ocean City Superintendent of Public Works Maintenance Bruce Gibbs
said two supervisors rode around in the vehicle for a week and he
did not appear overly thrilled about the ride.
We did use this for a week, he said. The turning radius is
really bad.
>From an operational standpoint, the GEM was not practical for
many of the duties his department performs around town, Gibbs
said. The electric car would be an asset during special events
and other functions, but it did not keep up with traffic on the
road and turning was difficult, according to Gibbs.
Another review came from Ocean City Police Department Acting
Lieutenant Brian Cardamone, who reported no concerns over the
vehicle because operating one is already legal under state law,
but making sure an operator followed the proper rules and
regulations would be enforced, he said.
We think that its a good idea, its legal in Maryland and we
dont have a problem with it, Cardamone said. They cannot be
used on highways with a posted speed limit above 30 mph.
Throughout his research, however, Cardamone learned the vehicles
could be dangerous, saying, There are accident situations and
there are fatalities with these.
Council President Jim Hall, who expressed an interest in allowing
property owners in resort communities, such as Little Salisbury
and Montego Bay, to use golf carts and other modes of
transportation for minimal everyday tasks, was enthusiast about
the GEMs potential.
It seems to me, listening to the police department, we dont have
to do anything, said Hall. This is great. I love it. We look
forward to you coming down here and opening a franchise. I think
its great and I hope people expand into this.
Montego Bay Civic Association President James Walker said his
community would not be opposed to allowing the electric cars
because they are already legal under state law. Having a license
plate and proper safety equipment makes the potential widespread
use of the GEM more desirable than a scooter or golf cart, Walker
said.
We wouldnt have any problem because theyre street legal, he
said.
However, Councilman Lloyd Martin, representing Caine Woods, said
though he did not foresee a problem, property owners in that area
had expressed some concerns.
I talked to some people in Caine Woods and they had some mixed
feelings about it, said Martin.
Whether the vehicle will get a standing ovation or thumbs down
from people in the area is yet to be determined. The electric car
reaches speeds around 25 mph, travels about 35 miles on a full
charge and costs upwards of $10,000 for many two- and
four-passenger models.
They are economically safe with zero emission. You can order
these vehicles in just about any color that you want, MacDonald
said.
All material copyright 2006 The Maryland Coast Dispatch, Berlin,
MD. Questions, comments, contact us at
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Myers Motors' new NmG: No more Gas)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/business/15027459.htm
Posted on Thu, Jul. 13, 2006 Local electric cars finally at
starting line
Highway-legal car with 30-mile range between charges aims for
niche;
Tallmadge firm plans new model in '07 By Sarah Filus
Dana Myers, the president of Myers Motors, sits in the driver's
seat of one of the company's electric cars Friday July 7, 2006 in
Tallmadge, Ohio. (Karen Schiely/Akron Beacon Journal)
More photosart car, part motorcycle, Myers Motors' new NmG (No
more Gas) vehicle certainly is one thing: energy-efficient.
Manufactured entirely in a South Avenue facility in Tallmadge,
the NmG is the nation's only all-electric, highway-legal vehicle
that can hit 70 mph and costs less than $25,000, said Dana Myers,
founder and president of Myers Motors.
The road to that achievement has had plenty of twists and turns.
Myers came up with the idea to produce electric cars after
reading a book called The Innovator's Dilemma. He thought it
would be a good change for his family business, S.D. Myers, which
services and repairs large electric transformers.
In 2004, Myers bought California-based Corbin Motors, which, at
the time, made the three-wheeled electric Sparrow vehicle.
Myers planned to redesign the Sparrow and release his creation
with a new name before the end of that year.
It took longer than expected.
``We were 18 months late,'' said Myers, who sold the first NmG in
May. ``I've never been in the business, and there is always a
learning curve. There is no highway-legal electric car like this,
so sometimes we had to manufacture our own parts. It takes
time.''
Myers also had to move manufacturing from California to
Tallmadge.
The process was completed in mid-2005. ``It took a little while.
I should have just brought it all here to begin with.''
Now that his vehicles are on the road, Myers can take a breath. A
little one.
Myers Motors isn't in the clear yet, said Bob Oldham, editor of
the newsletter for the Electric Auto Association and a
special-effects designer at the Science Museum of Virginia. He
also owns a hybrid car.
A number of producers have tried and failed in ventures to
maintain electric car lines. Sebring/Vanguard's CitiCar of the
1970s failed after the oil crisis ended, and GM's EV-1 cars,
featured in Sony Pictures' Who Killed the Electric Car?
documentary, were recalled and crushed.
Oldham said Corbin Sparrows didn't sell well.
``The public perception of electric cars is that they will do
everything, and they don't. They are niche cars, and they need to
be sold as niche cars,'' he said.
``Corbin didn't really push the issue that the Sparrow was a
niche car. The NmG is exactly the same, but with suspension
improvements and brake improvements. It does what it does
extremely well, but if they don't sell it differently, they
aren't going to make it very long.''
Myers' view
Myers said shrinking oil supplies and high gas prices, along with
public concerns about global warming, will contribute to his
eye-catching car's success.
``Corbin sold vehicles for half of what it cost to make them, and
they relied on their investors too much. They paved the way when
they started from scratch. We started from there and improved the
design.''
Myers said he has sold 10 or 11 NmGs to customers in Columbus and
Cleveland, Wisconsin, Florida, California and New York.
Because of limited production capacity, Myers Motors sells the
cars directly, online, Myers said.
He is still trying to add features such as air conditioning to
the NmG. The miniature, fully enclosed vehicle costs $24,900,
comes in a variety of colors, and includes a heater, an audio
system and power windows.
Satisfied NmG owner
Al Strauss, 63, of Westlake, bought an NmG last fall and got it
from the factory this spring. After a test drive, he said, he was
hooked.
What he enjoys most about the vehicle is the attention it draws.
``The attention is enormous. I have the name of my company on the
side with the phone number. We will get three to five calls when
I drive to downtown Cleveland from home, and the same on the way
back. Of course, the calls are about the car and not my
business,'' he said.
``Everyone that is under 30 will give you a wave or a thumbs-up
sign. The younger they are, the more in tune they seem to be with
the environment.''
The NmG battery runs for 30 miles before it needs to be plugged
in and recharged using a normal plug. Charging takes four to six
hours. Each mile of electricity costs about 2 cents.
``People are spending hundreds of millions of dollars on battery
development for things like iPods and Game Boys,'' Strauss said.
``I decided to get in the market and get started with what is out
there, and better capabilities will eventually come along.''
Commuter vehicle
Most people drive fewer than 12 miles to work, so the NmG can be
useful for commuters, he said. It also can be driven in a
high-occupancy-vehicle lane.
Strauss uses his NmG three or four days a week to run errands and
go to and from work. ``They are perfect cars if you are commuting
and you know you are only going 30 miles. They are good for
second, third, fourth cars in the household,'' he said. ``I bet
it saves me 50 bucks a week in gas.''
Myers Motors is developing a new model of electric vehicle to be
released next spring. Myers wouldn't disclose the details but
said he hopes to sell between 400 and 600.
Myers Motors has eight employees. It plans to hire 15 to 20
employees for the project, Myers said.
He said he is also trying to drop the price of his vehicles below
$20,000.
Sarah Filus can be reached at 330-996-3838 or
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chip Gribben wrote:
The event is an engine rebuilding trade show. The NHRA, IHRA will be the
other associations there. Guest speakers will include Don "Snake"
Prudhome (sp?) and other drag racing legends.
Just a couple more points to entice EV drag racers to help man the booth at
the show ...
Not only will Don "The Snake" Prudhomme be there, Shirley Muldowney is the
keynote speaker on the first day, Don Shumacher on the second day.
The following is available to exhibitors...
After the first day's show there is a dinner and get together with all the
industry folks.
After the second day's show there is indoor cart racing at what is called
America's best indoor cart track.
After the third day's shows... free tickets to the top fuel and funny car
qualifying rounds at the Mac Tools U.S. Nationals, the world's largest drag
racing event.
Download show brochure here:
http://www.aera.org/rpm/attend/downloads/RPM6_brochure.pdf
We would like to have folks that are fluent in the language of both EV's and
ICE drag racing in order to communicate effectively with all the
racers/engine builders.
...
Roy LeMeur
NEDRA NW Regional Race Director
My EV and RE Project Pages-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steve Condie wrote:
<snip> Then, I read on the EVDL archives, that a fan dimmer
would be better, since it doesn't have a DC component.
Quote Dave Roden year 2001: "The problem is that a light dimmer isn't
built for the application. They don't worry about minimizing any DC
in the output, because light bulbs work equally well on AC or DC...
so I went out to look at my dim boy... transformer... If it was above
room temperature I couldn't tell by touching it.
It was good to do a quickie test, under "typical" conditions with one
particular dimmer. It came out good -- so you didn't have the "DC on the
windings" problem in this particular case.
It could be because your particular dimmer didn't produce a DC output
current. Some do, some don't -- the balance between the two half-cycles
isn't controlled in dimmers intended to run ordinary light bulbs.
It could be that your dimmer never ran anything close to full primary
current into the transformer, so even with its DC component, the total
current was still within the transformer's capabilities. Suppose the
transformer is wound for 1 amp of primary current. Your dimmer is set
very low, and delivers 0.1 amp of AC and 0.5 amp of DC current. That's a
huge DC offset (5:1), but the total is still well under the
transformer's ratings.
Finally, there may be some peculiarities in your circuit that help. Is
your circuit like this? (View with a fixed-width font):
AC_____________
hot | | battery charger
|_ _| transformer
_| || |_
120vac _| || |_ 12vac
_| || |_ bridge rectifier
| | _____
__|__ |______|AC +|_____+
| _ | | |
| (_) |dimmer | | battery pack
|_____| | |
AC____|_______________|AC -|_____-
neutral |_____|
The bridge circuit on the 12v secondary keeps the transformer loaded at
all times. It acts as a "snubber" across the coils, to reset the core
back to zero at each zero-crossing of the AC line. A mechanical analogy
is a governor on a flywheel to keep it accelerating until it explodes.
This keeps the transformer's core loss from reaching ruinous levels. In
effect, it works somewhat like a flyback converter, which deliberately
puts a pulse of DC into the primary of a transformer, but then extracts
an equivalent pulse of DC from the secondary to reset the core.
But you still have to worry about excessive DC in the primary of the
transformer; if it current gets too high, it will burn up the winding
from simple resistive heating. The simplest way to protect against this
is to put a fuse in series with the primary of the transformer; it will
blow before the winding is damaged.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ralph Merwin wrote:
The voltage was up quite high, at about 16.3 volts or so.
That's way too high! There's no reason to go this high.
I'm curious if the two venting batteries just have bad vent seals?
Yes, they could. A bad vent seal prevents the internal pressure from
rising, so it vents much easier and has a much lower recombination rate.
This of course makes it vent all the more.
Check the seal between the cover and case. I've seen a number of Optimas
where this seal was broken (could lift the top in one spot or another
with gently upward pressure). These had gotten broken by dropping the
battery into the battery box such that its top snagged on the adjacent
battery, and broke the seal as it fell.
is it possible that one battery in a pair can get into the sort of
trouble that would cause it to vent but not it's mate?
Yes, that's easy. They can be at different temperatures, or different
states of charge, or different ages or conditions.
These are Optima Yellow Tops, so I can weigh them but adding water or
checking specific gravity is probably not an option.
You can't check specific gravity, but you *can* add water. I did it by
drilling a hole for a #6 screw, threaded the hole, added water, then
plugged the hole with a #6 nylon screw.
I suspect the charger timed out before the voltage hit the E-Meter's set
point. The current is typically below an amp around this time.
That doesn't sound right if you were seeing over 16v per battery.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Folks
We are anticipating much more media attention than has been seen in the past
for a NEDRA EVent.
John Wayland wrote:
As he got out of the car (White Zombie), one of the first things he said
was, That does it, Im coming back for the Portland EV Drag races in
August! In my head I said, Mission accomplished!
John is talking about Chris Paine, the director of WKTEC. Chris also said he
would be bringing a film crew to document the EVent.
Also... an Australian film crew from their version of PBS has said they will
be there to document the EVent.
www.sbs.com.au/dateline
Many folks from local media outlets are also expected to be there.
Other activities surrounding the races include a brunch and EV
display/show-and-tell at a local Portland restaurant (The Village Inn) on
the 26th, an "Awards" brunch the morning of the 27th, and lots of hanging
out and wrenching on race vehicles at the Wayland Juice Bar.
So... the purpose of this shameless promotion is to motivate those
racers/spectators who may not normally consider towing/traveling long
distances to be there.
It would be nice to see a record number of participants
at this EVent.
I would appreciate it if folks bringing a vehicle to compete with would let
me know they are planning to attend.
roylemeur _at_ hotmail _dot_ com
360 556 2105
Cya at the races!
Roy LeMeur
NEDRA NW Regional Race Director
My EV and RE Project Pages-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Vectrix (www.vectrixusa.com) will be offering test rides of its electric
maxi-scooter in Washington, DC tomorrow, July 20, from 9am to 2pm at
Garfield Circle, in front of the Botanical Gardens, just off Independence
Ave. at the bottom (west side) of Capitol Hill. Congressmen, Senators, and
their staffs will be among those taking test rides, but the event is open to
the public and all are welcome to take the bike for a ride (although
strictly speaking, legally you're supposed to have a motorcycle license to
ride it). I am told that the bike Vectrix will be bringing to DC tomorrow
is one of the 50 final production version bikes that just rolled off the
assembly line last month in Vectrix's Massachusetts factory, not one of the
18 earlier hand-built prototype bikes of various iterations built between
2001 and 2005 that some of you have previously ridden at EDTA, EVS, and
Clean Cities conferences as well as some local EAA chapter meetings.
Range testing on the 50 final production version bikes has apparently
surpassed earlier expectations from what I've heard, achieving around 55
miles at 40-50 mph in mixed driving with stop and goes, quick acceleration,
and up and down hills. Top speed is controller limited to 63 mph.
If you're in the Washington, DC area but can't make it down to Capitol Hill
tomorrow, I plan to stop at my Maryland home just outside DC for about a
week in the fall when I pick up my Vectrix bike at the Massachusetts factory
and would be glad to hook up with EVers in the DC area and let folks take it
for extended test rides. I might also be able to make a few other stops
along the east coast on my way down to Florida, if others are interested in
taking the bike for a ride.
Just to reiterate a valid point previously discussed on the list, this is a
maxi-scooter (similar to a Suzuki Burgman 400 or 650), *not* a sport bike.
If you're looking for an electric sport bike, you should look elsewhere.
Charles Whalen
Delray Beach, FL
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
True, but if they had been for sale wouldn't we have been expected to
pay the entire cost of the car? The lease was affordable as it was an
experiment (IIRC) but how much was an EV1 worth?
-Mike
On 7/19/06, Bob Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
But Still/ That's why I have always said; leassing a car is a ripoff,
this is one of the things that makes a point! Had EV-1's been offered for
SALE to anybody that jusy walked in the door? Well, they woulda sold more of
them than Hummers!How nice it woulda been if Hummers were only offered,
becides Iraq and Trashcanistan, in two cities to only a select group, 100k
wage minimum, 500 bux a month lease, all the EV-1 stuff. Bettya you wouldn't
see many Hummers around? That would be a good thing.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here is a great link to wheel bearing grease tests done at different
temps and the associated torque required to rotate the wheels from a
standstill and while rolling.
http://www.crrel.usace.army.mil/ard/EV18.doc
Mike
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This one might go cheap. I'd keep my eye on it if I wanted it. Lawrence
Rhodes........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cor van de Water" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 5:53 PM
Subject: 1991 G-Van on Ebay, in Mesa, AZ
> 9 passenger GMC van.
>
> Pulled batteries, they were a bit BbbbBbbBBbbb-ulging....
> Spare drive motor, 216V DC system, factory conversion.
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQitemZ160009412802QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roderick you did us all a favor/service and since you are in the EV business
you should write it off. Lawrence Rhodes....
Don't be a fool like me and waste your money out of curiosity. Curiosity
definitely killed this cat.
Roderick Wilde
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chelsea can answer this better than I can, but I recall a $33,000
figure being used to calculate the lease from, not sure if this was
generation 1 or 2, so the lease varied with the version
(lead or NiMh) and other things, but generally
came to somewhere $300 to $550 range.
This means that you could pay well over $25,000 in lease over 4 years.
If they would charge the initial development cost, they would never sell any
car.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Mike Ellis
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 11:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Interesting article on the EV1 and customer support...
True, but if they had been for sale wouldn't we have been expected to
pay the entire cost of the car? The lease was affordable as it was an
experiment (IIRC) but how much was an EV1 worth?
-Mike
On 7/19/06, Bob Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> But Still/ That's why I have always said; leassing a car is a ripoff,
> this is one of the things that makes a point! Had EV-1's been offered for
> SALE to anybody that jusy walked in the door? Well, they woulda sold more
of
> them than Hummers!How nice it woulda been if Hummers were only offered,
> becides Iraq and Trashcanistan, in two cities to only a select group, 100k
> wage minimum, 500 bux a month lease, all the EV-1 stuff. Bettya you
wouldn't
> see many Hummers around? That would be a good thing.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The lease was calculated using a number at or close to what you said
but, if I remember correctly, the actual manufacturing cost (not
devel) was closer to $60,000. But I'm totally just going from memory
here.
On 7/19/06, Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Chelsea can answer this better than I can, but I recall a $33,000
figure being used to calculate the lease from
<...>
If they would charge the initial development cost, they would never sell any
car.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Mike Ellis
True, but if they had been for sale wouldn't we have been expected to
pay the entire cost of the car? The lease was affordable as it was an
experiment (IIRC) but how much was an EV1 worth?
-Mike
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It could be any or all of the reasons stated. At most, the charger is putting
out half of the transformer's rated capacity, and usually when the amp load is
high the dimmer is set high, or even to full on, at which point I assume
there's some sort of bypass of the DC generating circuitry. The dimmer is
actually doing the most work at float voltage and low amps. Also, the
schematic you drew does look like how my charger is wired. I doubt that it's
the dimmer itself, though - I've used three different ones from two differernt
companies (for reasons other than function) and they all seemed to work. I'll
try to remember to open it up and check the transformer temperature after a
higher-amp session to see if there's more heat then.
An interesting point - I wanted to be able to generate an adjustable DC voltage
from 2 - 15 volts (to test my Z-regs which I keep hooking up backwards and
burning out - doh!) so I connected a dimmer to a transformer and a rectifier
bridge for a test voltage generator. The unit hummed badly at mid-level
voltage, less so at low and high settings. I wonder if that was related to
this DC output issue?
Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Steve Condie wrote:
> Then, I read on the EVDL archives, that a fan dimmer
> would be better, since it doesn't have a DC component.
> Quote Dave Roden year 2001: "The problem is that a light dimmer isn't
> built for the application. They don't worry about minimizing any DC
> in the output, because light bulbs work equally well on AC or DC...
> so I went out to look at my dim boy... transformer... If it was above
> room temperature I couldn't tell by touching it.
It was good to do a quickie test, under "typical" conditions with one
particular dimmer. It came out good -- so you didn't have the "DC on the
windings" problem in this particular case.
It could be because your particular dimmer didn't produce a DC output
current. Some do, some don't -- the balance between the two half-cycles
isn't controlled in dimmers intended to run ordinary light bulbs.
It could be that your dimmer never ran anything close to full primary
current into the transformer, so even with its DC component, the total
current was still within the transformer's capabilities. Suppose the
transformer is wound for 1 amp of primary current. Your dimmer is set
very low, and delivers 0.1 amp of AC and 0.5 amp of DC current. That's a
huge DC offset (5:1), but the total is still well under the
transformer's ratings.
Finally, there may be some peculiarities in your circuit that help. Is
your circuit like this? (View with a fixed-width font):
AC_____________
hot | | battery charger
|_ _| transformer
_| || |_
120vac _| || |_ 12vac
_| || |_ bridge rectifier
| | _____
__|__ |______|AC +|_____+
| _ | | |
| (_) |dimmer | | battery pack
|_____| | |
AC____|_______________|AC -|_____-
neutral |_____|
The bridge circuit on the 12v secondary keeps the transformer loaded at
all times. It acts as a "snubber" across the coils, to reset the core
back to zero at each zero-crossing of the AC line. A mechanical analogy
is a governor on a flywheel to keep it accelerating until it explodes.
This keeps the transformer's core loss from reaching ruinous levels. In
effect, it works somewhat like a flyback converter, which deliberately
puts a pulse of DC into the primary of a transformer, but then extracts
an equivalent pulse of DC from the secondary to reset the core.
But you still have to worry about excessive DC in the primary of the
transformer; if it current gets too high, it will burn up the winding
from simple resistive heating. The simplest way to protect against this
is to put a fuse in series with the primary of the transformer; it will
blow before the winding is damaged.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free.
--- End Message ---
