Who knows -- you may be interested in a Dutch idea to build an energy island
in the North sea by diking around an area of sea then using periods of
surplus wind power generation form the north sea offshore wind farms (of
which there are quite a few now) to pump water out from inside of the diked
off area lowering the water levels inside with respect to the sea level
outside. Creating a reservoir of pumped storage that could be drawn down
when supplies did not meet demand.

Large scale pumped storage is by far the largest form of electric energy
storage that currently exists and there are some interesting projects coming
on line now - such as the Eagle Crest project in the deserts of Southern
California which will provide 1300 MW of dispatchable power onto the grid
and which pairs perfectly with the wind and solar generation facilities that
are sited in that region. 

Chris

 

From: everything-list@googlegroups.com
[mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 11:19 AM
To: everything-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

 

I used to be a fan of Amory Lovins too but am concerned that better
efficiencies might not get us across the bridge to Solar City. Lovin's
Kevlar cars never took off, for one reason, is because they were so light
that strong winds would guide them off the test track. If we weigh them down
to be highway ready, there goes the mileage. New materials might do the
trick architecturally, as you stated. 

 

I am personally sort of obsessed with the idea of using pumped storage at
sea (probably costly) using wind power, ocean current to pump uphill, vast,
amounts of sea water into synthetic reservoirs, and then get hydro-electric
juice flowing for days or weeks from these structures. But, the efficiencies
of moving tons of sea water uphill, may just suck at producing electricity?
An energy sink is no energy source.

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 10, 2013 2:08 pm
Subject: RE: Our Demon-Haunted World

Seriously increasing our energy efficiency is key to building a bridge to a
living future. One thing this whole discussion is overlooking -- focused as
it is, on electric energy supply (a fraction of total energy supply and
demand) -- is the low hanging fruit of increasing energy efficiency. There
is so much room for improvement in the efficiency with which we use energy.
In transportation of course, but especially in heating and cooling and
lighting our societies built spaces -- both commercial, industrial &
residential. 
Building heating, cooling & lighting accounts for the lion's share of all
energy use (usually measured in units of Quads --  quadrillion Btus); in
fact this area amounts to almost half of all energy use (around 40% -- if I
recall the percentage figure). A country like the USA could use half as much
energy as it currently does -- if it did so more efficiently -- and still
enjoy the same level of heating, cooling, lighting and mobility as we are
currently enjoying.
Trying to increase supplies -- or shift to renewable supplies -- makes
little sense if not also paired with a serious attempt at ramping up energy
efficiency. Just simple acts insulating ceilings, floors and walls; like
caulking cracks around windows etc. and closing up these many tiny air leaks
from buildings, or replacing single pane windows with double or triple pane
windows; or using energy efficient lighting can have major impacts in
reducing energy requirements. So much of our built space is really crappy in
terms of energy efficiency and lighting and the carbon impact of an
aggressive national effort at ramping up energy efficiency would be larger
than any other single thing we could do.
This is not sexy stuff, it is rather low tech, but it does generate a lot of
local jobs and provides almost immediate relief from high energy bills.
Chris
 
-----Original Message-----
From: everything-list@googlegroups.com
[mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com
<mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com?> ] On Behalf Of meekerdb
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 10:52 AM
To: everything-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
 
On 11/10/2013 1:26 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 10:12 AM, LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 10 November 2013 21:40, Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Look, I hope global warming is not that serious, because if it is, 
>>> it's game over. Big government is most definitely not going to solve 
>>> it. I think you know this too. There isn't a magical point where to 
>>> government gets so big that it starts doing the right thing. If it's 
>>> very small, at least there's less opportunity for the already 
>>> ultra-rich to further their interests with our tax-money, like they 
>>> do at the moment.
>>> 
>> There is however a point at which a problem gets so big that even 
>> politicians realise they should do something about it, for their own
sakes.
> But if the global warming models are correct, that is already too 
> late. If I understand the most common models correctly, it _is_ 
> already too late.
 
Why don't you read what the IPCC reports actually say.  It's too late keep
CO2 below 450ppm.  It's too late to prevent a temperature rise of 2degC.
That doesn't mean it's too late to save civilization.
 
Brent
 
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