Dear Brent, I have given my definition of reality previously, but here it is again. For some collection of observers that can communicate, a reality is that which is incontrovertible. In other words, a reality is that which all observers agree. I do not like the idea of an a priori "reality" as such can be defined arbitrarily to suit one's whim.
On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 1:11 AM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote: > On 1/8/2014 5:20 PM, Stephen Paul King wrote: > > Dear Brent, > > I agree with you 100%! But that seems to imply that there is something > "real" about the physical. I think that we can obtain a form of realism > that does not involve a "god's eye view" by appealing to the possibility of > coherent communication between multiple observers. Observers being defined > as intersections of an infinite number of computations, ala Bruno's > definition. We do not need an ontologically primitive physical world, we > only need a "level of substitution" so that the "Yes, Doctor" choice is > possible. > > > Notice that you had to put "real" in scare quotes - because it isn't clear > what it means. I think the conclusion is that, in Bruno's MGA, the inert > program needs to include a great deal, essentially a whole universe. That > doesn't make it wrong, but to me it makes it less interesting. It would be > surprising than an inert program could implement consciousness in this > world, since it couldn't interact with this world. But if it's conscious > within it's own world, then it's just like any other simulation (e.g. The > Matrix). > > Brent > > > On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 5:40:33 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> On 1/7/2014 10:36 PM, LizR wrote: >> > Max's main lacuna is the nature of consciousness, which he describes as >> "what data feels >> > like when it's being processed" - hardly a detailed theory. He starts >> his Mathematical >> > Universe Hypothesis from the opposite pole to Bruno, so to speak. I >> wonder if it's >> > possible for a particular mathemathical object to drop out of comp - >> after all, we do >> > appear to live in a universe with a specific set of laws of physics. >> Are these the only >> > ones that could be generated by comp (or generated by the existence of >> conscious beings >> > in Platonia) ? Maybe one needs to somehow intersect comp with the MUH >> to get the full story! >> >> I think to be conscious you need memory and a sense of time passage >> (although Bruno >> disputes this when he comes back from a salvia trip). To escape solipism >> there must be >> objects your perceive, some of which act like you, and on which you can >> act (c.f. Dr >> Johnson). That implies that there must be a quasi-classical world in >> order to support >> consciousness (at least human-like consciousness). >> >> Brent >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the > Google Groups "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this topic, visit > https://groups.google.com/d/topic/everything-list/TBc_y2MZV5c/unsubscribe. > To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- Kindest Regards, Stephen Paul King Senior Researcher Mobile: (864) 567-3099 stephe...@provensecure.com http://www.provensecure.us/ “This message (including any attachments) is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain information that is non-public, proprietary, privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law or may be constituted as attorney work product. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, notify sender immediately and delete this message immediately.” -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
