> On 30 Oct 2019, at 21:50, Alan Grayson <agrayson2...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 5:53:10 PM UTC-6, Alan Grayson wrote: > > On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 5:18:45 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: > > On 10/29/2019 3:48 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: >> >> On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 1:55:17 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: >> >> >> On 10/29/2019 12:46 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: >>> >>> >>> On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 1:25:43 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: >>> >>> >>> On 10/29/2019 11:43 AM, Alan Grayson wrote: >>>> What does that mean? No one even detects them. They need not even be >>>> absorbed, but could simply fly off to infinity. >>>> >>>> Brent >>>> >>>> What exactly is the situation? Interference is destroyed, more and more, >>>> as they get hotter, but without any observations? AG >>> >>> Right. >>> >>> Brent >>> >>> It sounds like some sort of hidden variable (don't take this too >>> literally), where the particles send out information of whether >>> interference will occur or not, and it doesn't matter if it's observed. >>> This could fit into my model of superposition with some modification; >>> namely, it you do a which-way experiment, OR if information about which-way >>> is available, interference is destroyed. And what goes through the slits in >>> the absence of these conditions is a wave going through both slits. AG >> >> OK. Except "send out" doesn't make sense. It implies signaling, which >> would be at less than light speed (c.f. delay choice quantum eraser >> experiment). >> >> Brent >> >> What descriptive term do you prefer? Those IR photons travel at the SoL. The >> point is that if there's information available for which-way, even if not >> observed, the interference is destroyed. AG > > What does "available" mean? The information that left at the speed of light > is not "available" in any conventional sense at the screen or detector in the > experiment. > > Brent > > That's the mystery we have to figure out. What we know, is that the particles > release IR photons which could be observed, and when that emission occurs, > interference disappears. It doesn't even depend on any observations being > made. AG > > I would revise my interpretation this way; the electron, or whatever, behaves > as a wave when no information exists to distinguish which-way, and that wave > goes through both slits producing interference. When such information exists, > even if it isn't used or measured, the interference ceases to exist. > Obviously, there's a huge mystery how the existence of such information is > sufficient to destroy interference, but that's what the experimental results > demonstrate. AG
That huge mystery disappears when you apply QM to the particles *and* to the observers and all things they interact with. The interferences are never destroyed, but assuming that the observers are machines and that they obey to QM explains entirely why they feel like memorising that the interference have disappeared, and why they are locally right about this. Either the observer obeys QM, and inherits the superposition of what they are observing through measurement/entanglement, or QM is false for the observer, and we have to wait for some theory of what is an observer, together with some criteria for when and where we can use QM. Bruno > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/9d13eee6-5f1c-4a0d-a51a-4a8a6474ff0e%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/9d13eee6-5f1c-4a0d-a51a-4a8a6474ff0e%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/543C233D-945A-4F86-848F-8600E8479569%40ulb.ac.be.
