Okay, no charismatic leader no cult. It is just an organization. So by more
scholarly definition evidently your feelings around the TM movement is that TM
never quite rose up to be a cult, but was/is a sect. No charismatic leader,
no cult. It evidently was a movement that you were part of,
-Buck
salyavin808 writes: As far as I'm concerned it never had a charismatic leader.
Marshy's woolly, illogical and ignorant lecturing style always left me cold.
Corporation is a good word for it though. As it sells both a product and a
belief system that makes that product seem a lot more valuable than it actually
is. Marshy's genius is the lectures he gave that conned everyone into thinking
all the unified field, sci, land of the ved bollocks was an ultimate truth for
all mankind and that he was its natural voice.
awoelflebater writes:
I'd have to agree with you about MMY not being the most riveting of speakers.
He was a snooze for me but he certainly, at least, seemed like a pleasant
enough guy but hardly profound, hardly magnetic and definitely not charismatic.
TM, more accurately now is a [religious spiritual] sect in its
post-charismatic leader phase. As an organizational structure it is a
corporation. Fairly, TM is no longer a cult with a charismatic leader. -Buck
salyavin808 writes:
Potayto, potahto.
No, most of what you are offering as definition technically is about sects.
Cults form around charismatic persons. Sects form out of specialness, exception
or differentiation as in different denominations of protestantism or
catholicism or denominations or types of meditation. Those are sects. Sects are
around fragmentation and cults are around persons as charismatics. For
instance, If someone really 'charismatic', like earlier defined by Weber, like
a Robin were to show up in Fairfield, Iowa and take off a bunch of meditators
as his followers by force and power of personality then we're talking cult, as
a sect. That is different than the different sects of people out teaching
meditations and some others out there teaching other things they've learned.
-Buck in the Dome
Salyavin808 writes: You don't need any leader to be a cult. All you need is a
belief system that sets you apart from the norm.
Om, policy and movement within TM now is based much more on science, merit and
efficacy than old ways promoted around Totakacharya-like devotion, fealty and
ideology. But that old movement way of fealty test and ideology test is fast
dying away of a necessity and become cultural memory of a past.
Heck TM does not even have a charismatic leader or leadership anymore. WE got
administrators. It is kind of hard to have a cult without a charismatic leader
that you could point to. That is defining of cults. Please see FFL post# 370565
. No, people become meditators and then freely participating in this
organization because they like meditation and appreciate all the good that the
transcendent meditative state provides everyone individually and collectively.
Our meditating organization is here to facilitate that good. That facilitating
in our case now is the work of good in progress by our new incorporation as
meditators. Our corporation as it always has been is certainly about affecting
a positive revolutionary radical change in all of society for everybody. Most
of us in TM are pretty clear about that. Are you with us or against us in this?
-U.S. Buck in the Dome
MJ, See Weber's comments on 'cult' in Melton's Intro to The Postcharismatic
Fate of New Religious Movements:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/370565
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/370565
MJ, Your thesis around TM being a 'cult' has a problem in that we in TM no
longer have a charismatic leader of TM. We are either administrators or
meditators in TM and anyone in TM is enfranchised by a little of both under
Maharishi's Absolute Theories of Management and Government. You clearly are
full of your own personal BS and have your ax grinding about something. I
feels a sorrow for thee in thy lack of peace around this.
-Buck
“Which would you rather experience: living the paradox or understanding it to
your satisfaction?” Not either position is mutually exclusive, or that there is
a third possibility of both.
MJ writes:
You need to read up on what cults actually are before you make such statements.
Nope, not a cult. TM now as a corporation obviously is not a cult any more
than any modern productive working corporation of employees is a 'cult'. TM and
meditators as a community now are just like airline corporation employee pilots
of an airline company. And they might go fly for their work wearing funny
looking hats and coats too where they would go to work and pilot an airliner.
And those lesser employees too as part of the corporate team who organize a
flight as a gate agent or direct people as flight attendants or load luggage or
maintain the corporation equipment. TM is as very modern as is any corporation
in 'cult' -ure, as Maharishi himself particularly set that in motion now. TM
now is not hardly as bad as you portray it. It is rapidly becoming more modern
and scientific as it is of vedic origin in corporation all the time. And we
don't hardly see the gold hats and robes around much outside of a small circle
deep inside at the top. If there is a cult it is possibly at that level to see
but you can see a lot of them avoiding the caps and robes when they can. -Buck
MJwrites:You are right Buck, the TMO IS different now - it is much more of a
cult than it was when I started in 1974. If you can look at these idiots
wearing robes and gold crowns who practice and follow every Hindu religious
observance and holiday and not see it as a cult, then you have been snorting
too much sheep dip.
Shame on you MHJ. Om, First-Class Bull-Manure you Spread Wide and Spread Thick
here, MHJ. This TM now is not a “cult” no more as much as you might like to
declare that it is. As we used to explain in the olde days, “Om no, TM is not a
'cult' like christian cults or the people's-temple may be; TM is way too
dis-organized to be that. . It's about meditation and the evident scientific
spiritual value of meditation”. MJ, there is something malevolent in what you
do to something that is so good in itself as what is simply transcending
meditation. In this new corporate-post-charismantic-era, Transcendental
Meditation is plainly now different. Your commentary is clearly out of date. I
appreciate that it takes a long time for the current news to travel to the
hollers and plantations of South Carolina but clearly you are out of it. -Buck
in the Dome
mjackson74 writes: I shall begin an immediate campaign to have it removed from
Whole Goods (sic) so they don't support cults.
The Transcendental Meditative State of
Consciousness is Found Within Restful ALERTNESS.
Drink: Vedic Coffee to Support Restful ALERTNESS!
http://vediccoffee.com/ http://vediccoffee.com/
mjackson74 writes:
I shall begin an immediate campaign to have it removed from Whole Goods so
they don't support cults.
Buck Writes:
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Drink Vedic Coffee and Support Peace
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, February 14, 2014, 11:52 PM
The Transcendental Meditative State of
Consciousness is Found Within Restful ALERTNESS.
Drink: Vedic Coffee to Support Restful ALERTNESS!
http://vediccoffee.com/ http://vediccoffee.com/
O
