Okay Buddy, you are laying it on the line here:
"Obviously we are born in to this wold with nature and then there is nurture.
Evidently moral behavior is something developed and cultured in good
upbringing. My feeling in watching is that a lot of the bad behavior that MJ in
writing here for instance is so upset about in the TM community movement comes
from bad upbringing and does not have so much of anything to do with whether
some one meditates. It's mostly bad manners without virtue. Evidently. That's
what I see, they are just being bad people for their poor upbringings and
sometimes they are even immoral. Okay, that can be really bad at times on the
part of some but not the normative of most folks. Just really bad upbringing."
The whole point to many of my posts here is that TM does not work as you claim
it works. The WHOLE FUCKING POINT to TM all these years is that TM IMPROVES
EVERYTHING! That is the claim made for it. That's the whole point to doing TM,
improving your life. If one has bad upbringing, then TM can make you a better
person. Why do you think the David Lynch leeches are pushing so hard to get TM
to the AT RISK populations, especially the young ones??? To, among other
things, counteract BAD UPBRINGING!
So if bad upbringing can't be negated or improved by regular practice of TM,
what good is the practice? You have hoist yourself on your own petard, Buck.
You seem to be saying that if one has bad upbringing, TM won't change the
behavior that bad upbringing creates.
Specifically, I have found fault with Bevan Morris, Greg and Georgina Wilson,
Bill Sands, Neal Patterson, Marshy, Girish, the Srivastavas brothers, Susan
Humphries, Cris Crowell, John Hagelin, Reed Martin and all the lying and
manipulation that they and other small medium and large managers in the TMO
have done.
Are you saying that all the above named individuals had bad upbringing? You
are making excuses for why TM obviously seems to work in reverse for people who
run the Movement.
On Thu, 2/20/14, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com <dhamiltony...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Empathy versus cruelty
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, February 20, 2014, 8:54 PM
Meditating, “improved moral reasoning”, and
moral behavior.
Three different things evidently and possibly
intertwined.
Obviously we are born in to this wold with nature and
then there
is nurture. Evidently moral behavior is something developed
and
cultured in good upbringing. My feeling in watching is that
a lot of
the bad behavior that MJ in writing here for instance is so
upset about in the
TM community movement comes from bad upbringing and does not
have so
much of anything to do with whether some one meditates.
It's mostly
bad manners without virtue. Evidently. That's
what I see, they are just being bad people for their poor
upbringings and sometimes they are even immoral. Okay,
that can be really bad at times on the part of some but not
the normative of most folks. Just really bad
upbringing.. For instance, here is two
minutes on improving behavior as
learned. ..
Some sensitive caring in thoughtful upbringing, in 2
minutes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTqDfb-QhNg
-Buck in the Dome
Maharishi's was
revolutionary and comprehensive thinking about
global peace, like "Elise M. Boulding (July 6,
1920 – June 24,
2010). Boulding offers Building a Global Civic Culture:
Education for
an Interdependent as a holistic first step towards solving
international conflicts. She envisions a “global civic
culture”
as not simply made of nation states but as a global
community of
human beings. The book enforces the idea of thinking
globally on a
microcosmic level to facilitate solving problems in a
peaceful
international order. Boulding believed that a civic world
order could
become a reality, while acknowledging the strife that exists
now.
"Building a Global Civic Culture" is geared toward
addressing the world’s problems and offering ideas for
solutions.To create peace,
Boulding believes that we must all become
teachers and develop new learning communities. Everyone, old
and
young, will teach. Age groups will teach each other from
their
respective generations. How we perceive events unique to our
generation shapes the lens through which we each see later
events. We
need to know what the world looks like to young and old
alike.
Boulding believes all will be teachers.In order to do
this, we must learn to think outside of the box.
Humans are intuitive, creative animals with
cognitive-analytic
reasoning abilities. We as human animals can grasp complex
wholes
from partial sets of facts. Boulding states that for most of
us,
education has been tied to the maxim “stick to the facts,
no need
for imaginative thinking.” We are taught in school that
imagination
and intuition are virtues of the daydreamer, not the true
student. To
the contrary, Boulding states we need to harness both
intuition and
imagination to solve world crises. Ultimately this book
encourages us
to become both teachers and problem solvers and includes
exercises to
lead the way.
Elise M. Boulding was a Quaker sociologist
[many
credentials], and author credited as a major contributor to
creating
the academic discipline of Peace and Conflict Studies.
Her
holistic, multidimensional approach to peace research sets
her apart
as an important scholar and activist in multiple fields. Her
written
works span several decades and range from discussion of
family as a
foundation for peace, to Quaker spirituality to reinventing
the
international “global
culture”.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elise_M._Boulding#Building_a_Global_Civic_Culture
Evidently
as practicing and experience meditators we are not alone in
our experience around this. There are other mystics
who see this too.-Buck in the
Dome
S3raphita ,
I feel you are being quite saintly in taking notice of
the circumstance. Yep, it is just another sign of bad
upbringing and
the failure of our schools and society. Including
fault of all
those collectively standing around smirking who without
initiative
themselves or had the opportunity in their own lives to
pursue the
proper upbringing of virtue of spiritual life themselves and
all
those who who may know better will themselves not going out
even on a
limb to help anyone other than themselves in their own
material world
of widget worth. I
sense saintly virtue in you that you would even
notice the collective failure in this incident in this poor
unlucky
youth. The shoplifter is just another index showing the
lack in our
meissner-like collective transmission of collective
consciousness of
virtue in life. You are a teacher of the absolute wisdom in
life are
you not? A transmitter of spiritual virtue? It makes sense
that you
are sensitive to what was in that public scene. It is now
the age of
science and it is neigh time they put quiet-time meditation
in to the
training of all our children in their schools, if their
families can
not provide it for their own children if not just to save us
all.
To save us all from this vileness otherwise there is a place
for
public education in these sound values of life. All it
takes is some
quiet-time. It pisses me off too to watch the smirking
jerks as you
point to, like some even here who would actually stand in
the way and
fight what is such evident science and get in the way of the
larger
transmission of virtue in life. Yep, all those smirking
jerks all
watching the theatre of this youth being taken off should
all be
sending checks of donation as a matter of character to the
David
Lynch Foundation to help in the trenches in the fight
against all
that is vile in life. The teaching of and learning of the
transcendental meditative state is the inalienable right to
be
guaranteed of every human being born in to this life. That
is the
first right that needs to be first guaranteed to every child
growing
up. Teaching of effective transcending meditation in all
our schools
is now the scientific standard of a proper education and
should be
all our public's policy regardless. I commend you for
bringing this
sad story to our attention here at FFL. You are a saint in
reaching
for the transformation that awareness can bring. It
would be cruelty to know the great virtue of life and not
say anything or do anything about this situation.
Thanks for bringing this to our attention here.
It will likelymake us all better for it in pursuing
our spiritual practices as we go about our daily lives.
Thanks, you are a saint.-Buck
s3raphita writes:Today I was walking past a department store when a
sudden commotion caught my attention. A young man was being
frogmarched to a waiting police car by two constables -
obviously he was a shoplifter who hadn't been as careful
as he should have been. But what appalled me was that
everyone around me - fellow pedestrians, people in coffee
shops, those waiting at the bus stop - were almost
universally smiling and exchanging knowing glances. I've
noticed that reaction countless times in similar situations.
But me: I just felt depressed. Here was a youth, perhaps on
his way to prison. His mum and dad and sisters, his other
relatives and his friends would be shocked and saddened by
the news of his arrest. What is there to smile about for
God's sake? It's a reaction I've noticed about
other misfortunes. People see drug addicts in the final
stages of degradation and judge these unfortunates as being
"losers". I see the same people and wonder what
sexual or physical abuse they suffered as children - or
maybe as adults they encountered some other misfortune,
perhaps having to see a loved one die slowly and painfully
of cancer - and think to myself how lucky I am that I have
never had to cope with such trauma.So is Seraphita a saint? Not bloody likely.
I am as selfish, as self-centred, as narrowly concerned with
my own well-being as anyone. The difference seems to be an
ability to enter imaginatively into the suffering of others
and appreciate what a raw deal they had. Of course, some
shop-lifters and drug addicts are complete saddos and
probably need a kick up the arse and told to get a grip. But
many will have just been unlucky - and luck plays a dominant
role in all our lives. Imagination is often dismissed as
idle fancy but really it is a faculty in which we grasp real
aspects of the world - just like perception and reason. But
perhaps another cause for people to enjoy the misfortunes of
others - complete strangers at that - is that they are
unhappy ("The mass of men lead lives of quiet
desperation." - Thoreau) and seeing someone worse off
than themselves gives them a boost. They suddenly see that
their own lives could be even more miserable so for a brief
moment they can feel complacently
self-satisfied. Alas - according to
Nietzsche - pity is just cruelty disguised. There's a
lot to be said for that view - just observe carefully how
your friends and colleagues savour reports of disasters on
the latest news bulletins while convincing themselves how
compassionate they are. So what can we conclude? That
Seraphita is a hypocrite! Heads you win; tails I
lose.
