---Thanks, you're definitely right about the Rainbow Light Body, but it remains to be seen if anybody outside of secluded parts of Tibet will be able to acquire this type of body. This is a hope-for goal in the category of progressive evolution. Evidence suggests that it's at the end of a progressive biological evolution - something not to be aquired through an immediate transmission! (stress release can't be avoided).
In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Dec 8, 2006, at 10:49 PM, matrixmonitor wrote: > > > ---On a conceptual basis, yes...Dzogchen takes place somehow beyond > > all progressions, and (as Vaj so astutely pointed out); doesn't > > involve the transmission of Shakti (unlike Muktananda's Shaktipat). > > But on a practical basis, (as Vaj so unastutely failed to mention); > > one (the aspirant) is still confronted with the problems of ingrained > > inertia, stress, vasanas;...etc; all of the traditional Buddhist (or > > otherwise) impediments to Enlightenment - such as the "vices" - that > > we may allude to as behavioral patterns connected to stress - that > > simply don't vanish in the blink of an eye when one attends a > > Dzogchen retreat. > > Sorry this is simply wrong. You don't seem to have any idea of what > Mahasandhi/Dzogchen is. One wonders if you even have that transmission. > > > Even as pointed out by the greatest of Dzogchen > > Masters (Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche among them - this is Vaj's Guru); the > > element of TIME invariably creeps in, and although one may "get it" > > (i.e. Grok "IT" to a certain extent); the fact remains that unless > > one is 99.999....% already realized, various impediments dissalow > > one's immediate Enlightenment even though the Dzogchen transmission > > is immediate. > > What you fail to mention is that that Dzogchen Fruit, the realization > of the Body of Light, is far beyond any of the TM conceptual > darshanas or the TM practical darshanas (really basic yoga darshana, > CC). > > > Unfortunately, most of the Buddhist Gurus (except possibly the > > Dalai Lama and a few others); haven't YET gotten the connection > > between the delay in one's hoped for immediate Enlightenment and the > > stark reality of time, time, time... ; and the possible cause of that > > delay: stress. But thanks to MMY, we new insights into the > > phenomenon of the progression toward Enlightenment; but at the same > > time, nothing is preventing people from "Grok"-ing the fact that they > > are already "IT". (even though tomorrow morning and the day after, > > one may have to Grok this again). > > And again, this is totally incorrect. In fact the Dalai Lama, as de > facto head of the Gelukpa sect, also represents the head of the Lam > Rim (the Gradual Path), no? > > > Contrary to what the Neo-Advaitins like HWL Poonja would have us > > believe, simply Groking "IT" for the first time may be insufficient; > > and likewise, simply receiving a Dzogchen transmission a single time > > may not get people immediately Enlightened. > > It really depends on your *definition* (more importantly the > *experiential definition*) of enlightenment. Since that experiential > definition is different for every darshana, the word "enlightenment" > is only accurate if it is compared within a particular darshana. If > you try to compare *across* darshanas (which is actually what you are > doing), you are comparing apples to orangutans (actually much worse). > Since each darshana not only possesses it's own View *and* it's own > intendant logic, arguing across darshanas is a grand logical fallacy > if ever there was one. > > > > Like it or not, a > > progression of time is usually involved, due to ingrained stresses. > > Though MMY is not really one of my personal Gurus (I'm a devotee of > > Padma Sambhava), > > But you are in direct contradiction to his teaching. You are > presenting both a false Path and a false View. One is tempted to > assume therfore that your View is false Gary. > > > may he be praised forever for coming up with TM and > > the connection between progressive Realization and the concept of > > stress release. Praise God! But in defense of Dzogchen, one simply > > ditch the attitude that one is not already Pure Consciousness (and > > then continue with the practice of TM tomorrow and the day after, and > > the day after....). >
