Smiths, et alii ...
I find this thread-bit a nice complement to the point Marcus made many
weeks ago... confronting my assumption that
consciousness/intelligence/creativity (can't remember precisely which
subject was in play at the moment) was "anything more than imitation". /
/
/ "All Art is Derivative"/?
I think there is something afoot here which I can only (because I lack
imagination, and even when I notice I'm being derivative, I cannot help
but continue?) characterize (gesturally) what I think Terrence Deacon is
going on about with his neologisms: "Ententional" and "Absential" and by
extension "Teleodynamic"
<https://www.informationphilosopher.com/solutions/scientists/deacon/>.
I could blather on for paragraphs with my weak grasp of what he is going
on about, but instead will leave it... "¿absent?". I believe this is
in your (Eric's) Wheelhouse, rhyming with Morowitz's "Pruning".
As I am wont to do, I happen to be reading simultaneously with Deacon, a
work of fiction by Ruth Ozeki, "The Book of Form and Emptiness" where
one of her characters (a wheelchair bound homeless poet) instructs her
protagonist with:
/"Poetry is a problem of form and emptiness, Ze moment i put one
word onto an empty page, I have created a problem for myself. Ze
poem that emerges is form trying to find a solution to my problem."/
It is a ¿coincidence? that these two books crawling through me right now
are on the same subject in some sense? All of this has bubble-sorted
"The Origin and Nature of Life
<https://www.cambridge.org/us/academic/subjects/physics/biological-physics-and-soft-matter-physics/origin-and-nature-life-earth-emergence-fourth-geosphere?format=HB>"
to the top of my stack, about 5 years overdue. I must read faster, or
more in parallel or allow my dopple-selves across the quantum-multiverse
to merge more-better?
//
Regarding your (Cody's) original assertion, I do believe that there is a
reach/grasp relationship. True creativity (as if such a thing can be
declared) might seem to be in the reach more than the grasp. AI still
seems to be *grasping* what humans (the only sentience we are familiar
with) has deigned/considered/imagined to *reach for*?
I will respond to Eric's astute point about imagination/creativity in
(science) fiction under separate cover.
- yet another Smith
On 7/20/22 3:18 PM, David Eric Smith wrote:
I feel like this is yet another reminder that humans, by and large,
lack imagination.
The reason robots in sci-fi are flat and empty is because sci-fi is
re-telling Descartes’s assertion that everything except humans
(probably, sotto voce, except him) are flat and affectless. Maybe
even more than machines are that, we imprint that on the paradigm of
machine. It’s just the age-old thing of people needing to feel
singular and important, and using vehicles like religion to
systematize their neediness. That sci-fi prides itself on being
imaginative, while re-telling the same small portfolio of bible
stories and other similar sources is human Dunning-Krugerness on display.
A world free of all that corruption probably has lots of dimensions of
possibility that humans will just drive by without noticing because
their minds are elsewhere.
Of course, each of your detailed points I recognize is true and a good
one,
Eric
On Jul 21, 2022, at 2:05 AM, cody dooderson <d00d3r...@gmail.com> wrote:
It is surprising that AI is so creative. Many science fiction robots
were calculated but uncreative. They are like Data from star trek,
basically a calculator with very little creative potential. But it
seems like AI, as it develops, is actually more creative than its
human counterparts.
Here are a few examples that come to mind. AlphaGo beat the
grandmaster, Lee Sedol, with moves that the grandmaster had never
seen before. The art world is seeing some very cool stuff coming out
of trained neural networks like Dall-e2*. In the Sony article, they
talk about a trick where the AI put a wheel on the grass to initiate
a controlled slide. Do you think that modern Neural networks will
give any insight into the nature of creativity?
* Dall-e2 https://www.reddit.com/r/weirddalle/
Cody Smith
On Wed, Jul 20, 2022 at 7:19 AM Roger Critchlow <r...@elf.org> wrote:
Two articles from MIT Tech Review.
https://www.technologyreview.com/2022/07/19/1056176/sonys-racing-ai-destroyed-its-human-competitors-by-being-nice-and-fast/
<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.technologyreview.com%2f2022%2f07%2f19%2f1056176%2fsonys-racing-ai-destroyed-its-human-competitors-by-being-nice-and-fast%2f&c=E,1,sW_uqrRPOXBSOBOKyAZBXmUeEC_gAg6bC8gm1INQST-ojGhCL2hs6hZ0n3OXOMaE29ZvHzCImJ-clJq2975O6Z7VJXWF-auEZX7UaV_rfFo7jCerKI3uQrTt&typo=1>
Training AI drivers for Gran Turismo racing, it turns out that
they can learn to physically drive faster than people, but
they're too aggressive to win head to head races because they
drive the competition off the road. So you need to train them to
observe the norms of the competition, by including penalties for
crashes, bumps, cut-offs, etc, into the training. They still
drive faster than people, and the way they drive is a bit
disturbing to watch.
[So if you were training AI drivers for political races, would
the norms come from established law or where the voters could be
persuaded to mark their polls?]
https://www.technologyreview.com/2022/07/20/1056219/weed-influencer-and-scientist-feud-over-cannabis-hyperemesis-syndrome/
<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.technologyreview.com%2f2022%2f07%2f20%2f1056219%2fweed-influencer-and-scientist-feud-over-cannabis-hyperemesis-syndrome%2f&c=E,1,V2LEaPWTwH3T7VFjGfU7bcnhh0onNBmvFckXpaLoRhfL1fS-X5j4_shbXCArwd2na4pUY52IMOtyZK5VLSHLt7YD7qfxOsYsys64-ZDOhZIodihFmXY1Zg,,&typo=1>
The scientist and the instagram influencer attempt to study the
genetic causes of CHS (cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome) and the
influencer blows up the study when she declares that the
scientist is a shill on her channel. Ah the joys of decision
making with uncertainty and cognitive bias.
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