Some of the patterns are formal and useful, and others are informal and useful. LLMs can translate between them. Sometimes patterns using lexical tokens of written human language, other times using electromagnetic spectrum waveforms matched to human modalities like hearing, vision, tactile experience, central nervous system neural signaling, etc.
From: Friam <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Prof David West Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2025 10:49 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [FRIAM] mental imagery I hope I am sticking to the thread, hermeneutically ... Assume three groups: one speaks, thinks, and dreams in Babel-17; another in Adamic (aka "language of the birds"); and the vastly larger group only in "appetites." The Babel-17 folks are very clever and have used their language to express many wondrous things, including machines that, mostly, convincingly replicate Babel-17 expressiveness. Smitten with their cleverness and power, they look down on, with at least a modicum of justification, the larger crowd, the "Appetite-istas." The fears, concerns, and even the lack of wealth required to possess the means to access and play with Babel-17, are grounds for condemning them to the trash heap of history. What is interesting to me, is the seemingly absolute conviction that Babel-17 is the ultimate and the only way to speak, think, dream. If the Adamic folk are noticed at all, they are immediately and scornfully dismissed as irrelevant, or worse. davew [Babel-17 is an SF novel by Samuel R. Delany] On Wed, Nov 26, 2025, at 11:53 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: The moral failing is letting the fog of fear take over, and fabricating any story that seems to work to rationalize it. The hate and fear of immigrants on the blue collar side is giving way to hate and fear of AI on the white collar side. From: Friam <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > on behalf of glen <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Date: Wednesday, November 26, 2025 at 9:00 AM To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] mental imagery I love that we're sticking to the thread, but in a hermeneutic way. An inability to envision is akin to an inability execute Lean 4 code. If you don't have the hardware, you can't run the computation. The same could be said about entitled college students or the poor sods who've never benefited from a hero dose of Ψ. I credit Fanon for teaching me that relatively vapid things like the No Kings protest are inadequate for the victims of genocide. Perhaps Israel was destined to be genocidal. "For if the last shall be first, this will only come to pass after a murderous and decisive struggle between the two protagonists." Steve's use of "conceit" often confuses me. If I replace it with "controlling idea" ... or, better, "occult controlling idea", then it seems like agency is *the* conceit of our modern times. Framing one's inability to compute as a moral failing feels akin to blaming the victim. But what choice do we have? We absolutely must, and always do, blame the victim. Right? If you're aphantasic, then it's clearly because you're too lazy to put in the effort. On 11/26/25 8:23 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Rather the IP has some defensive function at the population level for > protecting valuable things from a population that values nothing beyond their > own comfort. On 11/26/25 8:15 AM, Jon Zingale wrote: > I mean, yeah, preach on. For some it's nothing more than a Holiday in > Cambodia. On 11/26/25 7:53 AM, Steve Smith wrote: > On the other hand, we might (also?) just be apes picking nits out of one > another's furry thoughts? Which is it's own mode of coercion/engagement? -- ¡sıɹƎ ןıɐH ⊥ ɐןןǝdoɹ ǝ uǝןƃ ὅτε oi μὲν ἄλλοι κύνες τοὺς ἐχϑροὺς δάκνουσιν, ἐγὰ δὲ τοὺς φίλους, ἵνα σώσω. .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-.. FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ Attachments: * smime.p7s
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