On Thu, 24 Oct 2002, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
> * On 2002-10-24 at 06:53, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> excited > the electrons to say: > > What I haven't seen is any good arguments as > to why a-c is a step > forward for j-c and not a big step back. > > wrong question, i think. 'it's not all about you.' the question > is whether/why a-c is a step forward for *apache*. if the answer > to that is positive, *then* your question above can be considered. > but this dog-in-the-manger 'anything "commons" needs j-c's approval' > attitude has got to go. wrong answer I think. :) Following the ASF Way does not mean committing open-source suicide. ie) If it is demonstratably proven that j-c -> a-c/java is good for apache, then yes, the ASF should go ahead and do it, even with mandatory forcing if necessary. However, this causes obvious damage to the thing they're trying to reorg. So kid glove diplomacy etc [which I'm not saying isn't being done]. What I'm reading Stephen as saying, is one of first, irritation at the commons brand being reallocated without discussion [although this is the ASF's right, it's our right to complain]. If I propose a new project in Jakarta called 'httpd', I could imagine I might find some grumbles about branding. [although... not a bad idea.. minimalist webserver... a java version of thttpd]. The other part being, is Jakarta-Commons to Apache-Commons good for Jakarta-Commons. In this situation I think it is definitely our role to be thinking in terms of J-C and not A-C. We're too close to J-C to think about A-C neutrally anyway and can do more of a service by being the stubborn customer you have/ought to market to. > > yes, i'm being blunt -- but i'm getting a little tired of the > impression i'm getting from multiple people that j-c's opinion > is either the only one that matters, or the most important. On the matter of whether J-C should move to A-C [and not whether A-C should exist at all] then why not? Obviously the importance begins with the ASF board, and then the Jakarta PMC, then maybe the A-C PMC and/or the J-C committers [then users/contributors/A-C committers]. In terms of numbers though, J-C committers are the first large group in that ordering. Hen
