Thanks for the proposal. I'm happy to act as a mentor for the project. I respect the desire to go through the regular incubation process, and maybe it is a good thing for the Paimon community to revisit some of the processes and customs and develop their own style, independent of Flink as part of the incubation process.
I have no doubt regarding the technical or "community building" ability of the initial team. On Mon, Feb 27, 2023 at 2:49 PM Becket Qin <becket....@gmail.com> wrote: > I am really excited to see Paimon become an independent ASF incubation > project, and I am happy to be a mentor of the project. > > Re Dave, > > The plan is to let Paimon eventually graduate as a TLP by itself. The > project bootstrapped as a subproject of Flink because 1) it was designed to > provide a stream and batch unified storage which matches the vision of > Flink as a stream and batch unified engine and 2) the project was developed > by the same team who is working on Flink. > > Now since there have been a few releases, we see strong and reasonable use > cases from the users letting Paimon (flink-table-store) work with engines > other than Flink, such as Spark / Trino. Continuing to keep Paimon as a > subject of Flink might unnecessarily limit the development of the project > and is somewhat misleading to the users. Given its scope, we believe it > makes a lot of sense for Paimon to get incubated on its own independent of > Flink. There has been a thorough discussion[1] and vote[2] about this among > the Flink PMC. > > Cheers, > > Jiangjie (Becket) Qin > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/2ybxfg3zrzn4l3tnq3w2w3xvkhk0f9jk > [2] https://lists.apache.org/thread/95wyc51rfmsqc9osc86q7zx3491m7bvt > > On Fri, Feb 24, 2023 at 12:10 PM Dave Fisher <wave4d...@comcast.net> > wrote: > >> An interesting proposal. Since Paimon is already part of Apache Flink >> does the podling intend to graduate as it’s own Top Level Project? Or, is >> the plan currently to become a subproject of Flink? I’m just curious. Were >> there any discussions within the Flink community about incubating Paimon? >> >> Best Regards, >> Dave >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> > On Feb 23, 2023, at 7:58 PM, Yu Li <car...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > Revision: the hyperlink of the first reference is incorrect and please >> use >> > the website address directly instead of clicking it (sorry for my >> mistake). >> > >> > For easier reference: https://github.com/apache/flink-table-store >> > >> > Best Regards, >> > Yu >> > >> > >> >> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 at 11:48, Yu Li <car...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi All, >> >> >> >> >> >> I would like to propose Paimon [1] as a new apache incubator project, >> and >> >> you can find the proposal [2] of Paimon for more details. >> >> >> >> >> >> Paimon is a unified lake storage to build dynamic tables for both >> stream >> >> and batch processing with big data compute engines (Apache Flink, >> Apache >> >> Spark, Apache >> >> Hive, Trino, etc.), supporting high-speed data ingestion and real-time >> data query. >> >> With the adoption of stream processing in production, there is an >> increasing demand for storage to simultaneously support updates, deletes >> and streaming reads, >> >> which cannot be fully satisfied by existing lake storages. To tackle >> these >> >> new challenges, Paimon >> >> natively adopts LSM (Log-Structured Merge-tree) as its underlying data >> structure, and provides enhanced performance for data with primary keys >> >> (besides >> >> the common lake storage capabilities). What's more, Paimon supports >> both batch and stream operations (reads and writes), facilitating >> applications pursuing batch-stream-unified semantics. Specifically: >> >> >> >> >> >> 1. Paimon provides excellent performance on the intensive update >> >> / delete workload, leveraging the append-write feature of the LSM data >> >> structure. >> >> >> >> 2. Paimon utilizes the ordered feature of LSM to support effective >> filter >> >> pushdown, and could reduce >> >> the latency of queries with primary key filtering to milliseconds. >> >> >> >> 3. >> >> Paimon supports various (row-based or row-columnar) file formats >> including Apache Avro, Apache ORC and Apache Parquet (rows will be sorted >> by the primary key before writing out). >> >> >> >> 4. >> >> Tables provided by Paimon can be queried by various engines, including >> Apache Flink, Apache Spark, Apache Hive, Trino, etc. >> >> >> >> 5. >> >> Paimon's metadata is self-managed, stored on the distributed file >> system and can be synchronized to Hive metastore (HMS). >> >> >> >> 6. >> >> Besides the common batch read and write support, Paimon also supports >> streaming read and change data feed. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Paimon has been used by various users and companies, including >> Alibaba, Bilibili, ByteDance and so on. Paimon is also integrated into >> Alibaba Cloud's E-MapReduce and Realtime Compute products to provide cloud >> services. >> >> >> >> >> >> Paimon was founded in the Flink community in 2022 with the name of >> "Flink Table Store”. >> >> It has been developed for more than one year and produced 4 formal >> >> releases. As its adoption expands to more computing engines, some of >> the ecology users express their concerns about the neutrality of the >> project. This makes us rethink the positioning of Flink Table Store, which >> can be an independent lake storage. >> >> >> >> >> >> With adequate discussions, we have got the support from the Flink >> community to enter Apache incubation >> >> [3] [4], with the below expectations: >> >> >> >> 1. >> >> Expand Paimon's ecosystem, providing independent Java APIs to support >> reading and writing from more big data engines such as Apache >> >> Doris, Apache Hive, Apache Presto, Apache Spark, Trino, etc. >> >> >> >> 2. >> >> Supplement key capabilities, especially streaming reads and intensive >> updates/deletes, for creating a unified and easy-to-use streaming data >> warehouse (lakehouse). >> >> >> >> 3. Grow into a more vibrant and neutral open source community. >> >> >> >> >> >> And we believe the Paimon project will provide tremendous value for the >> >> community if it is introduced into the Apache incubator. >> >> >> >> >> >> I will help this project as the champion and mentor the project >> together >> >> with three other mentors (many thanks): >> >> >> >> >> >> * Becket Qin (j...@apache.org) >> >> >> >> * Robert Metzger (rmetz...@apache.org) >> >> >> >> * Stephan Ewen (se...@apache.org) >> >> >> >> >> >> Look forward to your feedback. Thanks. >> >> >> >> >> >> Best Regards, >> >> Yu >> >> >> >> [1] https://github.com/apache/flink-table-store >> >> <https://github.com/alibaba/RemoteShuffleService> >> >> >> >> [2] >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/INCUBATOR/PaimonProposal >> >> >> >> [3] https://lists.apache.org/thread/2ybxfg3zrzn4l3tnq3w2w3xvkhk0f9jk >> >> >> >> [4] https://lists.apache.org/thread/kn7c08cr4l0ynt551yfjqvzh5ns226r6 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>
