+1 from me too. Managed VMs mean I'm a sysadmin; nooo! If I wanted that I'd be using AWS like a peasant.
On 23 April 2015 at 04:44, Adam Sah <a...@bbfdirect.com> wrote: > +1 to this comment. Managed VMs don't replace the sysadmin simplicity of > appengine, incl automatic OS security upgrades. > > On Wednesday, April 22, 2015 at 1:31:51 AM UTC-7, troberti wrote: >> >> Thanks for your reply Andrew. This confirms my impression that managed VMs >> are becoming the default 'solution' for things that App Engine can't >> currently do. I understand you can't support every language out there, but I >> want to stress that there should be runtimes that deliver on the core >> premise of App Engine: Providing a service and a set of APIs, and when I >> create a program using those APIs, App Engine keeps it running for decades >> and takes care of *everything* else. That is a very compelling product. >> >> I haven't filed any issues against the usability of managed VMs because >> setting one up is too much work already. If a 10 step guide is needed to get >> up and running then that is against the spirit of App Engine. There should >> only be one step: I provide a program and minimal metadata and you guys take >> care of everything else. If there is an issue for that I'll star it ;) >> >> The steps towards "VM-ization" of instances is a good one if it is used to >> remove some of the restrictions on programs that we can run, but not if it >> used to put more maintenance burden on the user. The point of App Engine is >> that the service takes care of all that. That's why the runtime/API boundary >> is the right one: The user maintains the program and App Engine everything >> else. >> >> >> On Wednesday, April 22, 2015 at 6:50:14 AM UTC+2, Andrew Jessup wrote: >>> >>> Hey folks, a PM on App Engine here. >>> >>> The Python 3 question has been top of mind for us - since it's clearly >>> the future for Python development, and has recently reached a tipping point >>> in terms of usage. We're not sure at this stage if the best way forward is >>> with Managed VMs or regular App Engine, and we have a few experiments in >>> flight right now to figure that out. >>> >>> What I'm hearing on this thread though is that whatever the Python 3 >>> solution is, it needs to be a lot simpler and less cumbersome than the >>> Managed VMs experience today, and we agree. We have some parallel work in >>> flight to dramatically simplify the working with Managed VMs (especially >>> around the toolchain) and managing applications that we hope to be able to >>> talk more about soon. >>> >>> I'd also second Jeff's point above about filing bugs on the usability of >>> Managed VMs (or even better, star a bug that already exists - generally a >>> highly starred bug will get worked on quicker than lots of bugs about the >>> same issue with only a few stars). >>> >>> On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 9:33 AM, Jeff Schnitzer <je...@infohazard.org> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I agree with all of you - the Managed VM experience kinda sucks right >>>> now compared to what we're used to. Google will have an easier time making >>>> it better if we file bugs against it the usability issues. >>>> >>>> Jeff >>>> >>>> On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 8:50 AM, Karl MacMillan <ka...@rakkoon.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Apr 20, 2015, at 3:51 AM, troberti <tij...@firigames.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Exactly. Managed VMs are great for some applications, but not a >>>>> replacement for the managed runtimes. The idea of App Engine is >>>>> simplicity & >>>>> zero-configuration (or at least as close to it as possible). Instead, >>>>> Managed VMs seem to throw a lot of that back on the user's lap. I don't >>>>> want >>>>> to 'dockerize' my apps and start managing my own runtimes. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I completely agree. I’ve seen many comments suggesting that managed VMs >>>>> are a viable alternative to traditional GAE, but this is not the case at >>>>> all >>>>> for me. The docker tooling on OS X (my dev environment) is pretty awful, >>>>> the >>>>> same set of services aren’t available in App Engine and Managed VMs, and >>>>> basically I want the zero config of App Engine. >>>>> >>>>> This isn’t a lack of knowledge - I have a lot of experience managing >>>>> servers - it’s that I’ve got other more important things to do with my >>>>> time. >>>>> >>>>> The Python 2 to 3 transitions is great example where a public roadmap >>>>> would be very useful. They could state they'll have a Python 3 runtime >>>>> ready >>>>> in 2017 and then have a 3 year transition period and stop the Python 2 >>>>> runtime in 2020. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> +1 >>>>> >>>>> Karl >>>>> >>>>> On Saturday, April 18, 2015 at 1:18:48 PM UTC+2, Jay Kyburz wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> A port to a managed VM is a whole nother kettle of fish. If I do that >>>>>> I'm managing my own servers and might as well move anywhere. >>>>>> >>>>>> The simple fact is that 2.7 is on the way out, and if I want to >>>>>> continue to work in Python, I need a 5 year plan that has me port my >>>>>> applications to Python 3. >>>>>> >>>>>> My question to Google is, will I be working on App Engine, or do I >>>>>> have to go find another solution. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Saturday, 18 April 2015 19:19:54 UTC+10, Jeff Schnitzer wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can run Python3 already with Managed VMs, although the experience >>>>>>> today does not compare favorably to traditional GAE. I suspect the best >>>>>>> course of action is to file usability bugs against managed VMs until >>>>>>> they >>>>>>> work as well or better than what you're used to. More specific is >>>>>>> better. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jeff >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 9:19 PM, Jay Kyburz >>>>>>> <j...@jaykyburz.com>wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello Googlers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There is an interesting discussion today on Hacker News about how >>>>>>>> Debian has started moving from P2 to P3 because of the looming EOL >>>>>>>> deadline >>>>>>>> in 2020. >>>>>>>> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9388502 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Does anybody know if there are plans in the works to provide a >>>>>>>> Python 3 implementation of App Engine I can port my apps to sometime >>>>>>>> in the >>>>>>>> next 5 years. I've been searching around but can find nothing. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 5 years may sound like a long time to many of you, but the last 5 >>>>>>>> years of using App Engine have seemed to fly by for me. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have a lot of code to port and it might be a biggish job. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If Google is looking for more staff to handle the port I would be >>>>>>>> happy to contribute. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Jay. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to google-appengi...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to google-a...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine. >>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/google-appengine/a336be6a-f0e3-487f-aa4c-36dd8c1117c5%40googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to google-appengine+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to google-a...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/google-appengine/8c465186-d499-4df2-abf4-2551e16060eb%40googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to google-appengi...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to google-a...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/google-appengine/BCB5BEF3-E37F-4196-A979-9AB066CE1029%40rakkoon.com. >>>>> >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to google-appengi...@googlegroups.com. >>>> To post to this group, send email to google-a...@googlegroups.com. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/google-appengine/CADK-0uiPia5W_H_veOCpUvw9N9heuOeT4BX0hjn%2B9XY3iFsP2g%40mail.gmail.com. >>>> >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Andrew Jessup | Product Manager, Google Cloud Platform | >>> jes...@google.com > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Google App Engine" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to google-appengine+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to google-appengine@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/google-appengine/bd5d91f3-ea9d-45cc-9c73-a544993ca9ab%40googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- Emlyn http://point7.wordpress.com - My blog https://plus.google.com/u/0/100281903174934656260 - Google+ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Google App Engine" group. 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