Rob, I forgot to mention, are you going to attack GWT developers like Sumit Chandel that point GWT-ext and ExtGWT questions to those project's respective mailing lists?
-- Arthur Kalmenson On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Arthur Kalmenson <arthur.k...@gmail.com> wrote: > Rob, > >> There you go again sounding like a broken record. You really are quite >> thick headed aren't you? > > Perhaps instead of attacking _me_, you can point out where I'm wrong? > However, AFAIK they're still JSNI bindings and still don't work well > with regular GWT widgets or use the GWT event model. > >> If you take pleasure in constantly dissing other libraries, I'll do >> the same and reply to your every post saying that you are full of it. >> Deal? > > I'm not "dissing" other libraries. I'm not in grade school. This > mailing list is here to discuss GWT and surrounding technologies on a > technical level, not for personal attacks or "dissing" libraries. > >> You might make yourself more useful if you try to answer real >> questions on the group instead of increasing your post count with >> cruft. 90% of your posts are really just pointing people to the gwt- >> ext, ext-gwt forums and dissing these libraries at every single >> opportunity. > > I answer the redirecting questions because they take a few seconds to > answer and because those posts go days without being answered. I'd > prefer to at least point them in the right direction rather then leave > them hanging. If you take a look, I also answer other questions too. A > lot of them get answered before I get a chance to get to them. > > Anyway, this is growing tiresome. You need to stop taking this > personally, it has nothing to do with you. If you believe I'm wrong, > please point out the inaccuracies, otherwise, don't bother > responding. > > -- > Arthur Kalmenson > > > > On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 9:47 AM, Rob Smith <scubacarri...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> There you go again sounding like a broken record. You really are quite >> thick headed aren't you? >> >> If you take pleasure in constantly dissing other libraries, I'll do >> the same and reply to your every post saying that you are full of it. >> Deal? >> >> You might make yourself more useful if you try to answer real >> questions on the group instead of increasing your post count with >> cruft. 90% of your posts are really just pointing people to the gwt- >> ext, ext-gwt forums and dissing these libraries at every single >> opportunity. >> >> Rob >> >> >> On Dec 19, 9:04 am, "Arthur Kalmenson" <arthur.k...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> > So you've assumed responsibility for being the GWT saviour by >>> > educating these developers and saving their project? >>> >>> I'm not really assuming any responsibility, I'm just mentioning that >>> there are draw backs to using these libraries. >>> >>> > What makes you so qualified? >>> >>> I've had to abandon and rewrite a GWT-ext project because of the said >>> drawbacks. I've talked with many other people who had to rewrite >>> ExtGWT and GWT-ext projects. >>> >>> > You've expressed your opinion (more than once) so why >>> > not leave it at that. How would it appear if someone posted in >>> > response to your every post saying that Arthur is clueless? >>> >>> I don't believe I was insulting anyone. And while I've expressed my >>> opinion (which many here hold), many people are new and don't know the >>> downside of using these libraries. >>> >>> > Or the ZK >>> > guys saying that GWT sucks in their ads that are all over the place. >>> > Everyone is entitled to an opinion by going overboard is really not >>> > necessary. You know what they say about opinions and wanting to give >>> > them... And you've gone out of your way to voice your opinion even no >>> > one asked for it. >>> >>> How am I going overboard? Dave Ford's comment is indicative that >>> people appreciate hearing what the down sides are. In order for a >>> developer to make an informed decision, they need to hear all sides >>> and try it for themselves. >>> >>> > Try to take a deep breath and relax when these libraries are mentioned >>> > and ignore them instead of assuming the role of GWT gatekeeper. There >>> > have been stray email questions on various third party libraries like >>> > GChart and DnD. I don't see you jump in on those threads pointing to >>> > the appropriate forum. >>> >>> That's the thing, if I ignore the posts that tell people to use >>> ExtGWT, gwt-ext or SmartGWT, and no one bothers to warn them, they >>> might end up committing substantial resources to these projects and >>> then have to rewrite them or have them turn out poorly. For example, >>> see this >>> posthttp://groups.google.com/group/Google-Web-Toolkit/msg/7e3ad4486d103b94 >>> where the developer says load times are slow (it's even slow on my new >>> MacBook Pro). Had the developer used vanilla GWT, I doubt they would >>> have run into those problems. >>> >>> The biggest problem IMHO is that people use these third party >>> libraries and think they're using GWT. They find that it's slow and >>> buggy and attribute it to GWT. Then GWT ends up getting a bad >>> reputation. People who come to this mailing list need to understand >>> that ExtGWT, gwt-ext or SmartGWT have almost nothing to do with GWT >>> and everything to do with the JS libraries they either wrap or attempt >>> to mimic. That way, if they decide to use these libraries, they'll >>> understand that they're using that toolkit, and not GWT. >>> >>> If I see questions about other third party libraries that go >>> unanswered, I'll point them to the appropriate mailing list (if one >>> exists). I can't catch and respond to every post. >>> >>> Anyway, I'm tired of arguing this point. If you like and use gwt-ext, >>> that's up to you. Try not to get so upset when someone points out its >>> flaws. >>> -- >>> Arthur Kalmenson >>> >>> On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:46 AM, Rob Smith <scubacarri...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> > Arthur, >>> > So you've assumed responsibility for being the GWT saviour by >>> > educating these developers and saving their project? What makes you >>> > so qualified? You've expressed your opinion (more than once) so why >>> > not leave it at that. How would it appear if someone posted in >>> > response to your every post saying that Arthur is clueless? Or the ZK >>> > guys saying that GWT sucks in their ads that are all over the place. >>> > Everyone is entitled to an opinion by going overboard is really not >>> > necessary. You know what they say about opinions and wanting to give >>> > them... And you've gone out of your way to voice your opinion even no >>> > one asked for it. >>> >>> > Try to take a deep breath and relax when these libraries are mentioned >>> > and ignore them instead of assuming the role of GWT gatekeeper. There >>> > have been stray email questions on various third party libraries like >>> > GChart and DnD. I don't see you jump in on those threads pointing to >>> > the appropriate forum. >>> >>> > Rob >>> >>> > Full disclosure : I am a contributor to gwt-ext by mostly >>> > participating in their forums. >>> >>> > On Dec 18, 8:54 am, "Arthur Kalmenson" <arthur.k...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >> Hi Rob, >>> >>> >> Judging from cloudcity's response, not everyone is aware of the draw >>> >> backs of these libraries (or, as you put it, my position on them). >>> >> Ignoring an issue is not going to make it go away. I'm letting people >>> >> know what the draw backs of using these libraries are, because a lot >>> >> of people are impressed by the shininess but are unaware of the >>> >> numerous problems. Anyway, I'm not here to start a flame war, I'm just >>> >> trying to warn people before they commit all their resources to these >>> >> libraries. >>> >>> >> -- >>> >> Arthur Kalmenson >>> >>> >> On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 4:36 PM, Rob Smith <scubacarri...@gmail.com> >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> >> > Did anyone ask you opinion on use of third part libs in this thread. >>> >> > We know what your position is on using 3rd party libs and you have >>> >> > made it clear "numerous" times. Repeating the same thing again and >>> >> > again is just adding noise to this group. Gmail has a wonderful filter >>> >> > option and you can set yours to ignore any thread that mentions any >>> >> > lib that you don't care about :) >>> >>> >> > On Dec 17, 3:34 pm, "Arthur Kalmenson" <arthur.k...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >> >> I'm hoping that a lot of those things will be added to the incubator >>> >> >> in the near future. I've mentioned the request for simpler security >>> >> >> similar to Spring Security's @Secured("ROLE_USER") annotations. Data >>> >> >> binding and validation frameworks are on their way as well, in the >>> >> >> near future. >>> >>> >> >> I would stay away from ExtGWT or SmartGWT though. >>> >>> >> >> -- >>> >> >> Arthur Kalmenson >>> >>> >> >> On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 9:54 AM, mikedshaf...@gmail.com >>> >>> >> >> <mikedshaf...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >> >> > This does bring up a good point and something that is sourly >>> >> >> > missing. >>> >> >> > We have cobbled together some very generic type stuff patterned >>> >> >> > (albeit very low in quality) what we used extensively in Eclipse >>> >> >> > Rich >>> >> >> > Client. Maybe the ExtGWT guys or SmartGWT will come up with >>> >> >> > something. Or if the Eclipse Web Client guys would do GWT.... Or >>> >> >> > if >>> >> >> > I could find a spare moment or two, I'd take it on. The whole UI >>> >> >> > framework beyond "widgets", like editors, views, menus, actions etc. >>> >> >> > is a sweet spot to be sure that is missing from any of the web >>> >> >> > frameworks, IMHO. >>> >>> >> >> > On Dec 17, 6:54 am, "Arthur Kalmenson" <arthur.k...@gmail.com> >>> >> >> > wrote: >>> >> >> >> There are some things in the incubator for status bars and logging. >>> >> >> >> The rest you would have to do yourself. >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >>> >> >> >> Arthur Kalmenson >>> >>> >> >> >> On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 2:17 AM, Riyaz Mansoor >>> >> >> >> <riyaz.mans...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >> >> >> > I'm not looking for rich widget sets (Ext, Smart, etc) but >>> >> >> >> > rather is >>> >> >> >> > there a GWT framework that provides basics for a RIA. One that >>> >> >> >> > handles >>> >> >> >> > the grunt work such as providing; status bar, xml or other >>> >> >> >> > configurable menu, error logging report, authentication, >>> >> >> >> > security etc >>> >>> >> >> >> > This maybe reaching for the sky but kinda like what Eclipse or >>> >> >> >> > Netbeans provides as the core platform when developing on those >>> >> >> >> > platforms.- Hide quoted text - >>> >>> >> >> >> - Show quoted text - >> >> >> > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Google Web Toolkit" group. To post to this group, send email to Google-Web-Toolkit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to google-web-toolkit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Google-Web-Toolkit?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
