Thank you for looking into this, Hal - for getting on the phone and doing the research.
Although more expensive, they will last a hell of a lot longer - have you seen samples? I was *blown away* by Thermax HD. V> -- *Vinay Gupta * * hexay...@gmail.com <hexay...@gmail.com> * *http://re.silience.com* <http://re.silience.com> *Free Science and Engineering in the Global Public Interest* UK Cell : +44 (0)7500 895568 Twitter/Skype/Gtalk: hexayurt "In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was in me an invincible summer" - Albert Camus On Fri, Feb 14, 2014 at 10:25 PM, hal muskat <phoe...@rainbowpuddle.com>wrote: > Just off the phone with RMax. Home Depot does not carry their line of fire > retardant panels. They are available through their partner in Sacramento. > > That's the good news. > > The bad news is these panels are between 2 and 3 x's the cost. > > Phoenix > > > > > On Feb 10, 2014, at 1:37 AM, Vinay Gupta (Hexayurt Shelter Project) wrote: > > > So here's what we've heard, J: when you get a fire in a room insulated > with polyiso, the reflective foil keeps the heat inside, bouncing back and > forwards between the walls, and it gets *really* hot really quickly. Once > it reaches the gasification point of the polyiso sheets (literally the > boiling point of the polyiso boards!) they go up *hard*. > > I suspect in a full sized hexayurt that effect would take a while to build > up and people have to walk a grand total of 10 feet to get out, so it's not > likely a danger to life. But I worry that with a couple of thousand units > deployed, eventually we're going to find this out the hard way. And as we > see more and more large hexayurt complexes - are there adequate fire doors? > Are tight-packed units all going to burn if one goes? > > I worry about these things. > > *All hexayurts should at least have a smoke alarm fitted. It's $10 and > gives a real margin of safety. Could we try and get that standardized this > year?* > > I think a pup hexayurt (remember woody's one sheet design) with a small > camp fire inside would be a pretty good test at reasonable cost. The stuff > certainly doesn't light easily, or I wouldn't have picked it, but law of > large numbers is catching up with us. > > V> > > -- > *Vinay Gupta * * hexay...@gmail.com <hexay...@gmail.com> * > *http://re.silience.com* <http://re.silience.com/> > *Free Science and Engineering in the Global Public Interest* > UK Cell : +44 (0)7500 895568 Twitter/Skype/Gtalk: hexayurt > "In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was > in me an invincible summer" - Albert Camus > > > On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 3:53 AM, Julie Danger <juliedan...@gmail.com>wrote: > >> About this fire issue: I've read some craaaaaaazy sounding specs about >> fires inside hexayurts possibly reaching a bazillion degrees. Can anyone >> back this information up? And, I'm considering a sacrificial research burn >> at illumination of a small hexayurt to test this theory-- possibly Monday >> post burn, 9 pm, illumination village, bring a lawn chair and some booze. >> >> >> >> *This from "hexayurt safety information" >> <http://www.appropedia.org/index.php?title=Hexayurt_Safety_Information&action=history>* >> Important safety notice. Please do not build hexayurts out of any >> flammable material. This goes double for foam! In the past, people have >> built them from non-fire rated materials including polyisocyanurate >> insulation (Tuff-R from Dow, often sold at Home Depot.) I do not regard >> that as safe if the building is exposed to sources of ignition like open >> flame, or mains electrical devices. Any non-fire rated substance should not >> be used for camping, and is generally suitable only for demonstration >> purposes. >> >> Although free-standing foam may not burn well, an enclosure made of foam >> can burn catastrophically. The foam traps the heat, reflecting it back to >> the fire and quickly igniting the entire building. According to this >> article <http://static.monolithic.com/foam/fire_hazard/index.html>, >> temperatures can reach 10,000 degrees and buildings have literally been >> blown apart by the sheer force of the flames. Warehouse-sized buildings can >> be fully engulfed in under five minutes. The article is about urethane >> foam, but polyisocyanurate will probably behave similarly. >> http://static.monolithic.com/foam/fire_hazard/index.html >> >> Here is some video of a sheet of R-MAX (which is very similar to Tuff-R) >> being set on fire. As expected, it does not burn well in open air. However, >> this should not give a false sense of security about foam-lined buildings. >> Foam manufacturers used to think their foam was "self-extinguishing" - but >> in an enclosed space, it is not. >> >> http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=36DB80EAF1D4161B >> >> (shot by Arthur Zwern of http://progressivebuildingsolutions.com) >> >> In addition, bidirectional filament tape has turned out to be >> *very*flammable, and burns hot enough to ignite Tuff-R type insulation. This >> is a >> "negative synergy" - the two materials together are more of a fire risk >> than either alone, because the fast-burning tape can ignite the boards. We >> highly recommend covering all exposed filament tape with foil tape, which >> is a few dollars a roll at Home Depot and similar places. >> >> >> http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt/browse_thread/thread/99fbdd6cf9ddaca8has >> pictures of the test conducted by Spiral which revealed this problem. >> Thanks, Spiral! >> >> Estimation of fire risk for any given situation is a decision that only >> the person building the hexayurt can make. I recommend you watch the video, >> get a clear sense of what's going on, and make your own judgments. All we >> do is make the information available, and you make the decision. Please, >> put in the extra work and source the safest possible materials. This is >> your responsibility. >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 7:09 AM, <hexayurt@googlegroups.com> wrote: >> >>> Today's Topic Summary >>> >>> Group: http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt/topics >>> >>> - Bulk purchasing Thermax HD or other fire-safe hexayurt materials[1 >>> Update] >>> - framed hexayurts [1 Update] >>> >>> Bulk purchasing Thermax HD or other fire-safe hexayurt >>> materials<http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt/t/f32ad9329f47d272> >>> >>> Lance Culp <lanc...@hotmail.com> Feb 05 12:30AM >>> >>> Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2014 23:34:13 -0800 >>> Subject: Re: [hexayurt] Bulk purchasing Thermax HD or other >>> fire-safe hexayurt materials >>> From: neversph...@gmail.com >>> To: hexayurt@googlegroups.com >>> >>> Sound like a plan. Any ballpark idea of what the minimum order would >>> be? >>> On Feb 1, 2014 8:13 AM, "Richard Ginn" <richardg...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> Let's make a list of all the suppliers and what their minimum order >>> is, and what price breaks we would get at what volumes of purchase. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Feb 1, 2014 at 9:06 AM, Vinay Gupta (Hexayurt Shelter >>> Project) <hexay...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> They're tougher. >>> They're not that much more expensive. >>> They won't catch fire. >>> I feel like this would be a great year to actually fix the supply >>> chain issues around Thermax HD (or equivalents from other manufacturers), >>> do a container load bulk purchase, and start moving people off R-MAX etc. >>> until there's a comprehensive solution for the fire risk. I really want >>> to >>> solve this problem before somebody gets hurt. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> http://www.appropedia.org/Hexayurt_Safety_Information >>> >>> Vinay >>> -- >>> Vinay Gupta >>> >>> >>> >>> Free Science and Engineering in the Global Public Interest >>> >>> >>> http://bit.ly/gupta_arc - the Gupta State Failure Management Archive >>> http://bit.ly/gupta_ark - or see it directly on Archive.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> http://hexayurt.com - free/open next generation human sheltering >>> http://hexayurt.com/plan - the whole systems, big picture vision >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was in me an >>> invincible summer" - Albert Camus >>> >>> Twitter/Skype/Gizmo/Gtalk/AIM: hexayurt >>> UK Cell : +44 (0) 7500 895568 / USA VOIP (+1) 775-743-1851 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "hexayurt" group. >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>> send an email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >>> >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "hexayurt" group. >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>> send an email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >>> >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "hexayurt" group. >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>> send an email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >>> >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> >>> framed >>> hexayurts<http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt/t/2535008f8316a1af> >>> >>> dylan toymaker <dylan.toyma...@gmail.com> Feb 04 09:09AM -0800 >>> >>> For anyone who wants to use stick framing techniques for hexayurts, >>> i found a set of metal brackets to make it way easier. >>> >>> http://www.strongtie.com/products/DIY/GT2-GT6-GTF.html# >>> >>> scroll down to see the full system gallery. >>> >>> >>> Dylan >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "hexayurt" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "hexayurt" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "hexayurt" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "hexayurt" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to hexayurt+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to hexayurt@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "hexayurt" group. 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