You guys act as if changing the hard limit is easy. There's all sorts of resource management issues that would need to be resolved and a lot of the engine would need adjustment. Let's wait to play the game before we start thinking about overhauling things to change it. On Aug 14, 2012 3:16 PM, "Ryan Stecker" <voidedwea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I third this. I think it'd open the door to making some interesting > missions involving more players and more bots. > > On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 1:51 PM, Nomaan Ahmad <n0man....@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I agree with 1nsane. > > > > On 14 August 2012 19:50, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Like Asher mentioned above, could you consider increasing the limit. So > > we > > > could better experiment with this mode? > > > Perhaps include a warning similar to how players are warned about > joining > > > servers higher than 24 slots. > > > > > > On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 1:00 PM, Fletcher Dunn > > > <fletch...@valvesoftware.com>wrote: > > > > > > > We will not have Steam group functionality tomorrow. > > > > > > > > You actually have to set maxplayers to 32 to host MvM (to make room > for > > > > all the bots). That's why the mode is expensive CPU-wise, to not > only > > > > simulate all those players but run their AI logic as well. We'll > have > > > more > > > > details on the recommended settings tomorrow. > > > > > > > > Regarding exactly what happens if a 24-player server switches to MvM: > > I > > > > actually don't think we have worked that out yet. > > > > > > > > I'm pretty sure on day one there will be lots of people trying out > all > > > > sorts of things. Our approach to experimentation in MvM will be the > > same > > > > as in PvP: we encourage it, provided that players are opting in to > any > > > > major deviations from the vanilla experience. Our servers will all > be > > > > configured vanilla, and the matchmaking will enforce the 6 player > > limit, > > > > and the server browser will be the primary means for players to find > > > those > > > > sorts of customizations. What will the most interesting > customizations > > > be? > > > > What will the standard tags be used that we request server operators > > to > > > > set in order to help players find the modifications they want or > avoid > > > the > > > > ones they don't like? We can't know that yet. That's something we > > > expect > > > > you guys and your players to figure out. > > > > > > > > I will hazard a guess that raising the player count well above 6 > would > > be > > > > detrimental the experience. There ratio of humans to bots would be > off > > > and > > > > the human defending team would not have enough challenge. (As an > > extreme > > > > example: imagine a 32-player server where everybody is defending an > > there > > > > are no bots.) Exactly how far it can be raised above 6 without > totally > > > > breaking the game is speculation of course. I think a smart server > > > > operator will start out with the server configured relatively > vanilla, > > > and > > > > then watch how the game unfolds and listen to their players, and try > to > > > > make smart decisions about which areas to experiment, rather than > > > assuming > > > > the same sorts of adjustments your community prefers in PvP will > > > > automatically apply to this mode. A fun co-op mode with more than > six > > > > players is likely to require entirely new missions. (The mission > > decides > > > > the pattern of enemy robots that come at you.) We have purposefully > > made > > > > it easy for players to create their own missions. (It's a lot easier > > > than > > > > creating a whole new map!) But if you play with more than six > players, > > > > with the missions we've made, I think the balance will be way off. > > > > > > > > - Fletch > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto: > > > > hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Saint K. > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 4:51 AM > > > > To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list > > > > Subject: Re: [hlds] TF MvM hosting questions > > > > > > > > Will we be able to restrict a MvM server to people in the steamgroup > > > only, > > > > like in L4D2? > > > > > > > > Saint K. > > > > ________________________________________ > > > > From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [ > > > > hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Fletcher Dunn [ > > > > fletch...@valvesoftware.com] > > > > Sent: 14 August 2012 08:52 > > > > To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life > dedicated > > > > Win32 server mailing list (h...@list.valvesoftware.com) > > > > Subject: Re: [hlds] TF MvM hosting questions > > > > > > > > MvM matchmaking will be restricted to 6 players at launch. > > > > > > > > The matchmaking also supports joining games in progress to fill an > > empty > > > > slot, in which case of course the current map will not be changed. > > > > > > > > From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto: > > > > hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Agro > > > > Sent: Monday, August 13, 2012 11:40 PM > > > > To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list > > > > Subject: Re: [hlds] TF MvM hosting questions > > > > > > > > Is MvM matchmaking going to be limited to 6 players or was the "6 > > players > > > > join, map changes" logic just an indicator of server behavior to > > expect? > > > > ----- Reply message ----- > > > > From: "Fletcher Dunn" <fletch...@valvesoftware.com<mailto: > > > > fletch...@valvesoftware.com>> > > > > To: "Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list ( > > > > hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto: > > > hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com>)" > > > > <hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto: > > > > hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com>>, "Half-Life dedicated Win32 > server > > > > mailing list (h...@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto: > > > > h...@list.valvesoftware.com>)" <h...@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto: > > > > h...@list.valvesoftware.com>> > > > > Subject: [hlds] TF MvM hosting questions > > > > Date: Tue, Aug 14, 2012 06:39 > > > > > > > > Here are some answers to questions regarding hosting MvM servers: > > > > > > > > * Players can join your server through any means they can join PvP > > games: > > > > the server browser, ad hoc joins, or the new matchmaking system > > > (quickplay > > > > beta). > > > > * To accept matchmaking traffic, you must select which sort of > traffic > > > you > > > > want. (Regular PvP traffic or MvM traffic.) Set "tf_mm_servermode > 2" > > to > > > > be placed in the MvM pool. > > > > * For MvM matchmaking, if 6 players are sent to your server to start > a > > > new > > > > game, it will switch to whatever map the players selected. > > > > * You will need a TF gameserver account to accept matchmaking > traffic. > > > > * You can switch the server in and out of any matchmaking mode pool > or > > > > back to any regular game mode at any time. > > > > * The CPU usage for a 6 player MvM game is about the same as for a > > > regular > > > > TF server. (Yep, this mode requires significantly more CPU cycles > per > > > > player than the PvP mode, that's an unfortunate fact.) > > > > > > > > Given the surge of players that comes with any major release, and the > > > > player / server ratio of this game mode, the demand for MvM servers > > will > > > > probably be high. We expect that a large number of players will want > > to > > > > try out the new mode, so we will be converting most of our servers to > > > host > > > > MvM, and then adjust the allocation based on what players are > playing. > > > > > > > > I, for one, DO NOT welcome our new robot overlords! > > > > > > > > - Fletch > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > > please visit: > > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > > please visit: > > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > > please visit: > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
