The simple physics says it cannot be so, but someone acquainted with the full physics of sound might know the explanation. Is it possible, for example, that all the overtones are NOT in tune with each other, and that by attenuating the higher (sharper?) tones makes the average or perceived note flatter? I don't know. Is there a complication due to the fact that a non-continuous tone has a mathematically indistinct frequency, a spread of higher and lower frequencies, the perception of which can be affected by distance? (Check out Fourier transforms, if you want to venture into some non-simple physics -things are not always as they seem.) Again, I don't know.
For churches with the organ at the rear and the choir in the front, are there always problems? If you had two horns playing a duet at either end, trying to tune to each other, would you always find their slides pushed in all the way afterwards, still complaining about the other guy being flat? I have no experience here - I'm genuinely curious. It's Memorial Day here in the US. We've had some severe weather, but for today, the sun has come out, the floodwaters are receding, and I'm heading out for a long ride on my bicycle. "Flat" would be especially unwelcome. Curt On May 30, 2011, at 8:42 AM, Hans Pizka <[email protected]> wrote: > They do not sound flat to themselves but are heard flat when their playing is > arriving at the pit. So they are told to adjust a bit. This is an generation > old fact, > no matter what physics say. > > If the off stage players adjust tuning, they sound right in pitch with the > orchestra. > You might be right with the physics, but physics does not matter at all, if > the > stage band is out of tune related to the orchestra. > > I found out why that happen: because the stage is built FLAT. > Ha-ha-ho-hoh. Hojotohoo ! > > How is it with the rights & rules ? See the traffic accident at the > crossroad. > Equal ranking roads. "I was coming from the right & could go first because > the other driver came from left. I had the right on my side, but it does not > matter, > because I am dead now !" - common knowledge. > ############################################### > > Am 30.05.2011 um 14:02 schrieb Herbert Foster: > >> Hans, >> >> Either you have misremembered what they taught--physics is not your fach or >> specialty, or they mistaught you. Sound frequency does not change with >> distance >> from the source. If you are playing a 440 A, you are emitting 440 pulses per >> second. Far away those pulses don't get lost, and there are still 440 per >> second. There are theories that light does get "tired" after billions of >> years >> in addition to the Doppler effect of the receding galaxies, but we're not in >> that arena. >> >> The effect may indeed be psychological. Timbre does affect the perception of >> pitch. If anything, when you are playing on a hot stage, I would expect you >> to >> play sharp. So much for theory... >> >> Question: Do the onstage players sound flat to themselves, or is it that >> they >> sound flat to the audience? >> >> Herb Foster >> >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: Hans Pizka <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected]; The Horn List <[email protected]> >> Sent: Sun, May 29, 2011 2:48:24 PM >> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] offstage brass >> >> Loss of higher harmonics due to less good acoustic environment, yes, as >> curtains can damp the sound. >> >> But how should this affect the intonation ? 440 remains 440, no matter >> what kind of curtain or deco they use on stage. >> >> Higher harmonics have nothing to do with that problem. >> >> But the distance effects (lowers) the intonation of a given pitch. We all >> learned that in school (classic gymnasium, physics classes) which seem to >> be abandoned in a greater percentage of schools. >> >> ############################################# >> Am 29.05.2011 um 19:47 schrieb Dan Beeker: >> >>> Surely there must be more to it than "because of the distance". Does >>> that mean the listener in the back of the auditorium hears things >>> flatter than the patron in the front row? Loss of higher harmonics due >>> to stage curtains etc. might make it sound flatter (total conjecture on >>> my part). Just curious. Any acoustics people out there have an explanation? >>> >>> Dan Beeker >>> >>> On 5/29/11 1:00 PM, [email protected] wrote: >>>> Message: 11 >>>> Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 16:22:54 +0200 >>>> From: Hans Pizka<[email protected]> >>>> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] offstage brass >>>> To: The Horn List<[email protected]> >>>> Message-ID:<[email protected]> >>>> Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII >>>> >>>> Bob, welcome in Germany, >>>> >>>> the off stage brass sounds flat to the player on stage because of the >>>> distance. >>>> But it is not much. >>>> So the off stage players adjust the main tuning slide a bit, just a bit >>>> (1/4" >>>> perhaps). >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> Hans >>> >>> -- >>> Dan Beeker >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> post: [email protected] >>> unsubscribe or set options at >>> https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/hpizka%40me.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> post: [email protected] >> unsubscribe or set options at >> https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/herb_foster%40yahoo.com >> _______________________________________________ >> post: [email protected] >> unsubscribe or set options at >> https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/hpizka%40me.com > > _______________________________________________ > post: [email protected] > unsubscribe or set options at > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/curtissaustin%40me.com _______________________________________________ post: [email protected] unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
