Hi,
Thanks a lot guys.
The discussion has been very helpful.
We have decided to go ahead with JSP. One of the reasons also being that we
already have some people with JSP expertise.
We do have a tight schedule, but after considering our design, I think it
wouldn't be a problem to get the portal over in time
This was my first qeustion on the list and i am really thankful to everyone
for the prompt and valuable response.
Regards
Ruta
----- Original Message -----
From: Duffey, Kevin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2000 12:45 PM
Subject: Re: ASP vs JSP
> Well said. ;)
>
> I am not one sided..I wrote code with ActiveX, COM, and such for a while.
> But if you are true to your knowledge, anyone will admit that Java is much
> cleaner code than C/C++ (easier to read, easier to understand, easier to
> write), and JSP/Servlets are far easier to understand than COM. Plus,
while
> in-process is possible with DLLs, you don't see the whole server going
down
> if a servlet craps out (not usually). COM was (and is) notorious (at least
> on the web side) for bringing down IIS if something goes wrong with the
> component (memory overwrite, etc). I know this from experience..we had
> nightmares when using this technology. Its much different with Java, thats
> for sure.
>
> Can you honestly say VBScript is easier to work with than Java scriplets
in
> the pages? I saw plenty of VBScript code and its much harder to understand
> (initially). Does VBScript allow you the full access to the Windows APIs
in
> an ASP page? I don't think so. JSP does allow you full access to the JDK
> Apis, even though its not exactly best to put that in JSP pages.
>
> There are pros/cons to both technologies. I'll be the first to admit I
> haven't read up on ASP+, so I can't say if that will be better. The 3rd
> party tools for ASP aren't all there either..they work sometimes, but not
as
> reliable as they are on the Windows platform. How many people are going to
> go the route of (as Rick said) a closed architecture proprietary setup
when
> J2EE is making such a huge impact on the industry. I have yet to see any
> other implementation of ASP other than MS, and thats bad. Your stuck with
> whatever they choose.
>
> Anyways..nuff said. JSP is better! ;)
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Rick Jesse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 9:42 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: ASP vs JSP
> >
> >
> > My reponse is, JSP is an open architecture, based on a
> > published *SPEC* with
> > many, many commerical and open source implementations. You
> > can judge an
> > implementation by determining spec compliance and going from there
> > (performance, etc.).
> >
> > Where is the ASP or ASP+ spec? I'm not talking about
> > documentation on how to
> > use the stuff, but a spec that explains the design, the
> > capabilities, and
> > how its supposed to work in the abstract. (Any body ever seen
> > the BNF for
> > the VB language, or a spec on VB/ASP from MS???) How many platforms
> > does/will ASP+ run on (How many platforms does VB run on?)?
> > Will you have to
> > use RAD tools to get the most out of it or can you use a text
> > editor and
> > command line and get the same level of capabilities if you
> > wish? Will the
> > runtime and design-time of ASP+ somehow be intertwined (in an
> > unpublished
> > way) so that MS tools will have the advantage over 3rd party
> > tools for first
> > 2 or 3 releases (how many 3rd part VB RAD tools do you know
> > of)? When will
> > the *SOURCE CODE* to ASP or ASP+ MS implemenation be
> > available anytime soon?
> > What open process is in place so that I, as an ISV, can make
> > recommendations
> > to ASP or ASP+?
> >
> > JSP may be rather primitive, but every developer -- not ones
> > with special
> > access because they've agreed to be MS partners, etc. -- can
> > know how JSP is
> > supposed to work and not be dependent on a single
> > implementation. That's why
> > everyone is using it. They have choices and options because
> > its an OPEN
> > architecture.
> >
> > There is a huge, huge, difference between Java and VB on the level of
> > openness and architectural concientiousness. (Question: if I
> > wanted to use a
> > hash table in VB, does anyone know off hand what's available
> > in MS VB? --
> > get real!!!) Please do not equate them. Furthermore, ASP or
> > ASP+ will never
> > match up with JSP/Servlets because ASP and ASP+ inheriently closed and
> > proprietary -- no spec, source code, or cross platform
> > implemenation has
> > ever been released for these MS technologies.
> >
> > Forget the MS stuff... I have not seen or heard of one
> > serious, commerical
> > web architecture in the last two years that has any MS
> > product in the entire
> > architecture. No one wants to be limited by a closed
> > architecture. Let's put
> > is this way, if your pissed with the bugs or performance of
> > your NT based
> > ASP implementation, what alternatives to you have?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Nasser Dassi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2000 8:06 PM
> > Subject: Re: ASP vs JSP
> >
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > > I beg to differ on a few points mentioned between ASP and JSP.
> > >
> > > The transition is dependent on which scripting language
> > someone is more
> > > comfortable with (Java/JavaScript or Visual Basic)...
> > that's a given. But
> > > as far as usability, it entirely depends on the
> > configuration you would
> > like
> > > to go with. Although ASP is Microsoft-specific (although that is no
> > longer
> > > true with advent of 3rd Party software packages aimed at Unix-based
> > servers
> > > to adopt ASP & PerlScript), ASP+ and all the new bells and
> > whistles that
> > > will become available along the MS platforms would
> > quantitatively and
> > > qualitatively match up with the JSP potentials (as far as
> > what is being
> > > produced today, not next year).
> > >
> > > In the end, they are equal: ASP+ allows an entire OS to
> > be your web
> > > application... JSP, too, brings a Unix or Java-based OS to
> > become your web
> > > application, too. To either, snap on an XML-based
> > database, and if your
> > > code is created with attention and possibility of
> > expansion, then it, too,
> > > will become platform independent (as ASP applications can
> > be ported... and
> > > JSP applications can be moved).
> > >
> > > Important to point out: Although security is 'serious'
> > with Microsoft,
> > it
> > > must be noted that it is still proprietary... which means
> > experts must
> > > decode the code......... for Open Source platforms and
> > applications, the
> > > code is already decoded -- it just becomes a matter of
> > placing a sign over
> > > the open doors, or making a door and recompiling the kernel.
> > >
> > > Ultimately, being an eCommerce VB/ASP developer for 7
> > years, and an
> > > eCommerce Java/JSP developer for over a year, I found my
> > transition quite
> > > straightforward.
> > >
> > > Final Point: If your application is properly programmed
> > (designed), it
> > > wouldn't matter whether it's created with ASP or JSP. Wait
> > until ASP+ has
> > > been fully released before delving into it... if you cannot
> > wait, begin
> > with
> > > the language you are more comfortable with (ASP or JSP).
> > >
> > > Yours Truly,
> > > Nasser
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Duffey, Kevin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2000 8:17 PM
> > > Subject: Re: ASP vs JSP
> > >
> > >
> > > > I would be to differ. JSP is much easier to use than ASP
> > if you know
> > Java.
> > > > If your more a Windows/Visual Basic person than ASP will
> > be easier. I
> > find
> > > > JSP much easier to work with and offers a lot more than
> > ASP does in the
> > > way
> > > > of functionality. You get the full JDK available (if you
> > want), as well
> > as
> > > > the power of using it on any platform (as you said) which
> > can ultimately
> > > > give you much more powerful servers, thus increase performance,
> > > reliability,
> > > > and scalability. COM is inherently more complex to work with than
> > > JavaBeans
> > > > and EJB, although EJB isn't a piece of cake either. Even
> > is ASP+ is
> > > compiled
> > > > into some format, its still tied to Windows, while your
> > JSP code can
> > move
> > > > not only to any platform, but to any app server that
> > implements J2EE on
> > > that
> > > > platform. So now you are free to choose the platform AND
> > the software to
> > > run
> > > > your code with. Plus, I am quite sure Java/EJB is, or
> > will soon have
> > much
> > > > more support for enterprise development than
> > MTS/ASP/COM/DCOM. There is
> > a
> > > > reason Java is now the #1 sought after development
> > language and a large
> > > > number of companies are flocking to J2EE. J2EE is made up
> > of many big
> > > > companies (and many small ones), while MTS/ASP and all
> > that jazz is
> > > strictly
> > > > MS. This is one place I think MS wont come close on. They
> > have lost this
> > > war
> > > > of enterprise solutions in my opinion. There are still a
> > lot of people
> > > that
> > > > are solid MS and anti-java, but there are a lot more realizing the
> > > potential
> > > > for java based solutions.
> > > ...
> > >
> > >
> > ==============================================================
> > =============
> > > To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff
> > JSP-INTEREST".
> > > Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at:
> > >
> > > http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html
> > > http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html
> > > http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP
> > > http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
> >
> > ==============================================================
> > =============
> > To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body:
> > "signoff JSP-INTEREST".
> > Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at:
> >
> > http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html
> > http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html
> > http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP
> > http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
> >
>
>
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> To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff
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> Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at:
>
> http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html
> http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html
> http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP
> http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
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Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at:
http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html
http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html
http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP
http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
