On 26/10/2013 16:52, Hans-Peter Diettrich wrote: > Marco van de Voort schrieb: > >>>> In this class, all this simply ate too much time, and even after >>>> students >>>> were ackward with it. And it was only 9 x 1.5 hr, then an hour is >>>> still too >>>> much. >>> Then a good ole homecomputer (C64 emulator...) would be more useful ;-) >> >> Same problem as with an Dos emulator for TP. Concepts too alien, install >> troubles etc. > > Problems are quite different. A full DOS emulator includes a lot of low > level stuff (running real-mode programs, disk formatting, > networking...), that is not required for program development. A C64 or > similar emulator can use virtual devices instead, interprets also the > programs to run, and screen output is simple with a (fixed size) paintbox. > > My experience with development systems also suggests an installation in > a virtual machine. VM software installation is extremely simple, > compared to an FPC/Lazarus installation and configuration, and a single > VM can contain a fully installed and configured development system, > ready for educational use. When somebody succeeded in breaking his > system, a simple restore of the initial VM state allows to proceed > normally within seconds (sandbox). > > At the same time the students can learn about virtual machines > (optional), which later also should be used in professional software > development. A VM is insensitive to hardware replacement/upgrade, and > allows continued use of a specific compiler version. See the persistent > trouble with RadStudio installations, caused by upgrades of either > Delphi or Windows - currently Win8.1 causes such trouble, and on Linux > it will be ongoing GUI (gtk...) upgrades. > > Plus a VM can be isolated perfectly from the real world, unreachable by > NSA and other exploits and attacks (Merkel... ;-) > > >> I was actually flabbergasted by how little pre existing >> knowledge/experience >> the avg student understood of the console concept. And that was in >> 2005-7, >> now it will be even less. > > Nowadays cloud experience is more important than DOS experience. How > many jobs will you find later, wich require DOS experience and coding, > compared to the many jobs for writing (mobile) GUI and cloud applications? > > >>>> Delphi on the other hand invited too much play. >>> This energy could be used in extra (voluntary) courses, where the >>> interested can learn more about using Delphi. >> >> This energy does not exist outside mandatory classes :-) > > It exists, it's only a matter of motivation. Let the students suggest > projects of *their* interest, then teach them the useful techniques for > their projects - learning by doing can be mere fun :-) > > DoDi > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Lazarus mailing list > Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org > http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus >
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