John,
I find all this history wonderfully fascinating. Would you be willing to stay
in contact with me via my personal email? I would be very interested to
incorporate this kind of info in my family history when I get that far back.
Erin
----- Original Message -----
From: John Clare
To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com
Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2008 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Entering English Locations
My apologies for being sharp, but Britain did not have a system created in
the 17th and 18th centuries for its naming conventions and the name can be
important in understanding the history.
The county of Kent was invaded by the Jutes in roughly 600 to 700 AD and they
got no further than Kent. How do we know; first, there are excavations along
the border between Surrey and Sussex on one side and Kent on the other which
show battle graves dating from the period, but also the place names change.
Harbours in Kent are called Ramsgate and Margate for instance, harbours in
Sussex are called Havens - Newhaven for instance. Towns in some areas finish in
-ton whereas in other areas they can be -burghs or -burys. Places such as
Manchester, Lancaster, Chester derive their names from the latin castra for a
fort. The many places called Eccles refer to Roman sites of churches
(ecclesiastes)
Until Chaucer in about 1400, the English language was so diverse that no one
could write something which could be understood be more than a small proportion
of the population. A hill could be a brae, a tor, a hill, a cop or any of
another dozen names. Rivers are the same.
Their names today are a distant echo of their history and work is being done
to relate the names to the people. DNA testing of long term families is also
being used to work alongside this.
I feel it is important to preserve these links and to investigate them.
Naming conventions can help to preserve that history so that, when the experts
find more about places, you will be able to benefit by preserving the name in
your addresses and then extending the history.
I will now get off my hobby-horse
John
2008/9/13 RICHARD SCHULTHIES <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Ooops.
Rich in LA CA
--- On Sat, 9/13/08, John Clare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> From: John Clare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Entering English Locations
> To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com
> Date: Saturday, September 13, 2008, 11:43 AM
> That one is simple enough, Windsor Castle is in Windsor,
> which is in
> Berkshire (shire not county).It is not in London, it is not
> in Greater
> London and it is not in Middlesex ( and never ever has
> been). Surely simple
> enough even for a Californian.
> John
>
> 2008/9/13 RICHARD SCHULTHIES <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > I am in the process of changing my locations concepts.
> > So for non-USA places, I am using, in general,
> Country, Province/County,
> > Parish, Sub-parish/named-farm/named-building. For UK
> sites, the best
> > examples are the castles. (Trick question). Is it :
> > Windsor Castle, Windsor, Berkshire, England
> > Windsor Castle, London, Greater London, England
> > Windsor Castle, London, Middlesex, England
> > I am not going to solve this quagmire they have
> created, everyone 'knows'
> > where it is? I don't care.
> > Within the same 'building' there may be
> multiple chapels, 'hospital wards',
> > 'entombment in the walls and floors', etc.,
> which each may/may not record
> > the BMDs done there separately.
> > When I realized that I will rarely be using, in the
> same report, Norwegian
> > farmers, English earls, Crusaders dying in 'the
> Holy lands', and people in
> > USA census records, I decided not to worry that the
> locations, don't
> > handshake each other, for these documnts.
> > If my British places are consistent within themelves,
> then anyone recieving
> > the report from me, will not see the other groups
> anyway.
> > Good luck, Rich in LA CA
> >
> >
> > --- On Fri, 9/12/08, Cathy Vallevieni
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > From: Cathy Vallevieni <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Subject: [LegacyUG] Entering English Locations
> > > To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyFamilyTree.com
> > > Date: Friday, September 12, 2008, 8:33 PM
> > > How are you entering English locations (what goes
> in City
> > > slot,
> > > County slot, State slot, England)?
> > >
> > > The following are some samples of what I am
> working with:
> > >
> > > Denton (city), Durham (County? except England
> doesn't
> > > have counties?), England
> > >
> > > Obendred (I believe this is a sub-area of Clun?),
> Clun
> > > (city),
> > > Shropshire (County or equivalent thereof?),
> England. This
> > > one's from 1820.
> > >
> > > Blyton (city), Lincolnshire (County or equivalent
> > > thereof?),
> > > England. The source stated Wharton,
> Lincolnshire, England
> > > and I
> > > believe I determined "Wharton" was a
> sub-area of
> > > Blyton?) This one's
> > > from 1460.
> > >
> > > Thanks for any suggestions.
> > >
> > > Cathy Vallevieni
> > > Orange County, CA
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
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