Archaic wrote:
On Sat, Nov 26, 2005 at 09:56:05PM -0600, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
IOW, I think the level of the book is just right.
Please, Bruce, do not take offense at this, but the only posts I've seen
from you in lfs-support this year are 2 in August and they were both
release announcements. Also, I never see you in #lfs-support. I know you
are busy, but those 2 places are the only real guage of the level of the
book.
And this pot will call itself black, too, because you won't see any
posts from me, either, as I really can't stand it anymore. As I have
time, I support things in the various IRC channels (though usually only
see them when someone specifically calls my attention to it).
I, and many others who have no problem sorting out legitimate errors
(which sometimes even leads to FAQ entries or book changes), have
steadily gained a disdain for people asking questions with absolutely no
prerequisite knowledge of linux. They don't read the links, or they
can't understand them. However, our book is so easy that they can
continue on only to be stopped early and post a flurry of support
requests. This was not prevalent back in 2000. And from my perspective,
neither was flaming, but rather an un-coddled response to the realities
of the situation.
Without being rude, some people just need to be told they aren't ready
for LFS until they gain the requisite knowledge, though this scenario
wouldn't even be prevalent if the book avoided holding their hands. Case
in point is a particular person who spammed the lfs, blfs, and livecd
support lists for several weeks. Coddling doesn't work.
In your class you have the power to teach them what you will. The book
can be your basis, but I'm sure it isn't the majority of what you teach.
The finer points should be what we focus on, not the requisite points.
All IMO, of course, and I know some people will think I'm completely off
my rocker. So be it. It doesn't change the fact that linux newbs too
readily come to lfs.
Best post of the year by a long shot !
this has been my point for a long time now,
the book is simple and straight forward to follow, yet people do not
read it, refuse to read it. They ask for support when they have never
used linux before - depsite the requiremtns at the start of the book.
The IRC support channel is excellent for supporting legitimate help
requests and I've find it very satisfying to work through problems to a
resolution with people, however the channel is flooded with people who
don't follow the book or ask questions like "how do I copy of a file" or
"what do I do with the tar files" etc.
Its all very well saying "ignore these people" but its very hard to
ignore them when they are interupting people with genuine problems, or
when other people with no idea whats going on jump in and try to help
them "try applying random patch $a" or "put your sources in /var/tmp" or
"chmod -R 777 / - that works for me"
the changes don't need to be made to the book, but the way LFS is supported.
This has been a drum I've been banging for a while.
Matt
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