Linux-Advocacy Digest #755, Volume #28 Wed, 30 Aug 00 18:13:06 EDT
Contents:
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) ("Joe R.")
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) ("Joe R.")
Re: American schools ARE being sabotaged from within. ("Ingemar Lundin")
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) ("Joe R.")
Re: Why Lycos Selected Microsoft and Intel (Steve Mading)
Re: Nothing like a SECURE database, is there Bill? (Steve Mading)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) ("Joe R.")
Re: Programs for Linux (Steve Mading)
Re: Nothing like a SECURE database, is there Bill? (Steve Mading)
Re: Am I the only one that finds this just a little scary? (Steve Mading)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...) (T. Max
Devlin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Joe R." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:11:58 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
> Said Joe Ragosta in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
> >In article <cofp5.293$v3.4018@uchinews>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [...]
> >> I regard many forms of welfare as cheap insurance, frankly. People who
> >> become justifiably angry and who in this country can easily get a gun
> >> scare the hell out of me.
> >
> >So you believe in encouraging blackmail.......
>
> LOL. No, we just don't believe in denying reality to justify our
> political position. Take out the word "justifiable" (necessary, to
> consider it blackmail), and you're still just as dead in the end.
And it's still blackmail.
You're advocating paying money to someone to keep them from killing you.
That's blackmail--whether you consider it justifiable or not.
Just another example of you making up your own definitions to confuse
the issue, I guess.
------------------------------
From: "Joe R." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:15:13 GMT
> Said david raoul derbes in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
> >In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> >Joe Ragosta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>In article <LZep5.291$v3.3837@uchinews>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>(david raoul derbes) wrote:
> >>
> >>> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> >>> Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>> >[EMAIL PROTECTED] (david raoul derbes) writes:
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>> >The very rich who pay no taxes are a rarity (although they should be
> >>> >dealt with).
> >>>
> >>> I did not claim there were lots of these people; I suspect it is
> >>> under
> >>> five hundred individuals, and I'd bet the ranch it's under a
> >>> thousand.
> >>> But I'd also bet it's a ton of money that isn't taxed.
> >>
> >>But the number is insignificant, so your complaint is meaningless.
> >
> >Oh? What evidence have you that the amount of money is meaningless?
> [...]
>
> >>> Another poster (? Eric Bennett?) suggested a plausible scenario in
> >>> which
> >>> a family might own a farm worth a million or two, and have a simply
> >>> disastrous year, in which the income was zero. That isn't so far
> >>> fetched,
> >>> but as someone who actually owns half of a family farm, I can tell
> >>> you
> >>> that even after three disastrously bad years, we are still paying
> >>> income tax. It's a rare year when your income is zero. It might be
> >>> not enough to cover a loan at the bank, but it ain't zero.
> >>
> >>ROTFLMAO.
> >>
> >>You need to learn the difference between "revenue" and "profit". If you
> >>don't bring in enough money to cover your bank loans, you didn't make
> >>any profit, so there's no income tax due.
> >
> >Oh, dumb me! And I thought I had to pay my bills with *after-tax*
> >dollars! Jeez, why didn't *I* think of that! Say, that will reduce
> >my mortgage by 32%! Terrific!
> >
> >Thanks, Joe! :-)
Perhaps if you'd learn to read, you would understand the issue.
I gave an example of a family farm where there was a large net worth,
but no profit, so it's possible to be wealthy but still not owe taxes.
Max said "then how would they pay back the loan" (in context, presumably
the loan on the farm).
He didn't realize that a business would be paying back that loan in
pre-tax dollars.
If you're stupid enough to think that that applies to your own personal
expenses, then Max now has a challenger for the densest poster on csma.
------------------------------
From: "Ingemar Lundin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: American schools ARE being sabotaged from within.
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:20:57 GMT
What has american politics in C.O.L.A to do?
/IL
"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skrev i meddelandet
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> http://www.freep.com/news/metro/dicker30_20000830.htm
>
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> I: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> J: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
>
> B: "Jeem" Dutton is a fool of the pathological liar sort.
>
> C: Jet plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a method of
> sidetracking discussions which are headed in a direction
> that she doesn't like.
>
> D: Jet claims to have killfiled me.
>
> E: Jet now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (D) above.
>
> F: Neither Jeem nor Jet are worthy of the time to compose a
> response until their behavior improves.
>
> G: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> H: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:26:59 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Courageous in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>
>> I don't know how inheritance tax is implemented in the US, but to me it
>> seems unlikely that a family farm would be bothered with it. Where I
>> live inheritance tax starts way above the level where it could trouble
>> farmers.
>
>Inheritance taxes are a bit worse than that here.
In the U.S., they take a big jump over $600,000. That isn't a very big
farm. As with income tax, I'm for raising the starting level greatly,
and increasing the progression. Our nation is simply so huge, that any
person who gains great wealth within the society should rightly turn
over a large proportion of their *income* (not their wealth; that's
their property and the federal government has no right to it, though
they'll have to negotiate with state or local governments who want to
tax their property, rightly) to the government to support social
services. It is the only efficient and assured way to provide for
society's support of whatever allowed them to accumulate wealth.
I think the most egalitarian system might be to tax someone's *income*
in proportion to their *capital* (wealth). What do you suppose would
happen then? It might be a stupid idea, I think, but I haven't quite
figured out why, yet. And to me that means there's probably a "unique
perspective" hiding in the answer somewhere, one way or the other.
The 'rugged individualist' libertarian mentality has often been observed
to devolve into anarchism. But it is all too easily forgotten that
without the civilization to support the ability of citizens to "earn"
money, the wealthy would not have wealth. Outside of Aaron's
philospher-king/begger idealism, every person deserves life, liberty,
and the pursuit of happiness. And while libertarians and conservatives
might still agree with Aaron that the Constitution does not support the
welfare state, the fact is that it does. Yes, you have to *fund* the
life, liberty, and even the pursuit of happiness for some disadvantaged
people (including the stupid and the lazy both) in order to ensure the
right to those things for those who are capable of "earning a living"
(and by definition, anyone earning a living is capable of doing so, and
anyone who is not doing so is, for some reason you haven't yet
identified or discovered, not capable of doing so).
You might discount the Supreme Court, philosophers, and public servants
all as self-serving and far-left in recognizing that the welfare state
is a just and fundamental purpose of government. But then you seem to
simply be ignoring the advice of all the people you rely on to give you
the right answer, because you didn't like the answer. It should be
obvious that it isn't because the answer is not correct, but solely
because it isn't the one you wanted to hear. Because in our reasoning,
we are all "rugged individualists", but in our hearts, we're all social
beings. "Give a monkey a brain, and he'll swear he's the center of the
universe."
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
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======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:29:33 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said david raoul derbes in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>In article <1efxfht.4xtbz1uyehb2N@[192.168.0.144]>,
>Andrew J. Brehm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>Donavon Pfeiffer Jr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>>I don't know how inheritance tax is implemented in the US, but to me it
>>seems unlikely that a family farm would be bothered with it. Where I
>>live inheritance tax starts way above the level where it could trouble
>>farmers.
>
>You are very much mistaken.
>
>At the age of 68, my mother had to find 480,000 US to pay the government
>for her sister and brother in law's farm. To be fair to the government,
>she had ten years to pay it off. She managed, but it wasn't easy.
>
>She died about two months ago, and now my sister and I get to repeat
>the process.
>
>And yet, I think that we need the inheritance tax. Those who think the
>inheritance tax is some sort of wicked thing should perhaps read
>Thomas Jefferson and James Madison on the subject.
Perhaps you could summarize their debate for us? You obviously seem to
have a moderate opinion, given your circumstances. Most in your shoes
might not arrive at the same conclusion, I think. So why do you think
we need the inheritance tax, and what were Jefferson and Madison's
opinions?
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:34:54 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Joe Ragosta in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, ZnU
[...]
>So, IOW, [...]
Here's a tip, Joe. Whenever you find yourself starting a response with
"So, you..." or "So, IOW...", or just "So...", for that matter, or any
variation on this theme, hit the backspace key to correct your error and
start again.
Do you even *know* what a straw man argument is? It seems the only kind
you ever use. At least vary your logical fallacies once it a while,
you're getting boring again.
Here's a page to help you study up on new troll tactics:
http://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.htm
>> If you're so against handouts, why do you support the multimillion
>> dollar handouts rich parents pass along to their children?
>
>Because he's in favor of people doing what they want with their own
>money and opposed to the government taking money from people for its own
>political goals.
The government doesn't have any political goals of its own. You seem
pretty disenfranchised, Joe. That's understandable, of course, I think
everyone does, and should. But simple blame-casting and superficial
thinking are *not* the answer.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: "Joe R." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:33:45 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
> I think the most egalitarian system might be to tax someone's *income*
> in proportion to their *capital* (wealth). What do you suppose would
> happen then? It might be a stupid idea, I think, but I haven't quite
> figured out why, yet.
You might start with the very simple case of someone who inherits a farm
which doesn't make much money. They'd have potentially millions in
assets, but barely enough income to live on.
There are plenty of other examples, but what you're suggesting violates
all the things you've been pleading for. You argued that the amount
someone pays should be related to their _ability_ to pay. Income is much
more closely related to ability to pay than wealth.
But we've come to expect you to contradict yourself regularly, so this
isn't a surprise.
Or maybe you just don't understand the difference between wealth and
income. That wouldn't be a surprise, either.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why Lycos Selected Microsoft and Intel
Date: 30 Aug 2000 21:31:07 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: Said Aaron R. Kulkis in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
:>
:>I have no particular belief...I'm just tossing out ideas for discussion.
: I don't have much use for people with no particular belief. While I'm
: not someone who likes to get involved in other people's morality, I
: don't care for people who don't even know what they believe. I'd prefer
: you believe something that is wrong than have no belief. Regardless,
: you should be willing to modify your beliefs to fit your current
: knowledge of reality without denial or perversion.
My $0.02 - There is *great* damage to be had in the attitude that you
must believe in something even if you aren't sure. That's where the
religious reich's intolerance for careful scientific thought comes
from. That's where the crusades came from. That's where witch hunts
come from. That's where the Spanish Inquisition comes from. That's
where Scientology comes from. It is wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong to
go around believing something to be true just because you think it
would be really "neato" if it was true.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Nothing like a SECURE database, is there Bill?
Date: 30 Aug 2000 21:35:05 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
: On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 21:33:37 GMT, A transfinite number of monkeys
:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 18:27:18 GMT,
:> [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>: >Check it out Leon, Oracle ships with default admin passwords, MySQL
:>: >ships with default passwords. If you are so unfamiliar with the
:>:
:>: The oracle rdms installer since at least version 7.1.x has
:>: forced the admin to set passwords for the superuser accounts.
:>
:>Not so.
:>
:>I just installed 8.1.6.1 EE on Linux the other day. After I installed,
:>I created a database using dbassist, and had it create the db, rather
:>than save shell scripts. At no point in time did it ask me to change
:>the passwords for sys, system or ctxsys. I had to go into sqlplus
:>and do it myself.
: ...and I just rebuilt an Oracle 8 database last week.
: It sounds like Oracle is still skimping on the Linux installer.
I had the same effect on a solaris version this week - it asks that
you change it, but it doesn't force you to..
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 17:42:14 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
[...]
>Because it's THEIR money to do with as they please.
Not once they're dead, its not.
>I'm not against handouts, I'm against government pickpockets
>using me as the financial basis for their handouts.
So go start your own country, or at least get some meaningful rhetoric.
I'd suggest running for the school board, but you're obviously
incompetent for such an important task. Maybe you should go for the
state legislature, or maybe Congress.
>Why is it that every time a liberal wants to do good, it always
>depends on stealing money from me....
Because it isn't your money, Aaron. It isn't your society, it isn't
your life. They were given to you. We don't know from where or why,
really, but life is a gift, it is not 'earned'. And if it comes down to
your money, or society, or someone else's life, then your money loses,
no doubt about it.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: "Joe R." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 21:41:10 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
> Said Joe Ragosta in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
> >In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, ZnU
> [...]
> >So, IOW, [...]
>
> Here's a tip, Joe. Whenever you find yourself starting a response with
> "So, you..." or "So, IOW...", or just "So...", for that matter, or any
> variation on this theme, hit the backspace key to correct your error and
> start again.
Sure. I'm merely rephrasing his comments.
The fact that you insisted on deleting what I had to say is pretty good
proof that my rephrasing wasn't that far off. If it had been so bad, why
didn't you leave it there for others to reach their own conclusions?
>
> Do you even *know* what a straw man argument is? It seems the only kind
> you ever use. At least vary your logical fallacies once it a while,
> you're getting boring again.
I know exactly what a straw man argument is. The fact is that you
haven't shown me using a single one.
>
> Here's a page to help you study up on new troll tactics:
> http://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.htm
Why don't you find one on posting facts instead of the lies you admit to
posting?
>
> >> If you're so against handouts, why do you support the multimillion
> >> dollar handouts rich parents pass along to their children?
> >
> >Because he's in favor of people doing what they want with their own
> >money and opposed to the government taking money from people for its own
> >political goals.
>
> The government doesn't have any political goals of its own. You seem
> pretty disenfranchised, Joe. That's understandable, of course, I think
> everyone does, and should. But simple blame-casting and superficial
> thinking are *not* the answer.
The government doesn't have any political goals?
That has to rank among the stupidest statements you've ever made -- and
that's saying a lot.
The government as a whole has one major goal--staying in power. Its
second goal (of only slightly less importance) is increasing its power.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.linux,alt.os.linux,alt.os.linux.caldera,alt.os.linux.mandrake,comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.questions
Subject: Re: Programs for Linux
Date: 30 Aug 2000 21:43:23 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy robert w hall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>
: and if you want a fallback position, get win4lin (v1 is now only $35 I
: hear) and run M$ software in a stable linux environment; and keep the
: techie side of your id alive by experimenting with wine.
How does this compare to VMware?
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Nothing like a SECURE database, is there Bill?
Date: 30 Aug 2000 21:42:11 GMT
Roberto Alsina <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: Considering that you have to connect to the database to set the
: passwords, they better leave you SOME open entry ;-)
It seems to me that in this type of situation, the installer
should generate a random, but usable, password from some very
simple scheme, ("Roll a d46, 1-26 equals A-Z, 27-36 equals 0-9,
and 37-46 is the punctiation marks above the numbers", repeat for
8 characters). Then it could tell you what this password is during
the installation program. Is there any product out there that
uses this technique?
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Am I the only one that finds this just a little scary?
Date: 30 Aug 2000 21:56:34 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Colin R. Day <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: Perry Pip wrote:
:> >> >
:> >> >
:> >>
:> >> Actually, I believe Japan began imperialist activites as early as the 1870's.
:> >
:> >Could they have landed on the US West Coast at that time? Or would a
:> >trancontinental railroad have helped defend Pacific possessions?
:>
:> In those days they did not have satellites back then to determine
:> where the Jap Navy was. The Jap Navy was as far from Japan as the
:> south pacific at the time, but the U.S. had little way of knowing
:> where they were.
:>
: So the Japanese are just going to land large forces on California?
: And the American Navy is not going to interdict the supplies sent
: to such Japanese troops in California?
No Panama Canal yet. The US Navy would take a long time to get
there in full force. (This was the main reason for building the
canal in the first place. It increased the power of the Navy by
decreasing it's response time to go between oceans.)
: California has mountains, but the important parts of it are nowhere near
: as mountainous as Switzerland.
The rockies are in the way. That's probably what he had in mind.
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 18:02:38 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>ZnU wrote:
[...]
>> > > while others work hard their entire lives and stay poor.
>> > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> >
>> > Spot the lie.
>>
>> The lie is your elitist rhetoric.
>
>Are you saying that everyone has equal capabilities and abilities?
>
>If so, then why aren't you playing in the NFL ?
You've done this before, Aaron, and its obvious your missing something.
The question is whether or not you will be willing to accept it when you
finally understand it, because it rocks your world so hard. Perhaps
you've already cast it away, and even consciously deny it. I think the
cognitive dissonance of trying to maintain your world view with your
knowledge of this fact might be the reason you so often and outrageously
resort to emotional outbursts while trying to discuss these issues.
For your questions to make any sense in response to the preceding
comments, you would have to believe that if everyone had equal
abilities, then everyone would be successful. This is, to you, an
affirmation of the "human principle", the value of human achievement,
the transcendence of free will. These are worth affirming, and you are
right to relate material success with them. But you are, unfortunately,
mistaken if you assume that they are a deterministic mechanism. Whether
'ZnU' *could* play in the NFL is not the only factor in whether he
*does* play in the NFL. You've confounded darwinistic evolution with
human consciousness; life is not a meritocracy. Nor does properly
understood Darwinistic theory or evolution contradict this fact.
Evolution favors *diversity*, not "fitness".
Some people work hard and end up poor. So that you have the ability,
and even the *right*, to work hard and end up rich, you must accept a
responsibility to support those who are poor. You can't ever tell
what's really "fit" until long after everybody concerned is dead, and
you can't know what is luck and what is not, so no amount of posturing
on your part about who plays in the NFL is going to ever support your
belief that the welfare state is theft.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 18:08:07 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>Chad Myers wrote:
[...]
>They had their chance to avail themselves to an
>education...AND THEY ****CHOSE**** not to partake.
Yes, "they" are all lazy and stupid, we know. Now what do you do about
it? You *can't* say "FUCK THEM", Aaron (I mean, you did, but...). Your
libertarianite cannon may deny it, but if you do that, they eventually
will outnumber you and kill you.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...)
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 18:10:08 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Chad Myers in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>
>"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>>
>> It's simple: FUCK THEM!
>>
>> They had their chance to avail themselves to an
>> education...AND THEY ****CHOSE**** not to partake.
>
>As easy as it sounds, that's not America. America was
>built by successful, hard-working, independant people.
And their slaves and wage-slaves and everyone else who supported them...
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
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