Linux-Advocacy Digest #979, Volume #28 Thu, 7 Sep 00 18:13:06 EDT
Contents:
Re: How low can they go...? ("Simon Cooke")
Re: New benchmarks... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Remote Control Sofware for linux (David Dorward)
Re: New benchmarks... (Bob Tennent)
Epson 460 ("Jeepster")
Re: So ya' wanna' run Linux?...I have a bridge for sale in Bklyn..... (Ian Westcott)
Re: OS advertising in the movies... (was Re: Microsoft MCSE) (Ian Westcott)
Re: How low can they go...? ("Simon Cooke")
Re: Can you believe this??? (was Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re: Would a M$
Voluntary Split ...)) ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: How low can they go...? ("Ermine Todd")
Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split Save It? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
ms image change ... micro-er soft-er ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Computer and memory (2:1)
Re: Anonymous Wintrolls and Authentic Linvocates - Re: R.E. Ballard
says Linux growth stagnating (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Simon Cooke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 12:12:19 -0700
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Thu, 7 Sep 2000 11:22:51 -0700, Simon Cooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> >
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> On Thu, 07 Sep 2000 16:53:09 GMT, Simon Cooke
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >wrote:
> >> >
> >> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> >> On 7 Sep 2000 00:51:49 -0700, Tim Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> >> >On Fri, 01 Sep 2000 07:23:23 +1000, Shane Phelps
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> >wrote:
> >> >> >>Do you mean the ones that demand a previous version of
Windows?????
> >> >> >>or is this perhaps a case of installing the upgrade on one disk
while
> >> >> >>retaining the previous version of Windows on the other?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>The only Microsoft upgrade disks I've ever seen since about
Windows
> >> >> >>3.11 and MS-DOS 5 have checked for the existence of an earlier
> >> >> >>version before allowing the installation of the later versiion.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >The "previous version" check for the Win95 upgrade CD is is "check
for
> >a
> >> >file
> >> >> >named win386.exe" on the disk.
> >> >>
> >> >> Are the Win9x upgrade media even capable of starting with
> >> >> bare media. The Win95 upgrade didn't seem to be capable of
> >> >> it. One would have to build an OS of some sort on the system
> >> >> disk or the install media in addition to the upgrade files
> >> >> themselves.
> >> >
> >> >*cough* bullshit *cough*
> >>
> >> Then again, where again is fdisk on the Win95 upgrade media?
> >>
> >> What are you going to use to boot your newly wiped system? The
> >> aforementioned upgrade media won't manage the task for you.
> >
> >The boot disk that comes with the upgrade will boot for you, and will
also
>
> Perhaps if you pay for the full licence version.
>
> [deletia]
>
> It certainly wasn't that way with the Win95 upgrade.
Well, this has decayed into a "he said, she said" argument that can go no
further.
Simon
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: New benchmarks...
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 19:16:26 GMT
In article <8p60n1$21l$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
sfcybear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> These are from the Standard Performance Evaluation Corporation
>
> www.spec.org/
>
> and the tests were performed by Dell.
>
> www.spec.org/osg/web99/results/res2000q2/web99-20000501-00028.html
> www.spec.org/osg/web99/results/res2000q2/web99-20000626-00054.html
>
> I know that Tux is in kernel space but what about IIS???
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
I knew it all along...
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: David Dorward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Remote Control Sofware for linux
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:41:24 +0100
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Hi I wanted to know if there is any software like
> PC Anywhere for Linux. I want to be able to boot
> into Linux or Win-98 if my computer has both.
VNC clients and servers for Linux and Windows.
http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/index.html
--
David Dorward
http://www.dorward.co.uk/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Tennent)
Subject: Re: New benchmarks...
Date: 7 Sep 2000 19:30:50 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Thu, 7 Sep 2000 19:33:16 +0100, Nigel Feltham wrote:
>
>Perhaps it would be more interesting if they could repeat the test using
>Apache (on both NT and Linux) on the same hardware as this should show where
>the operating system is helping the improved performance and where the
>webserver is better.
>
The webserver used with Linux (Tux) is in the kernel. It can't be
run on NT. Tests using Apache have been run in the past, though
not, AFAIK, using Apache on NT.
------------------------------
From: "Jeepster" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Epson 460
Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 21:13:08 +0100
Hi
Has anyone got a Epson 460 working with Linux..... I have sussed that it is
a soft/Win-printer, so, ummm.... I'm stuck with using it with Win 98.... but
I'd like to use it with Linux..... any suggestions... I have tried but it
wont respond to any drivers.... ;-(
Thanks In Advance...
------------------------------
From: Ian Westcott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: So ya' wanna' run Linux?...I have a bridge for sale in Bklyn.....
Date: 7 Sep 2000 20:18:43 GMT
Marada C. Shradrakaii <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>Linux *barely* has support for non 3dfx 3d apps/libraries. We have been doing
:>
:>3d on the PC for 4 years now.
:>
: Remember... there was a time when only some 3d boards were properly supported
: by Windows software too. I recall when PC Gamer magazine offered a demo of
: Final Fantasy VII on their enclosed CD, and it would only run with some Voodoo
: cards. There was probably about half-a-dozen apps, if that many, that
: supported the "3D" features of the S3 Virge chipset.
For awhile, this was one of 3Dfx's biggest selling points: "We're
support by far more 3D software than those other cards! Buy from us!"
--
Ian Westcott Rakarra@IRC
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Ian Westcott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: OS advertising in the movies... (was Re: Microsoft MCSE)
Date: 7 Sep 2000 20:24:31 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
: Christophe Ochal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
: news:uVar5.364$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:> Yea, like the episode where homer thinks Burns is an alien, if one pas
:> attention to it, you can see a bunch of kids playing the tune from "close
:> encounters of the third kind" :)
: Are not all the Simpson's aliens? Look at their skin tone; look at the zig
: zag shapes of their skulls; look at the bride of Frankenstien hair. They
: can't be of this world! ;-)
Don't forget the four-fingered hands. };>
--
Ian Westcott Rakarra@IRC
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Simon Cooke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 13:23:13 -0700
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Thu, 7 Sep 2000 11:21:46 -0700, Simon Cooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> >
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> On Thu, 07 Sep 2000 16:50:08 GMT, Simon Cooke
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >wrote:
> >> >
> >> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> >> Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
> >> >> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> >> >> Said Seán Ó Donnchadha in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
> >> >> >> >T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>What do you expect from the guy who said that software
products
> >> >can't
> >> >> >> >>>be damaged because it's all just bits?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>What, they get dented in shipping;
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Ah, so [...]
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Christ, what a troll. When you've figured out your ass from a
hole
> >in
> >> >> >> the ground, try again. I don't respond to trolls on rhetorical
> >> >> >> comments.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> You said removing IE would 'damage' the software. I said that's
> >> >> >> bullshit, because its bullshit. Software doesn't get 'damaged'
like
> >> >> >> that.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Of course, being the world class developer that you are, you'd know
> >this
> >> >for
> >> >> >certain, wouldn't you?
> >> >>
> >> >> Your ass = product without IE
> >> >> Hole in the ground = program which doesn't run
> >> >>
> >> >> When you've learned the difference, try again.
> >> >
> >> >Do you know anything about software development, Mr. Devlin? NO. YOU
> >DON'T.
> >> >
> >> >Until recent releases of Gecko, there was and has been no other
> >> >componentized solution for software developers to use for an HTML
> >rendering
> >> >surface. Ergo, developers used IE.
> >>
> >> No. You're just defining the notion of component to suit your
> >> own ends. Netscape was used in exactly the same way IE is now
> >> except there were no low level shenanigans necessary to pull it
> >> off.
> >
> >OK... if that's the case, please detail how you take Netscape 4.7 and use
> >its rendering surface in your own application window.
> >
> >ANSWER: You can't.
>
> Now you are changing defintions again. You didn't mention
> application embedding before. Although even that is of
> dubious value.
What else could I have meant? And it's of "dubious value"? Well, I'm sure
the moment you release your fully HTML4 compliant browser control so that
you can display HTML pages in an app, I'll start using it.
> [deletia]
>
> If one app can't control the windows of another in Win32
> without some unecessarily low level hack, that sounds
> more like a Microsoft problem than a Netscape one.
Really? I suppose you know all about cross-process boundaries, window UI
threads, et al, and know that it's really really easy to do, huh? Besides,
how would you get rid of the toolbars, status bar, et al?
> It just demonstrates an ongoing pattern of engineering on
> Microsoft's part to create uneccessary complexity and
> dependencies meant specifically to make it more difficult
> for end users to pull out unwanted components.
No, it just shows that you don't have a clue about development.
Simon
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Can you believe this??? (was Re: [OT] Bush v. Gore on taxes (was: Re:
Would a M$ Voluntary Split ...))
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:30:01 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > > > If you read any financial magazines, you'll see comments like
"the
> > > > 'safest' place to put your money is in an FDIC insured savings
> > account
> > > > at 2% interest. Unfortunately, with inflation averaging greater
than
> > > > that, you're taking a greater risk with your money than a more
> > > > 'aggressive' investment.
> > > >
> > > > That's actually a pretty universal position among investment
> > advisors.
> > > >
> > > > > not whether or not you'll maintain purchasing power. two
different
> > > > > things.
> > > > > especially if you are looking at my statement of govt. bonds
> > being a
> > > > > risk-free investment
> > > > >
> > > > > the reason they are risk free is that you'll get your money.
100%
> > no
> > > > > worries.
> > > >
> > > > True. But that doesn't negate the fact that most current
financial
> > > > advisors go one step further than you have and consider the
risk of
> > loss
> > > > of buying power.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > how about those folks that bought redhat at 300 bucks a share?
> > how are
> > > > > they feeling
> > > > > these days?
> > > >
> > > > Probably a lot worse than the ones who bought Apple at 12
(before
> > split).
> > > >
> > > > None of which is relevant. Aaron isn't arguing that bonds are
> > riskier
> > > > than stocks. But you should consider the risk of inflation in
your
> > > > investments.
> > >
> > > Personally, I hope the asshole puts all of his money in
bonds...and
> > > when he gets old, he can rot in the poorhouse for his idiotic
beliefs.
> > >
> >
> > Portfolio theory has shown that you can eliminate much of the risk
from
> > your portfolio, while still achieving most of the stock market's
> > return, by holding a mixture of stocks and bonds.
> >
> > My uncle bought long term government bonds with a 15% coupon in the
> > early 80's.
> >
> > Think you can get that kind of return in the stock market for 30
years
> > running? Maybe if you're Warren Buffet, but the long term return on
> > the total stock market is ~10%. My uncle is quite happy with his
> > bonds, and I guarantee you he ain't in the poorhouse.
>
> If they are *COMMERCIAL* bonds, you'll probably do ok.
>
> Government bonds are very prone to loss of real value.
>
No. Bond prices, commercial or government, are determined by interest
rate expectations. Both types lose value when interest rates go up.
These were long term (30 year) government bonds.
They have provide a very good interest rate, greater than the expected
long-term stock market return, and their value has increased as
interest rates have fallen.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: "Ermine Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 13:19:44 -0700
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
And as the case is playing out, Sun is losing on every point. First, it's
been ruled that it was a contract and not a "copyright" issue. 2nd, it's
been ruled that Sun did illegally deny updates and information to MS as
specified in the contract, 3rd, that Sun did not validate the Java 2 code as
meeting the test suites according to the contract, 4th, that MS did have the
right to add extensions and provide a version optimized for Windows and 5th,
that it wasn't just a simple "distribution" agreement.
The only thing that MS has been required to change as a result of the suite
was 1) that the default mode would be for the extensions to be disabled and
2) that MS, until the suite is settled, could not refer to their version as
"the" reference version for the Windows platform.
--ET--
"Christophe Ochal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:aoMt5.982$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> Simon Cooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> schreef in berichtnieuws
> 6Fvt5.53306$[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > "Christophe Ochal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:9Jrt5.911$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > I hadn't heard any news, but I wasn't really watching what happened
> > > > after the anti-trust trial got started. Do you have any info or
> links?
> > >
> > > I just remember the outcome that forced them to rename their Java VM
to
> M$
> > > VM, because SUN had pulled them to court, T.Max might have some links
> tho
> >
> > There was no such outcome of a ruling. The Microsoft JVM was always
named
> as
> > such.
>
> I've read about the lawsuit on ZDNET, the articles should still be there
>
> Amon_Re
>
>
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split Save It?
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 06:45:11 -0400
Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>Gary Hallock wrote:
>>
>> "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > Kennedy wanted to get us out (and there are tapes to prove THAT, too),
>> > but LBJ decided to insert 500,000 men instead.
>> >
>>
>> Johnson also wanted to get us out - it was part of his 1964 campaign. Goldwater
>> wanted to extend to war into China and use nuclear weapons.
>> The fact is that every president since Eisenhower promised to get us out of
>> Vietnam and each ended up actually getting us in deeper. That includes Nixon.
>> Viewing Vietnam as Johnson's war is very simplistic.
>Who sent over the first combat unit larger than a company?
>Who sent the first squadron of Air Force ground support craft?
>Who slided our troops from the position of tag-along ADVISORS into
>full-fledged direct combatants.
>Before LBJ, yes, Advisors took part in fighting...this is routine... Anybody
>who goes out in the bush carries a firearm, and shoots when it gets hairy.
>But before LBJ, it was always a couple of Americans giving advice and
>assistance to a much larger body of Viet Namese.
Plug in to how Ike sent aircraft carriers into the Gulf and offered to drop
nukes on the Vietmin (sp) in 1954 to support the French -- then think of the
CIA running lose in SEA, and you will begin to understand who started the
Vietnam war.
===========================================================
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
===========================================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: ms image change ... micro-er soft-er
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:55:40 GMT
In an effort to soften its image, Microsoft chairman Bill Gates makes
his appeal that M$ should have the same deregulated freedoms as any mom
and pop operation. He unveiled Microsoft Brand Jams & Jellies.
http://www.ridiculopathy.com/index.php?display=20000824
check it out... or not.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Computer and memory
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:59:01 GMT
In article <8DDt5.35353$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Chad Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "Nathaniel Jay Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > Is my anger apparent yet? Being an American, and seeing
> > other Americans try to say that 'we are superior' is
> > enough to make me want to slit my wrists. But I would
> > settle for them shutting up (which I know also won't
> > happen).
>
> Who was saying "we are superior"?
>
> Not I.
>
> Geez, all you guys really know how to make something out
> of nothing and completely miss the point and then somehow
> end up making me the one to blame for it.
>
> It's this simple:
>
> <Whiny Brits complaining that American's are too used to their
> fast Internet>
>
> <Chad suggesting that, rather than complaining all the time, they
> should encourage their government to do something about it and
> join the rest of us>
>
> <Whiny calling Chad arrogant, ignorant, "stupid American",
> "American attitude">
>
> <Chad gets pissed. Reminds Whiny Brits that it's not America's fault
> they have crappy internet access, and blaming Microsoft et al for
> large downloads really isn't addressing the hart of the problem>
>
> <Whiny Brits continue to avoid the point and label and insult Chad>
>
> -Chad
>
>
Chad, you are a fool of truly grand proportions. Since you didn't
understand first time, I don't know exactly why I'm tyring to spell it
out.
Internet access in Britain is not slow per se. As it happens, at my
college, I get completely free broadband access.
The problem lies in the _link_ to the USA. That _LINK_ is slow,
therefore it takes a long time to download large software service packs
from Redmond. That has nothing to do with the general speed of internet
access in the UK. It has to do with the transatlantic link. Or mabey you
guys have a faster transatlantic link than us ;-)
I don't whine about slow downloads of Linux software because my
university has a mirror, which I could (in theory) connect to at up to
10Mb/s, seeing as that is the speed of my card, and the link there is
much faster.
If you can't understand this, then you are truly stupid. I now await a
reply from you detailing your complete lack of understanding and a
healthy dose of xenophobia.
-Ed
--
BBC Computer 32K | Edward Rosten
Acorn DFS | Engineer and Jupiter ACE advocate
Basic | fuji.stcatz.ox.ac.uk/cult
>*MAIL ku.ca.xo.gne@rje98u (backwards, if you want to talk to me)
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Anonymous Wintrolls and Authentic Linvocates - Re: R.E. Ballard
says Linux growth stagnating
Date: 7 Sep 2000 21:12:42 GMT
On Thu, 7 Sep 2000 08:30:21 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> On Thu, 07 Sep 2000 02:57:20 -0400, T. Max Devlin wrote:
>>
>> (2) Like I said, I am the sole definitive authority on the meaning of
>> my own words.
>
>Just an observation. I don't think that is true for the meaning of your
>words, if what you just said were true, what ever words used by anyone could
>take on any meaning and communitcations would not be possible.
>
>However, you are the sole definitive authority on your intended meaning.
You are correct. That is what I meant. My point is that Max has been arguing
with me as to what my intended meaning was ( since it's quite clear that
the literal meaning clearly does not in any way accuse him of any felony )
What is clear is that Max did not understand my original post, and then
proceeded to do what he always does when he doesn't understand what's going
on -- go on the attack, like a rabid dog.
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 17:18:20 -0400
Rick wrote:
>
> ZnU wrote:
> >
> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > Rick wrote:
> > > >
> > > > "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Rick wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Rick wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > "Joe R." wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Courageous
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > But a better thing would be to make the public schools at
> > > > > > > > > > > least as
> > > > > > > > > > > good as the private schools. I believe, perhaps naively,
> > > > > > > > > > > that this
> > > > > > > > > > > can be done; and even more naively, that it isn't simply
> > > > > > > > > > > a matter of
> > > > > > > > > > > money.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > It's much a matter of money; halving the class sizes
> > > > > > > > > > requires doubling
> > > > > > > > > > the number of teachers, for example.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > If you believe that class size is the only thing wrong with
> > > > > > > > > the schools,
> > > > > > > > > of course.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It is by no means the only thng wrong, but is a large part in
> > > > > > > > some
> > > > > > > > areas.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Please explain why the best universities in the world routinely
> > > > > > > put their students through classes where the material is taught
> > > > > > > in lectures where the class size is in the HUNDREDS.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Generally speak, those universities attract better students. Those
> > > > > > students have learned how to learn.
> > > > >
> > > > > BINGO.
> > > > >
> > > > > Now, tell me why the public schools currently do everything they
> > > > > can to PREVENT students from learning how to learn.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > ***WE*** do not.
> > >
> > > Oh, really. Then why do American high school students' science and math
> > > scores ABSOLUTELY SUCK compared to the rest of the industrialized world,
> > > including such backwards places as Russia.
> >
> > Let's review:
> >
> > 1) American high school students' science and math scores are lower than
> > average for industrialized nations.
>
> Also... lets not forget... in many other nations, students are "tracked"
> into areas in which they supposedly have a aptitude... by passing "high
> school" and many of those standardized test. in other words... in the US
> every student gets tested... in many other nations the students being
> tested are of a higher level.
Let's ALSO not forget that American schools did this ALSO, until
the fucking NEA branded it "devisive".
>
> Lets look at Japan, where students have a snese of responsiobility.. so
> high in fact the suicide rates are higher. It was this very nation that
> was supposed to produce the "5th generation computer' that would
> revolutionize computing. They didnt.
Some people drive to fast and kill themselves by wrapping their car
around a tree at 120mph...therefore, nobody should drive???
>
> > 2) Virtually every other industrialized nation has an educational system
> > significantly more socialistic than ours.
>
> True. And students progress differently.
So why do American students progress so much more slowly than everyone
else?
>
> > 3) BUT! The US educational system is secretly in the control of
> > Communists!
>
> We are? I wonder if I can get a trip to China?
The NEA is sabotaging the schools. See comment after paragraph (1)
>
> > 4) So the only way to improve US education is to privatize it, moving
> > _away_ from the way more successful countries do things.
> >
>
> Or... lets compare student groups.. or top 10%, middle, bottom, versus
> "theirs.
We consistantly lag...no matter what category you choose.
>
> > Are we supposed to take you seriously?
> >
>
> Um, you've taken him seriously?
>
> > [snip]
> >
>
> --
>
> Rick
>
> * To email me remove theobvious from my address *
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
I: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
J: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: "Jeem" Dutton is a fool of the pathological liar sort.
C: Jet plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a method of
sidetracking discussions which are headed in a direction
that she doesn't like.
D: Jet claims to have killfiled me.
E: Jet now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
F: Neither Jeem nor Jet are worthy of the time to compose a
response until their behavior improves.
G: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
H: Knackos...you're a retard.
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