Linux-Advocacy Digest #273, Volume #29 Sat, 23 Sep 00 09:13:04 EDT
Contents:
Re: The Government's Decision to Use Microsoft ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: filename extensions are NOT a kludge (FM)
Re: programming languages and design (FM)
Re: programming languages and design ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively (Bob Germer)
Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively (Bob Germer)
Re: Id Software developer prefers OS X to Linux, NT (C Lund)
Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively (Bob Germer)
Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools (Bob Germer)
Re: so what? ("Nigel Feltham")
Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools) ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: [OT] Tholen & Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools)
([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: so what? ("Philo")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Government's Decision to Use Microsoft
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 03:46:28 -0400
Tony Tribelli wrote:
>
> mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
> >> Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>> "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >>>> Wrong. In Linux, you can write a signal handler for any signal (other
> >>>> than 9--SIGKILL), ***INCLUDING*** mathematic exceptions (which is what
> >>>> is produced by a div_by_0 error.
> >>>
> >>> And with NT you can provide a Structured Exception Handler to handle any
> >>> fault except NMI.
> >>
> >> Exactly. The failure lay in a poorly programmed application that failed,
> >> not in the OS. The OS stayed up, but even the most rabid Linux Loony
> > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > My understanding was that it did not. That is an NT problem, since
> > Linux does stay up in this situation, and doesn't require the programmer
> > to write additional exeption handlers. This seems to be another hangover
> > from the DOS days.
>
> You were misinformed. Programmers don't have to write exception handlers.
> The default ones will shut down the app that does the divide-by-zero. The
But, in this case, an exception handler would be needed. You WANT
the navigation software to continue, despite the Divide By Zero error.
Unix and Linux offer this. And almost every Unix programmer I know
wouldn't let such a simple thing slip past them.
Why is it that 1960's mistakes like these are STILL so common
in LoseDows software?
Could it be that because so much of it is written by amateurs
with MS (pseudo-) Cerification letters after their names....
> programmers only need to provide exception handlers if they want the app to
> handle the error itself.
>
> Tony
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
their behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (FM)
Subject: Re: filename extensions are NOT a kludge
Date: 23 Sep 2000 07:35:39 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On 23 Sep 2000 00:46:05 GMT, FM wrote:
>>C++. As is generic programming without getting
>>buried in OO. There's really no reason why one
>>would use C++ if one was to follow OOP rigorously.
>>C++ doesn't even support polymorphism outside of
>>templates without the use of pointers.
>I am not sure what you mean. virtual method dispatch works
>on references as well as pointers.
>
>// Look ma, no pointers (-;
> Derived B;
> Base& C = B;
> C.foo(); // calls Derived::foo() if foo is virtual
References are just extremely limited forms of pointers
(constant pointers; what they point to cannot be changed
once declared, thus they are automatically dereferenced)
and the above doesn't really do any dispatch other than
what's originally done for the original object. To do
anything remotely interesting involving dynamic dispatch,
pointers are a must.
Dan.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (FM)
Subject: Re: programming languages and design
Date: 23 Sep 2000 07:39:57 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Richard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>"I invented the term Object-Oriented, and I can tell you I did not
>have C++ in mind." — Alan Kay
I don't think OO as conceived by Alan Kay or its other
pioneers is better than what's available now.
>> Whatever. If you're saying that everyone should program small talk
>> I doubt that would solve the worlds problems. More static languages
>> have the advantage of being less ( not more ) error prone, because errors
>> get caught at compile time.
>Yeah, that's the traditional explanation for strong typing. Run-time
>errors are not a big deal in Smalltalk though and static typing
>*creates* a class of errors that wouldn't exist otherwise.
Still having problems distinguishing between strong typing
and static typing?
>I know what you meant; I'm claiming that you should never ever use an
>imperative language unless someone has a gun to your head, and even then
>don't automatically accept it. :-)
Smalltalk is imperative. Most mainstream OO languages are
imperative (I don't think CLOS or Dylan are considered
"mainstream" just yet)
Dan.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: programming languages and design
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 06:08:13 -0400
Richard wrote:
>
> Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
> > Any proficient programmer knows how a language is "meant" to be used, that
> > is, they have a sense of what is considered "good style" in that language.
> > For example, "good style" in perl would mean preferring foreach to
> > for (...). In C++, it means using OO all the time.
>
> "I invented the term Object-Oriented, and I can tell you I did not
> have C++ in mind." — Alan Kay
>
> "The main problem for the C++ community today is to use Standard C++
> in the way it was intended rather than as a glorified C or a poor
> man's Smalltalk." — Bjarne Stroustrup (inventor of C++),
> "Getting From The Past To The Future" ,
> p. 23 C++ Report, SIGS Nov/Dec 1999 Vol1 No.10
>
> Kay referred to Smalltalk when he coined OO. And since the styles
> of programmers in C++ and Smalltalk differ so radically, I can't
> see how you can claim C++ style to be OO (except that you are
> following the propaganda).
Assembly and Forth differ so radically, I don't know how you
can claim they are both procedure oriented (except that you are
following the propaganda).
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
their behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 10:32:08 GMT
On 09/21/2000 at 10:05 PM,
Jason Bowen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> > > It wasn't unannounced. If there is a lab in Engineering with it it
> > > isn't a public lab. I just wasn't notified till he showed up.
> >
> > More proof you are a disgrace to the good name of the University of
> > Colorado.
> >
> How does that follow Bob? I thought you were saying that CU was so bad
> that the counselors in your local high schools weren't going to
> recommend it to their students anymore and yet you are saying I am a
> disgrace to it's good name.
The sentence should have said ONCE good name.
> I love wathing you contradict yourself, it
> makes for a wonderful laugh.
No dictionary of the English language I have researched has a word such
spelled "wathing". Some spokesman for the University of Colorado. You
can't even use proper English.
> Maybe you can mature to the point where
> you can realize that you were bested and unable to provide proof for you
> arguments and you lost. Maybe someday you'll stop lying.
You have never bested anyone in any discussion in which you took part.
Rather, your assinine claims (half of Canada covered by an ice sheet in a
single decade) were absolutely refuted by dozens of posters.
You are the only one in this newsgroup who posts lies. The Jason
collection now includes over 300 messages. Another in this group is
sending them via US Mail to the President of the University.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 14
MR/2 Ice 2.20 Registration Number 67
Finishing in 2nd place makes you first loser
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 10:35:46 GMT
On 09/22/2000 at 10:12 AM,
"Matt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> > Isn't Apple tied in with Speilberg and Gates in some graphics company?
> > Gates wouldn't care because he supplies 90% of the software run on Apples.
> > Dreamworks SKG is it? The S is Speilberg, the G is Gates. Isn't the K
> > someone tied in with Apple?
> >
> Nope Dreamworks SKG is Spielberg, Katzenberg, and Geffen. My proof is at
> http://www.spielberg-dreamworks.com/DreamWorks_SKG.htm
> There is a tie-in with M$, it is paul allen.
> Check the facts before you post!
I stand corrected. Note, however, that my post was in the form of a
question, not a statement of facts.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 14
MR/2 Ice 2.20 Registration Number 67
Finishing in 2nd place makes you first loser
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (C Lund)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Id Software developer prefers OS X to Linux, NT
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 12:43:19 +0100
In article
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, dc
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> LOL. It isn't for me to prove my knowledge whenever you ask, CLund.
Then don't expect anybody to think you have any knowledge.
--
C Lund
http://www.notam.uio.no/~clund/
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Space Shuttle uses Windows software almost exclusively
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 10:39:54 GMT
On 09/22/2000 at 11:12 AM,
Alan Baker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> >In 10 pages of advertisements and listings under the various Computer
> >categories in our local phone book, the name Apple and/or the Apple logo
> >appears exactly 3 times. Two of those ads are for Johnathon's computers
> >mentioned above and the logo appears along side that of IBM, Compaq, HP,
> >etc. Only 2 of the myriad of computer repair firms mention Apple,
> >Johnathon's and something called Factory Service.
> >
> >Some cultural icon.
> So your "intellectual" argument against using Macs appears to consist
> mostly of following the crowd
No, my intellectual argument against using Macs is that they are largely
unsupported, proprietary oddities far from the mainstream of the real
computer world. Apple product users are the hermits of the 21st Century.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 14
MR/2 Ice 2.20 Registration Number 67
Finishing in 2nd place makes you first loser
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 10:57:13 GMT
On 09/17/2000 at 04:16 AM,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jason Bowen) said:
> The PGA Tour didn't exist until this century. Maybe it's responsible.
> You >have not proof that CFC's caused the change. No one knows what
> causes the >changes, and your theory is as full of holes as claiming the
> PGA tour did >it.
> Well hell you can't provide proof of other claims you make so you drop
> those threads so to a new one you go. You know an asshole like yourself
> wouldn't know cursorary evidence if it hit you in the face. The pga
> tour doesn't produce cfc's, ergo it isn't at fault. The are a by
> product of aerosols though and guess what, they have only existed in the
> last century. Care to try again? So why do you not like having the
> truth in front of you?
You really are a retard aren't you. I used satire to show how full of
holes your claims are. You have nothing but UNPROVEN THEORY to back up
your claim that CFC's are causing any changes in climate.
Now I doubt that anyone other than you was stupid enough to take my satire
for a claim of responsibility. Every other reader here understood what I
proved: That you haven't yet provided a shred of demonstrable fact to
support your claim that CFC's are altering climate.
Not only were you stupid enough to misread my post, you were even dumber
in using circular "logic" to prove your claim.
Let me put it in words of a child can understand:
1. You claim CFC's are altering climate.
2. You provide not a whit of proof. (In science proof means that
something is demonstrable, verifiable, and repeatable.)
3. Rather you rely on unproven theory as proof.
4. One can not prove a theory by citing the theory.
Now do you see that all you do is make a fool of yourself and the
University of Colorado.
You have no proof that CFC's didn't exist in nature or don't exist in
nature. If nature could created the much more complex chemical which form
living creatures, it sure as hell could produce CFC's. Whether or not they
existed before this century is not proven.
Climate is a changing thing. You have no proof that CFC's have any affect
on climate. Until every other possible explanation of climatic changes are
eliminated no one can validly claim that CFC's affect climate.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 14
MR/2 Ice 2.20 Registration Number 67
Finishing in 2nd place makes you first loser
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: so what?
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 12:26:51 +0100
Philo wrote in message <39cbcdf1$0$147$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>wow...i can see i've been beaten badly already :) !
>i think i'll have to go up into my attic and bring down my 8088...
>and try to put it on line
>
This will only work if it has at least a CGA screen (or hercules with cga
emulator).
You can get a suitable dos web browser from www.arachne.cz . I am curious to
know
how well this old machine will work for web browsing (at least it won't
crash as often as
win9x). If it only has a text adapter you may be able to find a dos version
of lynx and try
text browsing (or email retrieval using dos email software).
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 12:36:09 GMT
Aaron R. Kulkis writes:
> Nathaniel Jay Lee wrote:
>> I wrote:
>>> Nathaniel Jay Lee writes:
>>>> I don't mind trollers,
>>> Why not?
>>>> and I don't mind morons so much as long as they are entertaining.
>>> So, we can add you to the list of people actually encouraging such
>>> behavior and therefore contributing to the overall decline of USENET.
>> The morons are going to be present with our without
>> encouragement. I don't encourage them, I accept them.
>> Are morons any less human just because they are morons? I
> Look at Tholen, and tell us what you see.
They see someone who doesn't post to this newsgroup for entertainment
purposes.
> Heeeeeeeee!
As opposed to sheeeeeeee?
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [OT] Tholen & Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 12:38:27 GMT
Sam Morris writes:
> Allright, I'm sorry. AS to all your sad sad people who are imitating Dave
> for some perverse reason, DON'T YOU HAVE LIVES TO BE GETTING ON WITH? WHY,
> WHY?
Moul is not imitating me. He is simply using my surname in a deliberate
attempt to mislead readers into thinking that I'm the one posting the
article.
------------------------------
From: "Philo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: so what?
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 07:48:41 -0500
well Nigel my 8088 is still up in the attic but i have tried arachne on a
286
with a 20meg hd and about 2megs or ram
and it worked!
but a bit too slow to be useful really.
a 386-33 running win3.1 with IE3 actually runs pretty well.
when i get a chance i am still going to fool around with arachne as i found
out
it will run better using ms-dos7 as compared to ms-dos6.22 due to better
memory management.
oh yes. i did *downgrade* my 286 from vga to ega
you can see i have found excellent ways to waste my time
:)
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
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