Linux-Advocacy Digest #669, Volume #30 Tue, 5 Dec 00 17:13:06 EST
Contents:
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS (Mig)
Re: OS tree - SOUND OFF! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: windoze is awful (Johan Kullstam)
Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS ("Dennis Popov")
Re: Linux is awful (WorLord)
Re: Windows 2000 sucks compared to linux (JoeX1029)
Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS ("James")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Nigel Feltham")
Re: A Microsoft exodus! (Jeff Glatt)
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Nigel Feltham")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever (T. Max Devlin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 14:29:02 -0500
Tim Smith wrote:
>
> On Sun, 03 Dec 2000 14:37:29 -0500, Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >> You shouldn't be. His example doesn't represent proof for a power
> >> switch not being intuitive.
> >
> >Then please provide a COGENT differing explanation.
>
> The problem with your example is that a similar example can be used to
> disprove the intuitiveness of pretty much everything except how to turn
> off an alarm clock.
Actually not.
A simple wheeled cart is intuitive.
One need merely push or pull it a couple of feet to see how to use it.
An automobile is not.
>
> --Tim Smith
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 14:29:45 -0500
Tim Smith wrote:
>
> On Sun, 03 Dec 2000 14:37:29 -0500, Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >> You shouldn't be. His example doesn't represent proof for a power
> >> switch not being intuitive.
> >
> >Then please provide a COGENT differing explanation.
>
> The problem with your example is that a similar example can be used to
> disprove the intuitiveness of pretty much everything except how to turn
> off an alarm clock.
>
> --Tim Smith
The only 'intuitive' way to turn off an alarm clock is to throw
it with great velocity against a brick wall.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: Mig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 20:27:16 +0100
PowerPC wrote:
> yeah linux rocks forever!!!!
> and micro$oft Winbugs is a big shit
> and Bill Gays is a son of the bitch !!!
Wonderfull... youre such a intellectual . Strange that you post with OE
when you hate MS so much
> well, that 's all folks !!!
Thank you very much.. no go and grow up kid.
--
Cheers
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: OS tree - SOUND OFF!
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 14:35:46 -0500
Bruce Scott TOK wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Charlie Ebert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> [VIC 20]
> >It was my machine language machine. I wrote
> >several applications in machine language and the
> >performance wasn't that bad.
>
> Same for me with the Atari 400. The 6502 was the VW Beetle for do it
> yourselfers. I never got into machine language again, just like with
> the car, when the second one came along and was too complicated :-(
>
6502 was never meant to be used in general-purpose machines. It was
designed to be an industrial microcontroller.
8080 , 8085 from Intel, and Motorala's 6800, 6801, 6809 were MUCH better.
A superset of the 6809 lives on in the 68HC11 single-chip computers
(onboard memory and/or D/A converter(s) and/or serial ports and/or
parallel ports).
> --
> cu,
> Bruce
> drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/
> sign the Linux Driver Petition: http://www.libranet.com/petition.html
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 14:39:36 -0500
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> me.com...
> > >This unalterable (at least in NT 4) way of forcing identification is
> > >actually a strength in the NT security model.
> > >
> > >You can (and most companies do) lock down terminals (or Linux/UNIX boxes)
> in
> > >similar fashion.
> >
> > There is nothing magic about c/a/d/. ANY keystroke combination could have
> been
> > used equally. If the keyboard driver isn't secure then no part of the OS
> can be
> > considered secure.
>
> Actually, no. The keyboard driver has nothing to do with it. C-A-D is a
> hardware reset, not a software one. The keyboard controller in the keyboard
> physically treats this set of keystrokes differently.
>
> > For MS, the advantage using c/a/d/ has is making people accidentally
> reboot
> > other operating systems.
>
> No, actually, it's part of the C2 security requirements. You need a way to
> initiate a login which cannot be masked by a user mode program. On a
> typical unix or Linux machine, you need only run a 10 line program that
> clears the screen and prints login: to steal peoples passwords. That's not
> possible under NT if you don't have administrator privs.
It doesn't matter if you have admin privs or not, you ninny.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.x,comp.os.ms-windows,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: windoze is awful
From: Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 05 Dec 2000 14:59:38 -0500
"Christopher L. Estep" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:90bhbc$jfes$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > "Adam Majer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Ayende Rahien wrote:
> > > >
> > > > NT & installing hardware go along quite easily with words like
> > "hellspawn"
> > > > and "WTF!!!"
> > > > Try 2000, if it offered nothing else to top NT, it would still be
> worth
> > > > going to it *just* for this reason alone.
> > >
> > >
> > > Just to add to windoze bashing ,win2k proff. is suppose to be the _MOST_
> > > stable windoze ever released by M$. Well, :) it crashes about every
> > > 30min when running unstable software. I never thought that an OS should
> > > be affected by the user software that it runs - Linux _never_ dies on me
> > > like that [running 3 yrs now and zero crashes :-]
> >
> > A> Win 2K Pro. is certainly not supposed to be the most stable windows
> ever
> > released by MS. For this, look at Win2K DataCenter.
> > B> Did you checked with support? Do you've correct, WQL, drivers? What
> > software do you run?
>
>
> A. The stability of ANY OS depends to a VERY large part on the software
> that it runs and the interaction of said software with the OS.
> Windows 2000 Professional IS the most stable flavor of Windows for DESKTOPS
> (not only per Microsoft, but per Dataquest, Maximum PC, CNET, et. alia.).
> It supports more productivity (and NON-productivity) software than Windows
> NT 4 (and almost as much as Windows 9x/ME).
no it doesn't. given a hardware platform with memory traps like ia32
any OS instability is its own damned fault reguardless of any software
you try to run on it. low-level hardware drivers may be an exception
depending upon whether you consider them part of OS or not.
--
J o h a n K u l l s t a m
[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
sysengr
------------------------------
From: "Dennis Popov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 14:59:30 -0500
looks like we just came across a new type of troll - a trollus moronus
grandus.
PowerPC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:90j30g$18ts6$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> yeah linux rocks forever!!!!
> and micro$oft Winbugs is a big shit
> and Bill Gays is a son of the bitch !!!
>
>
> well, that 's all folks !!!
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: WorLord <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.x,comp.os.ms-windows,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,alt.os.linux,alt.os.linux.mandrake
Subject: Re: Linux is awful
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 12:11:01 -0800
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Taken from the obscure and questionable writings of "Erik Funkenbusch"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> :
>"WorLord" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >Or how about turning on ultra DMA?
>> Done for you on install.
>Not in Mandrake 7.2 it's not.
Uh, *yes*, it *is.*
I've installed it on 20 different machines now. Twenty. Two-oh. And
*every single time*, there is a little star called "use hard drive
optimizations". And a DMESG shows that they are, in fact, being used.
http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/demos/Demo/Mandrake7.2/Install/Expert/pages/expert6.php3
shows a screenshot of the *exact* stage in the install, in fact.
>FontDrake (or rather drakfont) doesn't exist on my 7.2 install. I do see
>conf files, but a locate doesn't find it.
>I did find it in the RPM's on the CD though.
Then you probably didn't install it.
>If it works for you. It doesn't for me.
DrakX doesn't work for you? I find that difficult to believe, but
okay.
>You cannot give me an "idiot simple" way of doing these things that work on
>every distribution.
I don't have to, since I'm posting from a Mandrake-Specific newsgroup;
and furthermore, I haven't argued in this thread for any other
distro's pro's or con's other then LM 7.2.
Mostly because if I did, then this discussioin would be off-topic...
which it may be now, in fact.
>Some distros give you better tools than others for some
>things, but then are lacking in others.
Then please complain about this to the proper NG's, and take AOLM off
your posting list.
--WorLord
"You could spend an hour counting the petals in a flower
It might take you a year to count the veins in each petal
If you spent ten lifetimes, maybe you could count its cells...
...but you'd have completely missed the point
You fuckhead."
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JoeX1029)
Date: 05 Dec 2000 21:08:18 GMT
Subject: Re: Windows 2000 sucks compared to linux
>That depends entirely on what you're doing. For instance, I'm running Linux
>Mandrake 7.2 on a P200 mmx with 64MB and it takes >30 seconds to open a copy
>of Netscape, not to mention that even opening copies of Konqueror
>take
>upwards of 10-15 seconds. Opening the terminal program takes 10 seconds.
>Virtually everything makes me wait. Of >course there's no wait cursor while
Hmmm... im running linux on a 133 64meg ram and its fast. X with AfterStep is
fatser than any similiar boxes ive used, even some that are faster. As for
NutscapeCommi-kreator, it dosent take nearly that long for me.
------------------------------
From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: LINUX ROCKS AND WINDOWS SUCKS
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 23:23:29 +0200
You make the Linux community proud . . .
James
"PowerPC" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:90j30g$18ts6$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> yeah linux rocks forever!!!!
> and micro$oft Winbugs is a big shit
> and Bill Gays is a son of the bitch !!!
>
>
> well, that 's all folks !!!
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:37:56 -0000
>>rescue disk to boot.
>>fschk, on one occasion I stopped it after 5 hours (4GB HD, about 3/4
full).
>>The second & third time fschk itself failed to fix the system.
Of course if he had installed on a reiserfs partition then fschk will never
need
to be used - well worth using reiserfs when machines may be switched off
without being shut down properly (or where power failure is common).
>The only systems which need reinstalling are windows ones. You
>don't reinstall linux ones because there is no advantage in
>doing so. This is a windowsism.
Except when upgrading the whole system (individual packages
can be upgraded without even a single reboot, except kernel
upgrades obviously).
>>> For ext2 to do this, you'd have to have information about every
>>> single file in a given area stored in the cache, which means you'd
>>> have to be editing eg., every /etc file, at the same time.
>>>
>>> I just do not believe this. No-one in the right mind would
>>> even consider doing something that risky.
>>
Except a windows user looking for an excuse to go trolling.
>>> Vanished???? This is isn't the X-files! Further back, you
>>> were claiming that the partition table was damaged. Now
>>> you're claiming that the filesystem vanished - what, every
>>> single bit on the HD just 'went away'?
>>
The Truth is out there.
Send for the hex-files (bad pun).
>>Lucky you.
>>On my machine (home one)
>>I'd three failures with WD 1.6 GB HD
>>One with a 10 GB (Seaquest, I think)
>>And one with a 15 GB from IBM
I have never had a drive fail at home (they usually get upgraded
within 2 or 3 years which doesn't give them time to fail) and the
last failure at work was 3 years ago (guess it's time to upgrade
that home drive again as it's 3 years old now).
>Linux machines use hardware which is as old as it is. They
>do not usually use newer or older hardware than any other OS
>installed at the same time. Another very silly statement.
>
Of course linux will usually run at a useable speed on older hardware
than certain other operating sytems (386's can still be used with
gui-less installs as mail-servers yet NT mailservers will barely boot
on anything less than a P200).
>The registry can be corrupted, the OS is not free of bugs (in
>fact its renowned for not being so).
>
up to 63,000 bugs in win2k
over 2,000 bugs in win95 (source: MS adverts for win98 stated
over 2000 corrections from win95).
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jeff Glatt)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 21:57:08 GMT
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Jeff Glatt writes:
>
>> Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
>
>>> 12 years of posting to USENET, and [Tholen is] STILL the biggest
>>> moron I've ever come across.
>> Yet another quote for the Tholen archive,
>Totally devoid of context, as usual.
All of the context of him declaring you to be the biggest moron is
contained above.
>Why don't you show Aaron claiming that nothing about a computer is
>intuitive?
Because all of the context of him declaring you to be the biggest
moron is contained above.
>Why don't you show him
>relying on invective rather than logical argument?
Because all of the context of him declaring you to be the biggest
moron is contained above.
>> and yet more evidence that Tholen is widely regarded as a fool among
>> usenet readers
>Yet more evidence that Glatt doesn't know what "widely regarded" means.
Yet more evidence that Tholen is in denial about the fact that he is
widely regarded as a fool among usenet readers
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 21:56:37 -0000
>
>Can it print yet?
>
Whoops I forgot about this problem - no it cannot print on unix yet as
the original print code from staroffice used proprietry libraries which
had to be removed to convert to open-source (some import filters
were removed for same reason so some non-ms formats are not
supported either). Apparently the windoze version does print (this
is according to website - I have only tried linux version).
>
>>Or perhaps you could create a simple template in word which breaks
>>on openoffice or staroffice and send it to the development team so it
>>can be corrected in future versions?
>
>Now that's an idea.
>
I must remember to send them my word file using multipage tables which
also breaks openoffice import filter (puts each table at start of new page
and if table runs past end of page the remainder is lost). Maybe your
problem
is caused by same bug?
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 04:15:58 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Ayende Rahien in alt.destroy.microsoft on Tue, 5 Dec 2000 01:00:03
>"Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:90h7km$14a6j$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >Well, actually, Windows can do this too. Not as well, not as easily,
>> >and not as conveniently, but it can do it.
>>
>> Wow, I never thought I would see you give even small praise to windows.
>>
>> Are you having a sick day or something max?
>
>File>Print>Print To File
>
>How much simplier can it get?
Not that simple, certainly. Not even on Unix. Sure, the brain-dead
idea that you "just" execute the command is simple enough. I believe we
were discussing what is necessary for the command to actually do what
you want. For what its worth, your 'simplier' is going to output
whatever's on screen to whatever's the default printer, not output an
arbitrary file to postscript. See what I mean?
The fact is, Nigel, I've quite a few good things to say about windows.
The desktop isn't half bad, even before you get used to it.
Monopolizing desktops will do that. In comparison to any other desktop
of five years ago, or even today, there's quite a bit of good stuff in
there. And the alternatives don't seem like they're going to ever
realize how important convenient keyboard control of the GUI is. Then
again, Microsoft hasn't quite followed through on that, either. I
prefer the standard app-menu window mechanisms of windows to the
desktop-menu of Mac or the free-style method common on X applications.
Obviously, these are things to praise, as X has increased its keyboard
support significantly and all apps generally adopt the standard GUI app
layout, MDI interface. (Windows supports many more 'real world'
interfaces that break this method than most Unix systems.)
Similarly, I do prefer the method, if not the implementation, of printer
handling in windows, just as I did in the Mac system from which it was
copied. Yes, there is a tremendous amount of benefit in the 'arbitrary
file through a print filter' mechanism Unix uses, but it leaves the
desktop user with the potential, not the reality, of being able to
easily configure, manage, and use multiple printers, both local and
remote, as far as the limited function of desktop application use goes.
So am I now damning windows with faint praise, where before I was a fan,
and before that a raving fanatic who insisted there could not, by
definition, be one single good thing about monopoly crapware?
All of the above, of course.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
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