Linux-Misc Digest #524, Volume #18 Fri, 8 Jan 99 23:13:08 EST
Contents:
Re: Why is GNOME not called a window manager? ("Patrick Wray")
Re: egcs/g++ Hello world ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers (Steve Mading)
Re: Replacing MBR in Windows NT ("Patrick Wray")
Re: INFO: compatibility between win95 & linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
built kernel (hl)
Re: AutoCad ?? (Andrea Fanfani)
Re: I NEED HELP!!! (Patrik Israelsson)
Re: Netscape 4.5 problem (Andrew Morton)
Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers (Richard Steiner)
Re: how often do you -really- need to upgrade (Richard Steiner)
Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers (Steve Mading)
Re: RAWRITE reversed (Geoffrey Kenneth Holden)
rescue on RH 5.0/5.1 (Yuval Krymolowski)
Re: Should /sbin:/usr/sbin be in a user's path stupid argument (Floyd Davidson)
Re: Linux fails to boot after dual-booting Windows 95;Reinstall LILO and it works
again!? (Eric Hardwick)
Re: Should /sbin:/usr/sbin be in a user's path stupid argument (Floyd Davidson)
Re: Linux drivers for IOMEGA zip drive (Kyle Dansie)
Re: RAWRITE reversed ("James R. Bunch")
INFO: compatibility between win95 & linux (Hassoun)
Re: how often do you -really- need to upgrade (spamnot)
Re: Newbie asks: why Linux? (mlw)
Linux on a SparcBook 2 (Nico van Rossum)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Patrick Wray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why is GNOME not called a window manager?
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 21:40:57 +1100
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message <774fbk$hf9$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
[snip]
>Ps. do you pronounce the silent g in gnome the same way you pronounce
>the silent g in gnu?
Gno. You don't.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: egcs/g++ Hello world
Date: Sun, 03 Jan 1999 11:05:31 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
James Youngman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> >
> > So - how dows one use egcs??
>
> By reading the FAQ?
>
> egcs main.cc -lstdc++
Please show me where this is located in the FAQ. I'm looking at the FAQ
posted at http://egcs.cygnus.com/faq.html, and I don't see any question that
has to do with actually running the compiler.
============= Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ============
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve Mading)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,gnu.misc.discuss,uk.comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers
Date: 8 Jan 1999 21:01:13 -0600
Andreas Schwab ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve Mading) writes:
: |> Jeff Read ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: |> : Netnerd wrote:
: |> : >
: |> : > The latest consumer poll shows that 81 percent of consumers think Microsoft
: |> : > has been good for consumers, and 52 percent think the case was brought to
: |> : > help Microsoft's rivals.
: |>
: |> : Polls also show that Bill Clinton is a good president. Is public opinion
: |> : more valid than the facts? I think not.
: |>
: |> A more accurate complaint would be to say that these polls don't
: |> actually reflect public opinion at all. I do *NOT* find a high
: |> approval percentage of Clinton amongst the people I talk to on a
: |> daily basis, and neither do most people talking on-line either.
: |> This is a mix from across the whole political spectrum from left-wing,
: |> to right-wing, and even some various "third wing" parties like
: |> libertarians. I have no idea how these "polls" are being conducted,
: |> but they don't reflect reality.
: Why do you believe that your poll is closer to public opinion than any
: other one?
Because the people I'm "polling" don't have anything in common except
for the fact that they happen to know who I am (many are not what I
would call 'friends' either.) They come from all sides of the political
debate. They are both rich and poor. They are both local and remote.
The only way Clinton could have such high approval ratings that don't
match with this by a fluke - a random roll of the dice that just so
happened to make it so that I only see those people who are in the
minority. It's possible, but not likely. Also, this is not the first
such poll that has given unrealistic results, so there's a history of
distrust at work here too. Another possibility, and one I have personally
participated in (by filling out a survey and watching the results later),
is when the pollsters ask one question, and then say something slightly
different when they post the results. For an extreme example (exaggerated
for demonstration purposes), the question might be "Would you approve of
throwing so-and-so in Prison for 10 years?", and when most people say "no",
they come out and say "People don't want to see so-and-so go to prison."
(Maybe they *did* want to take action, but 10 years was way too drastic.)
--
Steve Mading: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.execpc.com/~madings
------------------------------
From: "Patrick Wray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Replacing MBR in Windows NT
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 21:55:13 +1100
Neil Martin wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>How do I replace a master boot record that currently has LILO installed
>in it from Windows NT? NT having no 'fdisk'...
>
>If I boot DOS and do FDISK/MBR will I find the NT partitions ever again?
This isn't likely to help you very much, but I *think* I've done this at
some stage. I booted DOS, ran fdisk /mbr to remove Lilo, expecting NOT to
see the NT partitions either, but from memory I think it removed Lilo,
leaving the NT partition still bootable. Can't be 100% sure though - so
don't try it without a rescue disk.
I've always had problems dual booting NT and Linux using Lilo on the MBR. I
prefer to have Lilo on the first sector of my root partition and boot Linux
using NT's boot loader. If this is feasible for you, and if you don't
already know how to do it, you might try something like this:
Install Lilo on first sector of root partition. Boot Linux from a floppy and
type:
dd if=/dev/hdaX of=/winnt/bootsect.lnx bs=512 count=1
(where X is the number of your root partition and /winnt is a FAT partition
that you can see from both NT and Linux).
Then, in NT, copy the newly created bootsect.lnx to your C:\ drive and add a
line to boot.ini as follows:
C:\BOOTSECT.LNX="Linux"
That's it. Works nicely for me anyway.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.alpha,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.x,comp.os.linux.questions,alt.linux
Subject: Re: INFO: compatibility between win95 & linux
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:55:50 +0100
Hassoun wrote:
> hi
>
> do the win95 applications run on linux?
>
> thanks
>
> Hassoun
That dont do that by default...
But you kan use a Windows emulator, for instance wine..
to run some of the Windows apps.
Martijn
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 23:31:30 -0800
From: hl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: built kernel
HI!
I need a kernel with APM support for my notebook (Slackware - it is
working fine, but no APM). I build a kernel from my desktop (RedHat,
/usr/src/linux) How can I config the kernel and transfer it to the
notebook? I did try zlilo, zImage, zdisk. None works.
The problem: "Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 03:01"
Thanks a lot
------------------------------
From: andrea@akela. (Andrea Fanfani)
Subject: Re: AutoCad ??
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 12:50:01 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Thu, 07 Jan 1999 20:11:11 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:
>My cousin has spent years learning autocad as an engineer, and he is asking me
>if there is a way he can move away from Microsoft and still use his hard-won
>skills. I don't know. Has AutoCad been ported to Linux, or is there one as
>good or better available? Would it be a wicked learning curve to switch?
>
maybe you can try to find varicad (or varycad) ...
but i don't know an url...
sorry
Andrea
--
Andrea Fanfani
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
"togliere toglimi per il reply"
"remove toglimi to reply"
------------------------------
From: Patrik Israelsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: I NEED HELP!!!
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:59:33 +0100
TNelson1 wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Am am relatively new to linux, and I love it. I have a big problem though. I
> currently have a dual boot system, Win#$%!95 and linux. I use linux for
> everything except internet access. I am increasingly hating microsoft, and
> would love to remove all traces from my system. The only problem is I don't
> know how to get internet access (dial up) from home without it. That is the
> only thing keeping me from getting rid of it altogether.
>
> Can someone please point me to an ISP that I could use to dial up with
> linux/Netscape/telnet/ftp and have internet access? If so, there will be one
> less computer system running micr!@#$% products!!!
>
> Thanks in advance, please email the response to me as well since I am really in
> a hurry to trash windows 95.
>
> Tom
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Oh boy, oh boy, you're telling me I'm really doing this for a good purpose? :)
As always, YES I know PPP from standard linux console is a bit tricky. That's why I
recommend using a PPP tool in X instead - I use EzPPP, works fine with me. Install
it, enter the information almost like you would in Win#$%!95 (I liked that
expression :) ). If that doesn't work, your ISP is probably only using PAP
certification. If so, read the documentation for using PAP with EzPPP.
/ Patrik
------------------------------
From: Andrew Morton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.apps
Subject: Re: Netscape 4.5 problem
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 14:11:54 +1100
"Brett W. McCoy" wrote:
>
> On 7 Jan 1999 12:27:44 -0800, Paul Lew <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >MY problem with netscape 4.5 is that trying to get a *.rpm file,
> >realplayer plugin starts up; also a problem with some *.gz files like
> >the wordperfect file where it arrives as a "text" file (could be due
> >to a short file name?).
This will be due to a strange helper application setup.
Select Edit -> Preferences -> Navigator -> Applications
Find your 'RealPlayer' entry and fix it.
Also, check your $HOME/.mailcap, $HOME/.mime.types, /etc/mailcap,
/etc/mime.types for any mention of ".gz" and ".rpm".
And don't forget you can just right-click on a hyperlink and slide down
to "Save Link As..." to force a save-to-disk.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Steiner)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,gnu.misc.discuss,uk.comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 19:57:54 -0600
Here in comp.os.linux.misc, "Netnerd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
spake unto us, saying:
>The US antitrust laws are designed to protect consumers, not competitors.
>Has the consumer been harmed? Of course not.
Speak for yourself. I've had a very difficult time of it for the past
few years finding the applications I want (and I've succeeded!) even
though I chose a technically superior desktop solution for my home PC
six years ago (when I left Windows 3.1 for OS/2 2.1).
Also, putting on my corporate Macintosh user hat, we've encountered a
number of problems obtaining new versions of various applications we
use quite a bit because many vendors are dropping all platforms but
Win32 flavors.
This means that the monopoly of Windows on the desktop has harmed me
both in a home context and in a business context.
--
-Rich Steiner >>>---> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>---> Bloomington, MN
OS/2 + Linux (Slackware+RedHat+SuSE) + FreeBSD + Solaris +
WinNT4 + Win95 + PC/GEOS + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven!
Splunge!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Steiner)
Subject: Re: how often do you -really- need to upgrade
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 20:06:46 -0600
Here in comp.os.linux.misc, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (steve mcadams)
spake unto us, saying:
>I'm still trying different distributions (so far I like S.u.S.E. 5.3
>the best, but I have a half-dozen I haven't tried yet). Once I settle
>on one, how often am I really going to need to upgrade?
Need? Probably never.
>What have you guys seen over the years? How often do yo do any kind
>of upgrade? More than a new kernel?
I play with new operating systems all the time, so I don't count. :-)
--
-Rich Steiner >>>---> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>---> Bloomington, MN
OS/2 + Linux (Slackware+RedHat+SuSE) + FreeBSD + Solaris +
WinNT4 + Win95 + PC/GEOS + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven!
Wisconsin? Isn't that a suburb of St. Paul...??
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve Mading)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,gnu.misc.discuss,uk.comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Consumer Poll Says Microsoft Is Good For Consumers
Date: 8 Jan 1999 21:13:03 -0600
David Fox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: This is such a standard crackpot rant. "Everyone I talk to agrees
: with me, these polls must be full of it." I think it was invented by
: Rush Limbaugh. Its a convenient way to get people to ignore facts.
I would agree with you if polls were actually facts. Most of
the kinds of public opinion polls under discussion in this thread
are not very valid. I will never trust a poll that does not
mention the method used in the selection of the population.
The people I talked to were not selected by any special criteria,
and it included people I agree with politically as well as poeple
I don't agree with. I suspect that the reason for the difference
between that and the polls being published is that the polls being
published are not asking the same questions. Asking if Clinton
should be impeached is a completely different question from asking
if you approve of him. I've participated in polls where the
questions asked of me had nothing to do with the questions they
*claim* to have asked the participants when they publish the results.
It's easy to lie with statistics by just witholding certain information,
or slanting the way you present it.
--
Steve Mading: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.execpc.com/~madings
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Geoffrey Kenneth Holden)
Subject: Re: RAWRITE reversed
Date: 8 Jan 1999 12:58:39 GMT
Christian Hansen ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: Question from a newbie:
: When you make installation floppys from DOS, you usually use RAWRITE to
: transfer an image file.
: How do I make the reversed proces ? That is, having a Linux floppy with
: some boot code at sector 0 and a number of files on it, transfering to one
: single file, and filling what needed to make an 1.474.560 large image ?
: Using tar or what ?
: Chr. H.
I may be wrong (still fairly new to linux) but I think it is:
dd if=/dev/fd0 of=image
That should create a file called "image" in the current directory.
--
Geoff/Upsilon
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.xoom.com/DeepThought
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Yuval Krymolowski)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: rescue on RH 5.0/5.1
Date: 8 Jan 1999 07:47:41 GMT
Hi,
I've made a mistake and entered '*' in the /etc/passwd entry of
root. So now I can't login. Could you please suggest me how to
gain access to that file ? My machine has Win95/NT/EXT2 partitions.
I thought about using rescue mode, how to operate it in RH5.0 ?
I also have a boot diskette.
Another question - how do I change the size of the cache (as presented
in 'top') ?
Thanks
Yuval Krymolowski
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Floyd Davidson)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Should /sbin:/usr/sbin be in a user's path stupid argument
Date: 8 Jan 1999 13:01:10 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sam E. Trenholme <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> sbin directories don't belong in the PATH variable for normal users
>
>One thing I notice about Linux people is people get in to such horrible
>flame wars based on one person's idea of a "should". There really are no
>shoulds in Linux--only conventions, some of which are more often followed
>than other conventions.
>
>For example, I wasted some bandwidth arguing with someone over whether a
>UNIX newbie should reboot a system or send inetd a HUP process to enable a
>server placed in /etc/inetd.conf. Both methods worked, but we got all
>worked up over which was was the correct "should" way.
>
>These kind of things end up being arbitrary decisions, based on people's
>personal preferences, and I wonder wy UNIX people waste so much bandwidth
>arguing over what the correct "should"s are. It seems so childish to me.
You could use any of a number of other OS's where there is
little concern about exactly why, when or how things can best be
done. Those OS's commonly maintain what is called "compatibility"
with previous versions. Some might say they just don't fix
some of the obvious bugs.
UNIX on the other hand has been continuously is search of the *best* way
to accomplish each task, and when one or another method begins to show
itself as *the* way, then it becomes the standard way until something
better comes along. Rather than maintain compatibility with previous
versions at all costs, UNIX just keeps maturing.
There was no such thing as an sbin on the first UNIX boxes that
I did admin on. It has gained almost total acceptance now.
There *is* a specific reason for that, and doing admin on a UNIX
box as if those reason don't exist is poor policy. Advising
newbies to do that is just as poor a policy.
>- Sam (Since you asked, I added "/sbin:/usr/sbin" to my user's paths.
> My users like using traceroute [/usr/sbin/traceroute], and
> I like using ifconfig as non-root [/sbin/ifconfig])
I'm reminded of Henry Spencer's famous saying about those who don't
understand UNIX are bound to re-invent it poorly.
1) Take the sbin directories out of your "normal user" login's PATH.
2) Put traceroute, or a symlink to it, where it belongs in /usr/bin.
3) Make an alias in your profile: "alias ifconfig='/sbin/ifconfig'"
You might consider using an alias for number 2 also if correcting errors
in the distribution bothers you, though that is not a good answer if
you have multiple users.
Floyd
--
Floyd L. Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Pictures of the North Slope at <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Eric Hardwick)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.hardware,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Linux fails to boot after dual-booting Windows 95;Reinstall LILO and it
works again!?
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 01:43:34 GMT
"Shadly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>It sounds like the port configuration is different in win than in linux.
>With this modem, you may have to power the computer off, then back on before
>you can switch. I have had to do this before.
>
>I would suspect the port/boot combo problem, not the modem.
>
Unfortunately that didn't make a difference, thanks though...
Things I have tried: (That didn't work)
1. Uninstall modem under Win95 (remove device from System panel in
Control Panel.
2. Turn modem off/disconnect modem when booting.
3. Turn computer off before re-booting into Linux.
4. Set my PNP setting in my BIOS to say 'I *don't* have a PNP
operating system.
5. Set my PNP setting in my BIOS to say 'I *do* have a PNP operating
system.
BTW, In the boot-up messages, the line that causes the problem says
'Loading vfat lp lp0' ..??? (can't remember what else)
What is lp and lp0? Are they the port drivers? Maybe they are choking
the boot-up, not vfat?
Thanks for any help,
Eric Hardwick
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Floyd Davidson)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Should /sbin:/usr/sbin be in a user's path stupid argument
Date: 8 Jan 1999 13:06:34 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] got plastered and spewed this unto the network:
>>> sbin directories don't belong in the PATH variable for normal users
>
>>For example, I wasted some bandwidth arguing with someone over whether a
>>UNIX newbie should reboot a system or send inetd a HUP process to enable a
> ^^^^^^^
>You mean a HUP >>>SIGNAL<<<. inetd is the process. You send SIGNALS
>to processes.
And rebooting to accomplish the same thing is absurd.
Floyd
--
Floyd L. Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Pictures of the North Slope at <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 20:23:40 -0700
From: Kyle Dansie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.hardware
Subject: Re: Linux drivers for IOMEGA zip drive
Jürgen Exner wrote:
>
<snip>
> >> [...]
>
> Well, the original poster didn't specify what kind of interface his drives
> use, so I assumed SCSI.
> And for SCSI those removable drives are pure vanilla standard HDs where you
> don't need any special drivers at all.
>
> See, this is actually the beauty of SCSI.
>
SCSI... soon to replaced by USB...to be replaced by IEEE....
Cheers,
Kyle Dansie
--
========================================================
Linux Rules
ZIP drive Mini-HOWTO
http://njtcom.com/dansie/zip-drive.html
or
http://sunsite.unc.edu/mdw/HOWTO/mini/ZIP-Drive.html
========================================================
------------------------------
From: "James R. Bunch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: RAWRITE reversed
Date: 8 Jan 1999 14:08:32 GMT
Christian Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: How do I make the reversed proces ? That is, having a Linux floppy with
: some boot code at sector 0 and a number of files on it, transfering to one
: single file, and filling what needed to make an 1.474.560 large image ?
: Using tar or what ?
Take a look at the Bootdisk-HOWTO. The process is somewhat involved, but
works.
HTH
--
=============================
James R. Bunch "A Byte is a terrible thing to waste ...
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ... a MByte 1048576 times worse"
PGP Key available via finger
PGP Key fingerprint = B5 31 10 77 BF B0 FD B2 10 54 CB E6 13 7C 26 58
==============================
------------------------------
From: Hassoun <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.alpha,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.x,comp.os.linux.questions,alt.linux
Subject: INFO: compatibility between win95 & linux
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 21:45:47 -0500
hi
do the win95 applications run on linux?
thanks
Hassoun
------------------------------
From: spamnot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: how often do you -really- need to upgrade
Date: 8 Jan 1999 19:24:27 +0800
steve mcadams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm still trying different distributions (so far I like S.u.S.E. 5.3
> the best, but I have a half-dozen I haven't tried yet). Once I settle
> on one, how often am I really going to need to upgrade?
> I can't see needing to do more than rebuild the kernel, and any tools
> that stop working due to any kernel interface or behaviour changes.
> Or if some new tool I really really want to use requires an interfaced
> in a kernel newer than the one I'm running.
> What have you guys seen over the years? How often do yo do any kind
> of upgrade? More than a new kernel? -steve
In my opinion, it is good to upgrade the OS when there is a major
change in the OS. Such as when you go from HP-UX 9 to 10. If Linux
introduces the JFS, the LVM, then I will upgrade because it is a major
benefit to the user.
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Newbie asks: why Linux?
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 14:18:11 +0000
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, somebody says...
>
> >
> >of course you can do a lot more w/ linux. many config options at the
> >console and X level. but many users don't need this.
> >
> >anyway, i am not trolling for Be or bashing linux. just stating my
> >opinion that most new people don't need the techno-shock of linux.
>
> I agree completly!
>
> I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "but many users dont need
> this".
>
> I think an end user type computing system does not need all those additional
> features that a commerical/backroom/server type of system would need.
What harm is there in including them?
>
> for a starter, and end user system need NOT be a mutliuser system.
> This alone cuts allot of complixity out. One Box = One User.
While I would have agreed with you a year or so ago, I can't anymore.
Many families buy a home computer, these houses have kids. When a young
kid uses the computer, you want the system to protect itself and you
want changes the user made isolated to that user.
I have seen products for Windows that attempt to do this, but, since
Windows is not inherently multiuser, it does not work. Unless there
realy is one user == one computer, multiuser is the only way. Even a
spouse or significant other can have their own settings. Even Cars are
starting to have personalized settings for electronic seat position,
mirrors, etc. The car companies usually have at least two savable
settings. So, even a Cadillac is "multiuser."
>
> The problem with Unix as an end user system is that it was designed as
> a multi-user, commerical/server type Operating system. And now to try to
> offer this same system for somone at home who just needs a box to play
> a game on, balance their checkbook, write a document, draw a picture etc..
> is not working, becuase it is forcing the user to have to manage and learn
> all the extra complixity that they have no need for.
See this is something that I have though about at great length. I have a
child, I have friends that have families, and I know lots of people with
computers. I have watched them and listened to what they say. What they
say is often not what they want, or simply put, what they say they want
is not really what they want.
Users say computers are too complex, even Windows. My cousin is a prime
example. He has a fairly regular job. He has to use Windows during the
day. For his company, I setup an internet masquerading system, mail, web
page, etc. I used Linux. I gave him a Linux book, at first he was
intimidated, frustrated, and didn't want to deal with it. I told him,
"It is just a server, never touch it, and you'll never need too."
Well, he is a curious sort of guy, and started playing with it. (I
guess, with the pressure off he felt he could do as much/little as he
wanted). After about two weeks, he is born again. He wants to go full
Linux.
It is really funny to watch, he hated it at first. When he started using
Applix, and a few of the games he got used to using the computer. Now he
says the same things to me that I think, "I hate using Windows, it is
like walking on egg shells."
He also likes the multiuser, his kids get an account with which they may
do what ever they want. They do not have SU privilages so they can't
screw up the system. It just works.
>
> This is why I think systems like BeOS, Mac or Windows are better suited
> than Unix as an end user/home user/consumer type computing system.
While this is conventional wisdom and what people are supposed to
believe, I think in practice it is incorrect.
--
Mohawk Software
Windows 95, Windows NT, UNIX, Linux. Applications, drivers, support.
Visit the Mohawk Software website: www.mohawksoft.com
------------------------------
From: Nico van Rossum <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Linux on a SparcBook 2
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 15:19:00 +0100
Hello *
Does someone knows of Linux works on a SparcBook 2
and if zo, How can I install it or where can I find more info
Tanks in advance
Nico van Rossum
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
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