[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The point is there are validation tools, information and help available for free everywhere. It doesn't mean one has to spend money to validate their pages. If one takes the time to build a site for themselves using whatever method, well then why not take a bit more time and use valid code?

I am certainly not suggesting you turn away from validation on principle (I think I gave that impression). The thing is, your rhetorical 'why not' will sound weaker than the client's 'why'. Is that what you're going to tell them, or is that the kind of statement you could only let go unquestioned in a community of web developers? I'm not your client, and you shouldn't feel the need to justify your practices to me. Them, however...

As you put it, there is a notion of 'niceness' to validation. But as a paying civilian, it's unlikely your client will sympathise with this.

Saying your reason for it is that they will get better search results is an abuse of their ignorance and possibly ours (I'm not quite sure how seriously that was taken). I think you should tell your client that validation will...

1. Make their site accessible cross-browser, cross-language, cross-medium.
2. Be future-proof and never need integral re-designs to work across these factors in the future. 3. Make the back end of the finished product manageable and understandable in case they should ever hire someone else to tweak, upgrade or re-design it in any way.

The snot on the shirt is not visible to the client, only 'our friends on the internet' - who should not be your target audience; too many people design for designers, and they are not the ones who need it. Design for the client. Explain to the client how snot is unhygienic, how it will matte the shirt, how it will make it difficult to clean.

Regards,
Barney


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