Sorry for trolling grarpamp's thread. Doug replied privately to confirm my question, and let me know that others here are struggling with that too.
Moderator: if you publicized my question please publicize this answer so people know it was closed. On Tue, May 5, 2020, 12:30 PM Karl <[email protected]> wrote: > Wonderful =) > > It sounds like you need help making sure people are acting on each others' > knowledge? > > On Tue, May 5, 2020, 12:26 PM Doug Schuler < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Couldn't we just look at what pages people spend the most time with? The >> amount of advertising. The percentage of commercial sites vs. >> non-commercial. I didn't think that corporate and state domination of the >> internet was in dispute. >> >> But I don't think we could point to one person! There are plenty of local >> fiefdoms ruled not just by corporations (although money I assume plays a >> massive role) China and Russia, etc. >> >> On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 9:08 AM Karl <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Doug, >>> >>> It sounds like you're aware of the internet being solely >>> corporate-dominated. >>> >>> If we had proof that someone were algorithmically ensuring that the >>> internet stayed corporate-dominated, do you know of a way to preserve and >>> possibly publicize such proof? >>> >>> On Tue, May 5, 2020, 11:49 AM Doug Schuler < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Technology absolutely has politics since it's embedded within social >>>> (and material) contexts. I like Langdon's quote in the Whale and the >>>> Reactor: "Because choices tend to become strongly fixed in material >>>> equipment, economic investment, and social habit, the original flexibility >>>> vanishes for all practical purposes once the initial commitments are made." >>>> >>>> On the other hand, technology is not strictly deterministic. A hospital >>>> can be used to help heal people or it can be used to imprison them and to >>>> perform experiments on them. Television doesn't have to be a solely >>>> corporate dominated medium nor does the internet — but they are. >>>> >>>> — Doug >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 7:39 AM Aram Sinnreich <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> What do you make of Langdon Winner's work, arguing that sociotechnical >>>>> artifacts have inherent "politics?" >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> > On May 5, 2020, at 10:33 AM, grarpamp <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > Technology is but an agnostic tool. >>>>> > There is no such thing as a liberation tech, >>>>> > only applied tech via paths toward something. >>>>> > One cannot apply a tech toward liberation >>>>> > without first considering what a state of being >>>>> > of actual liberation might variously be about, >>>>> > to know where to go, what to make with the tech. >>>>> > Democracy being nothing more than a >>>>> > decentralized form of the murderous dictators >>>>> > many claim to be liberating themselves or people from, >>>>> > both forms hardly a state of liberation at all, >>>>> > yet worshipped and profferred by all too many, >>>>> > we therefore continue this random series >>>>> > on path choices... >>>>> > >>>>> > How to be a tyrant. Sound Familiar? >>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4LtEciQUF8 >>>>> > >>>>> > Deep Divers, let the balloon go! >>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbX-Bvb2u_w >>>>> > >>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U3lEc-IFr8 >>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWLntHoTgDA >>>>> > >>>>> > -- >>>>> > Liberationtech is public & archives are searchable from any major >>>>> commercial search engine. Violations of list guidelines will get you >>>>> moderated: https://lists.ghserv.net/mailman/listinfo/lt. Unsubscribe, >>>>> change to digest mode, or change password by emailing >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Liberationtech is public & archives are searchable from any major >>>>> commercial search engine. Violations of list guidelines will get you >>>>> moderated: https://lists.ghserv.net/mailman/listinfo/lt. Unsubscribe, >>>>> change to digest mode, or change password by emailing >>>>> [email protected]. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Douglas Schuler >>>> [email protected] >>>> Twitter: @doug_schuler >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> Public Sphere Project >>>> http://www.publicsphereproject.org/ >>>> >>>> Mailing list ~ Collective Intelligence for the Common Good >>>> * http://lists.scn.org/mailman/listinfo/ci >>>> <http://lists.scn.org/mailman/listinfo/ci>4cg-announce* >>>> >>>> Creating the World Citizen Parliament >>>> >>>> http://interactions.acm.org/archive/view/may-june-2013/creating-the-world-citizen-parliament >>>> >>>> Liberating Voices! A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution >>>> (project) >>>> http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/lv >>>> <http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/> >>>> >>>> Liberating Voices! A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution >>>> (book) >>>> http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?ttype=2&tid=11601 >>>> -- >>>> Liberationtech is public & archives are searchable from any major >>>> commercial search engine. Violations of list guidelines will get you >>>> moderated: https://lists.ghserv.net/mailman/listinfo/lt. Unsubscribe, >>>> change to digest mode, or change password by emailing >>>> [email protected]. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Douglas Schuler >> [email protected] >> Twitter: @doug_schuler >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Public Sphere Project >> http://www.publicsphereproject.org/ >> >> Mailing list ~ Collective Intelligence for the Common Good >> * http://lists.scn.org/mailman/listinfo/ci >> <http://lists.scn.org/mailman/listinfo/ci>4cg-announce* >> >> Creating the World Citizen Parliament >> >> http://interactions.acm.org/archive/view/may-june-2013/creating-the-world-citizen-parliament >> >> Liberating Voices! A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution >> (project) >> http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/lv >> <http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/> >> >> Liberating Voices! A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution >> (book) >> http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?ttype=2&tid=11601 >> >
-- Liberationtech is public & archives are searchable from any major commercial search engine. Violations of list guidelines will get you moderated: https://lists.ghserv.net/mailman/listinfo/lt. Unsubscribe, change to digest mode, or change password by emailing [email protected].
