The double first fret is a very good system. And you need not learn a new tuning. It also has some limitations.
The scordatura has a very different sound. Not better, just different. And you trade some voice leading for all those extra chords, because you really don't want the A flat in your E Major chord. It is really something. Also you can play some intermediate thirds as well for well tempered situations. It is a more chordal sound. After playing the chords it is difficult to go back. I think it is really worth trying just to hear the sound, it is hard to describe. Also I think this tuning is good for a demonstration because of the extreme position of the thirds...I always used to have to show this on the harpsichord or organ. I remember the first time someone showed me the cembalo cromatico. As for scordatura, nothing could be more historical. As for whether they used it on the theorbo, I think they had so many tunings in the early seventeenth century that someone would have tried it, but it certainly was not standard. You could argue that the ten course lute was not so common as well. I probably would lose that argument. Certainly in iconography I don't see very many frets with such extreme positions as this temperament uses, But it sounds interesting. The main thing is I can play now in a pure meantone ensemble with organ But really just the chords., it is limited in some respects. dt At 01:49 AM 11/7/2007, you wrote: >Scordature to play meantone. Workable in stead of historical. There are more >and more ways in which we are inventing a 21st century lute tradition. Like >my 'standard' scordatura of diapassons on archlutes, nothing historical >about that, just very practical. Interesting. > >Btw, I find a double first fret, or tastini, or even a single first fret to >be perfectly workable for meantone temperament in renaissance lute/theorbo >tuning. Like your system, for continuo mostly, but with some refingering for >some solo repertoire, too. > >David > > >**************************** >David van Ooijen >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >www.davidvanooijen.nl >**************************** > > >----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tayler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu> >Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 12:28 AM >Subject: [LUTE] Double Meantone > > >Several people have asked about my meantone >system, so I am posting it. If someone else has >proposed a similar system please excuse my ignorance. > >I have worked on it on and off for about a year, this is the short version. >A more complete version will follow with musical >examples that you can listen to with the lute >alone, and then the lute, organ and viol playing together. > >David Tayler's Double Meantone temperament > >Double meantone for the lute, archlute, theorbo, mandora & guitar >Is a system whereby fretted instruments may play >BOTH sharps and flats in tune at the same time. >It approximates the use of split keys on the keyboard. > >This system is a primarily for continuo players, for obvious reasons. >Solo repertory usually must be refingered!!!! >It works very well with keyboard instruments in >meantone as well as the corresponding system for viol which I developed. >It assumes that you would like a meantone >ensemble with organ or harpsichord, lute (and >other fretted instruments) and viol in which the >tuning system is carefully coordinated for both chords and scales. > >It also works very well with metal frets, though designed for gut frets. >It works with a wide range of string materials. > >The system is very simple. > >It uses a combination scordatura=ADalternate fret >system, thus eliminating the impossibility of a >system in which sharps and flats are played on >the same fret (unless you use tastini) > >By reverse engineering the temperament, I came up with the following tuning: > >g' >d' >a >e >B >G >D > >This is essentially the same as the Milanese Mandolin. >The corresponding tuning for bass viol: >d' >a >e >B >G >D > >Note that the viol only changes one string. > >Using a Korg orchestral tuner in FLAT MEANTONE, >tune the open strings and set the wide frets (frets 1, 3,5,7) > >Then, by ear, or using the sharp meantone temperament, set the sharp frets >NB You may tweak the thirds anyway you like! Some >people may have trouble playing with very low thirds. > >Lastly, adjust the open strings and second fret >to get a reasonable fifth on fret two with other >notes. This will retemper very slightly the F Sharp at Fret 2 on the 4th >course >Depending on your string material, you may need >to slant the sixth and seventh frets slightly > >This tuning can therefore give excellent major >and minor chords, but you MUST use the correct third. >For example, E major uses G sharp on the second >course, 6th fret, whereas the A Flat is provided on the first or third >frets. > >This tuning is an "end result" temperament, which >means that the actual sounds of the notes is >used, instead of the theoretical values. As such, >it will peacefully work with a properly tunes >keyboard instrument, especially one with split >keys. It also compensates for the actual >vibrating length and pitch drift on the higher courses. > >In addition, slanted frets in this tuning will accomodate other >temperaments. > >Note that the variants are possible: >Theorbo in A a tone higher >Double reentrant instead of single reentrant > >dt > > > > >To get on or off this list see list information at >http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > > --
