Maybe our culture is disintegrating before our very eyes. Can a culture be lost?

Gary


----- Original Message ----- From: "Monica Hall" <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "Christopher Wilke" <chriswi...@yahoo.com>
Cc: "Lutelist" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2010 4:03 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: More digital facsimiles from the (public) libraries?



----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Wilke" <chriswi...@yahoo.com>
To: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>; "David Tayler"
<vidan...@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2010 2:20 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: More digital facsimiles from the (public) libraries?


David,

Yes, indeed, as do academic presses in general. University presses are
among the worst offenders, with many volumes priced out of the range of
individual buyers.  I suppose they have to do something to recoup the
losses from the limited appeal of many specialized subjects.  But are
these artificially inflated prices sustainable? Won't libraries just stop
buying stuff they determine is not as important as X or Z?

That is already happening.   The specialized library where I used to work
declined to buy a specialist book on Stradivarius which cost £80.   Their
funds just didn't stretch to it.   I am having to wait until the British
L:ibrary get around to cataloguing the copy I assume they will receive under copyright laws. Could be yonks if they are cutting back on staff to do the
cataloguing (a highly skilled activity in itself).

Monica

Who can blame them if they need to make these budgetary decisions, but how
scary is that?  Publishers in turn will stop publishing the things that
aren't so "important"...

    Things are increasingly turning to online resources, but this raises
real issues of ephemerality.  What is the probability that someone a
hundred years from now will be able to access the exact online information
that people the people in 2010 accessed?  The long-term survivability of
much of today's information might very well depend on loose printouts,
made and preserved at some anonymous user's whim.  Digital storage media
has also shown that it is far less reliable than first believed (CDRs only
have about a ten year shelf life, for example.)

  Wow, that's much more of a free association rant than I first intended.
Anyway, I suppose it goes to show that the accomplishments of our
civilization hang by a much thinner thread than any of us realize. All of
our artifacts might ultimately be far less permanent than the wooden
ceiling of an ancient Greek temple.

Chris

Christopher Wilke
Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
www.christopherwilke.com


--- On Thu, 11/11/10, David Tayler <vidan...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

From: David Tayler <vidan...@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [LUTE] Re: More digital facsimiles from the (public) libraries?
To: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Date: Thursday, November 11, 2010, 8:54 PM
By charging high prices, sometimes
hundreds of dollars, for these
facsimile editions, the libraries are deprived of
resources.
The publishers count on extracting a toll from libraries.
dt

At 04:02 AM 11/11/2010, you wrote:
>As a retired librarian it seems to me that everyone
will be better off if
>you have your way except the poor old libraries and
librarians who need
>money to keep their heads above
water. Without us there wouldn't be any
>books available or a decent place to read
them. Why should people make
>money out of doing an edition or even publishing a
facsimile but the not the
>people and organizations who
>have made sure that these things are preserved in the
first place?
>
>In any case even a facsimile is not a substitute for
seeing the real thing.
>
>Monica
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tayler"
<vidan...@sbcglobal.net>
>To: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
>Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2010 9:33 PM
>Subject: [LUTE] Re: More digital facsimiles from the
(public) libraries?
>
>
>>Although I understand all of the issues, including
compensating ppl
>>for their time, charging money for facsimiles is
basically evil, and
>>in the long run everyone will be better served by
having more music
>>available--more concerts, more audience, more
work.
>>What all libraries should do is just put it all
online, and then if
>>someone wants to make an edition and sell it, fine.
Just make a PDF,
>>and upload it, and I guarantee that everyone will
benefit.
>>This also prevents players from owning a repertory
by limiting access.
>>
>>If scholars want to sell the commentary as a
separate book, that is
>>also fine, and continues an established tradition.
>>dt
>>
>>
>>
>>At 12:32 PM 11/10/2010, you wrote:
>>> Still something that I don't
get:
>>>
>>> why are some public (public)
libraries slowly making all their MS
>>> available as a digital download -
and I'm thinking about the the
>>> Bayerisch Staatsbibliothek here
in Munich, between others -, while
>>> there are other PUBLIC libraries
(hello, British Library ...) - that
>>> still do not even seem to
envisage that ...
>>>
>>> Shall we (as single members of
the list) put some pressure on our
>>>local
>>> libraries? Send an email to the
curators of their music departments -
>>> maybe as rightful, registered
members of the library, as I guess some
>>> of us are - and ask about it?
>>> (Of course, this doesn't want to
diminuish at all the value of such
>>> pubblication as the Dd.2.11 by
the Lute Society. The scholarship part
>>> is something you dont get in a
digital facsimile ...)
>>> Your opinion, listers?
>>> Matteo
>>> On 10 November 2010 20:19, Denys
Stephens
>>> <[1]denyssteph...@ukonline.co.uk>
wrote:
>>> [...]
>>>
>>> It's also worth
noting that whilst some
>>> of
>>> the world's libraries are
making digital copies of their musical
>>> sources
>>> available, there is
currently no expectation that this, or indeed
>>> any of the
>>> Cambridge University
Library manuscripts will become available as
>>> free
>>> electronic downloads.
>>> Denys
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>References
>>>
>>> 1. mailto:denyssteph...@ukonline.co.uk
>>>
>>>
>>>To get on or off this list see list information
at
>>>http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>









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