Thanks for the great info. I'm probably going to pass, my current queue is pretty full with projects. I just finished a Poqet PC Plus (created the custom serial cable from dissecting a Toshiba external floppy), and am currently working on an Amstrad NC200. I got the serial port working (Set xon/xoff on NC200, NO flow control on PC, go figure) and have CP/M installed and 4 drivers setup on the 1MB flash card. I just need to load since more CP/M software on it. I also have a Cambridge Z88 in the queue with 768k of RAM (add-on RAM cartridges). All of these seem so much more useful than the Tandy 600 will ever be. I also have 2 Epson PX-8's that run CP/M.
On Tue, Feb 26, 2019, 10:40 AM Brian White <bw.al...@gmail.com> wrote: > I have one purely for completeness and curiosity. > As a computer, it makes a great brick. > It's frankly a terrible computer. It's the worst of several worlds. > All the portability of paving stone. 8086 cpu but not one bit of any other > x86 pc platform standards, so no MS-DOS or any other os. All the > limitations of the M100/102/200 menu/ram/rom memory arrangement without > *any* of the software that did manage to get written for 100-200, or even > the thorough dcumentation and build tools to write software like we have > for 100-200. Most units didn't even come with BASIC. The serial port is > amazingly actually slower than the M100's (due to rom routines as far as > anyone can tell). Though the built-in telcom has xmodem built-in so that's > actually a big deal for bootstrapping. That alone allows you to create > yourself a new copy of the original utility disk purely from downloads. > > It's way collossally heavier than m100, if anything actually slower at > most tasks, even though it has more ram and a more powerful cpu on paper. > Similarly on paper, many more dots on a larger screen, built-in disk drive > and disk drive support in rom (no need to install a dos like what it takes > to use a tpdd). For pure document writing, yes you can write more and > larger documents before needing to put away on disk, and when you do, the > disk is right there built-in. I can't comment of the typing quality of the > keyboard as I don't touch type myself and haven't played with that one > recently enough to have a useful impression. It has a large heavy 4xD cell > nicd battery pack permanently installed inside, aside from the same sort of > soldered-on memory backup battery on the motherboard like M100 has. It's > not soldered in, it's a removble plug, but, you have to open the case to > get inside and unscrew it from a mount. It's not an operation you can do > periodically except in periods of years. > > By now, the plastic case is very brittle. That heavy internal battery > breaks screw posts where it's mounted easily. Opening the case you will > almost certainly break other parts like around the floppy drive no matter > how careful you are just because of the awkward size & weight of the screen. > > There was only ever 2 option roms ever made as far as I can tell. > Multiplan which most units shipped with, and BASIC which seems to be rare. > There was practically no other software ever made for it, at least, none > you can still find today. I've seen rumors and references to a few > commercial utilities that may have actually existed once, but never seen > the software itself. > > There is a service manual, but it has not been scanned & uploaded yet. > Garrett Meiers of bithistory.org has it. He posted a picture of the spine > on FB once. It has never been seen again... > There is a developer kit, which I have never seen and is not anywhere > on-line that I can find so far. All I have is a partial documentations from > that dev kit which describes the overall structure of a rom. I don't know > if it's enough info to actually create a working hello-world rom. > > On the positive side, the machine uses no asics or other custom chips. > It's all off-the shelf generic parts, at least the chips. I *think* I read > somewhere that there's not even any pals or gals, but I am not so sure > about that right now without checking again. The screen is obviously custom > and the disk drive is a bit uncommon too. The option rom socket uses the > same special Molex chip carrier socket that the M100 has, but unlike > M100-200 the pinout is at least straight 27C256, AND, there are multiple > 3d-printable models of the chip carrier. So, you can totally buy a generic > 27C256 and a 3d printed chip carrier, burn the BASIC rom with any ordinary > burner (ex: tl-866), and slap it in there. And experiment with trying to > dissect the multiplan and basic roms and possibly making a new rom that > actually runs. > > If you do get one, there is at least now both a disk/ram version of BASIC > readily available for download, and recently the rom version was finally > found, dumped, and shared by someone who wished to remain anonymous. > I have all the files, links to known good properly wired serial cables, > and a detailed procedures written up to download the support files to a > modern pc, xmodem them over to the M600, and use the M600 to create a new > utility disk from there. And a scan of the user manual, and that > reverse-engineered ram module, and links to get new batteries & power > supply. > > http://tandy.wiki/Model_600 > > If you get one from anyone that has to ship it to you, be prepared, the > battery will likely bust free inside during shipping even with pretty good > packing. But the only way to avoid that would be for the seller to open the > case and remove the battery and pack it in the box outside the computer, > and that may just cause some other breakage, maybe even worse because the > keyboard & lcd ribbon cables are a bit tight and finnicky, and that's if > they are even willing to try it. I suggest bubble wrap on the unit itself, > AND loose peanuts around that, to try to absorb all bumps and bangs. > > This is all not to say that it's terrible *project*, only to say that it's > a terrible *computer*. :) > If it was 1986 or whenever it came out, no way in hell should you get one, > and in fact few did. > But today to pore over it as a curiosity, well that's different. > > > On Tue, Feb 26, 2019 at 9:19 AM Tom Dison <fretina...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> There is a model 600 for sale at a good price on eBay, but I'm kind of >> hesitant. It seems to be quite the oddball model in the series. Does anyone >> have experience with it? >> >> On Tue, Feb 26, 2019, 6:34 AM Stephen Adolph <twospru...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> I'm just surprised that something as minor as attribution got you riled >>> up - should have put your name(s) on the silkscreen. Your comment about >>> side deal also struck me as a bit surprising - Oshpark is based on free >>> sharing. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Feb 26, 2019 at 2:03 AM Brian White <bw.al...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> It was public from the beginning. Jayeson made it after I asked on FB >>>> if anyone could/would do so. I sent him the interface information and a >>>> working original sample, and eventually a whole not-quite-working model 600 >>>> as a gift (shipping to AU was worth a lot more than the M600 even if it was >>>> fully working), and after a couple revisions he emailed me gerbers as well >>>> as created the >>>> oshpark entry, I built a set and tested them in a working M600, alone >>>> and combined with an original module in the same machine, and found no >>>> problems, posted some pics of my completed units and gave Jayeson permision >>>> to use them in his oshpark entry. I asked if someone wanted to design it >>>> under some form of open source license right from the outset. Didn't have >>>> to be public domain. I actually would have liked gpl or some version of >>>> cc-with-attribution myself, but public domain is certainly "gpl or >>>> free-er". >>>> >>>> I already articulated the concern, and the lowness of it's level, as >>>> clearly as I could. What part of "They are not violating any actual >>>> laws, because this pcb design is explicitly placed in the public domain. >>>> It's just that it would be at least minimally considerate to give a little >>>> attribution where they got something from." failed at that? >>>> >>>> It ain't the end of the world, but does something have to be the end of >>>> the world to talk about it? >>>> >>>> On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 11:11 PM Stephen Adolph <twospru...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Never mind. I see the fine print now. >>>>> >>>>> So..... it is now public. What is the concern? Someone is >>>>> commercializing it. Price is less than oshpark. Sounds like a gòod >>>>> thing. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Monday, February 25, 2019, Stephen Adolph <twospru...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> How waa the design explicitly placed in the public domain? Juat >>>>>> curious. De facto via oshpark? >>>>>> >>>>>> The 2nd one not mine. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Monday, February 25, 2019, Brian White <bw.al...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Is this somebody here, or does anyone recogize or know them? >>>>>>> http://ebay.com/itm/113662788499/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They are not violating any actual laws, because this pcb design is >>>>>>> explicitly placed in the public domain. It's just that it would be at >>>>>>> least >>>>>>> minimally considerate to give a little attribution where they got >>>>>>> something >>>>>>> from. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They even (re)used the pictures right from the original oshpark >>>>>>> listing: >>>>>>> https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/8HMgno1x >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The designer (and oshpark account) is Jayeson Lee-Steere and the >>>>>>> oshpark pics came from me. >>>>>>> The ebay seller is not Jayeson nor does he know them, so it's not a >>>>>>> deal he set up with the seller. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Same seller: >>>>>>> http://ebay.com/itm/113662802362/ >>>>>>> and the origin: >>>>>>> https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/V0tpeuMg >>>>>>> >>>>>>> That one actually says copyright right on it. I believe this one is >>>>>>> Steven Adolph right? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> bkw >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> bkw >>>> >>> > > -- > bkw >
