On Sat, 2018-03-31 at 17:57 -0400, Richard Damon wrote: > On 3/31/18 3:35 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: > > > > On Sat, 2018-03-31 at 14:50 -0400, Richard Damon wrote: > > > > > > To me the issue sounds like why is fmp.com forwarding spam? > > > > > > If this is a case of fmp.com offering forwarding mailboxes to users, who > > > might be using gmail as a final destination, then yes, fmp needs to try > > > to be as good at detecting spam as gmail or users need to accept the > > > increased spam levels. > > If pigs could fly ....! I do the very best job I can of filtering spam > > from inbound email, and get about 90% of it, maybe more, but fighting > > spam is a forever job of whack-a-mole. I certainly wish that I could do > > as good a job of parsing spam from legit email as Gmail does, but I'm a > > one-person shop, and have many tasks. Gmail has dozens, perhaps > > hundreds of very smart people assigned to managing their spam > > filtering, and they do a very good job of it. I could _never_ hope to > > match their efficiency or accuracy, nor could most small operations > > such as FMP Computer Services. > > But coming at least close is the job you sign up for in being a mail > forwarder. You at least need to be good enough that you aren't seen by > google as an uncaring domain, and maintain enough information that they > can continue to do what they do well.
Rest assured, we "come at least close". This is not an option here, it's a necessity. Email redirection is a feature of my MTA (Courier) and has been offered since FMP went into business in the 1990s. It's a standard feature of many MTAs and many ESPs offer it. I've had to deal with Gmail's honey-potting before, and I can do it again if necessary. I don't imagine that you've ever done commercial email administration, Richard, or you might have something constructive to say instead of just spewing admonitions to "do better". > > > > The problem is that Gmail is whitelisting based on the From address, > > rather than the Reply-To address, which should be an _option_ open to > > users. On Google's scale of operation, I'm just a fly on a dog turd so > > any feature which might benefit my users and subscribers is pretty much > > a no-nevermind for them. > > Which is why I was saying make a 1:1 mapping of From addresses to > Reply-To addresses. The From address _has_ to be from an address at fmp.com, which is the reason for From-munging in the first place. If you don't understand how DMARC works, or the problems it causes, Mark, or someone else on this list can send you to a reference on it. The Reply-To address is EITHER the original Reply-To address on the received email, or, if it had none, the ORIGINAL From address. Mapping the Reply-To address to the munged From address makes no sense at all. > > > Another option is to deterministically munge the from address so every > > > incoming email address gets a unique fmp address that it represents (it > > > doesn't have to be absolutely unique, mostly unique is likely good > > > enough), something like replace the at with _at_ and add a tail wart > > > like _dm...@fmp.com (so you can have other addresses an not worry about > > > possible overlaps with those) and use that as the from address. Then a > > > reply will only whitelist that specific original from address. > > Which, as I noted in my original post, will cause the Gmail user's mail > > account to end up with a whole lot of useless whitelisted address which > > would need to be deleted, and FMP's server might well end up getting > > blacklisted as a result. > No more than if GMail did implement a white-list on Reply-To addresses. No, because the Reply-To address is the _original_ From address. Such a whitelisting would be useless as long as Gmail's policy with regard to DMARC rejection remains in place, but unless we get into some kind of meta-heading BS, it's the best we might do. -- Lindsay Haisley | "The first casualty when FMP Computer Services | war comes is truth." 512-259-1190 | http://www.fmp.com | -- Hiram W Johnson ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org