Hi y'all - what a mess! Technical difficulties indeed. If we have a relatively new phenomenon, shouldn't we have a new term for it, otherwise we still have the traditional "Hi, I'm Mrs. Smith- Jones and this is my wife Mrs. Smith-Jones."
On Oct 13, 10:39 am, "Liz Purkrabek" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Many gay couples feel the symbolic nature of the word "marriage" would be > validating. I think many gay couples wouldn't care what you call their > relationships except that marriage has become a symbol of acceptance and > legitimacy for the gay community. If by calling gay unions "marriages" it > soothes the hearts and minds of millions of people all over the world, I'm > for it. > > If calling gay unions "marriages" helps to heal the thousands of years of > cruelty, fear, and ignorance that have been heaped on gays, I'm for it. > > Liz > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Clogtowner > Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 9:01 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [skeptics-145] My Philosophy > > Hi y'all - I agree. Marriage is simply a contract which gives some security > and legality to a relationship. It's traditional (western) purpose has been > to create an environment for reproduction and nurture. I don't say that this > is the only method, but it is one I like and has worked for me. A gay > relationship doesn't have the purpose of reproduction therefore it should > have a different name. By all means give legal lifetime partnership rights > to it. > Here's an analogy to illustrate my point. Two machines produce electrictiy. > One produces direct current and is called a generator. One produces > alternating current and is called an alternator. The main purpose is very > similar but with one difference hence the different name. I say no more than > that. > Please spank me. > > S. > Imbibo ergo sum. > > _____ > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [skeptics-145] My Philosophy > Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 23:20:59 -0400 > > Quickly, marriage didn't evolve in the way of biological evolution. Humans > have common feelings and urges, but marriage is defined in so many different > ways cross culturally, that you can't define it as needing to be between a > man and a woman or a man and a man, etc. Marriage is not even necessary in > all cultures. There are some that have no marriage whatsoever and that > lifestyle was a successful adaptation. > > Marriage is made of culturally arbitrary rules when it does exist, and > there is no reason why gay marriages would not necessarily turn out to be > the next successful cultural adaptation. I'm not saying it's likely, but as > with biological evolution, it is nearly impossible to determine what kind of > cultural adaptation will prove to be the most successful. > > Liz > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Clogtowner > Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2008 2:23 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [skeptics-145] My Philosophy > > Hi y'all - I'll reply to the Buddhism post when I've had the time to digest > it. > On the question of gay marriage, for me it is simply a question of semantics > and not separate but equal. I believe that natural evolution over milleniae > has arrived at the present biologically efficient method of reproduction and > nurture. We call it marriage and that's why I married. Admittedly some > couples marry with no desire or even ability to reproduce - they should have > the right to a civil union or a marriage. > I believe a civil union is the right method of lifetime partnership for gays > as it doesn't have the same purpose as marriage, and is therefore different. > It should have all the rights granted to a marriage except those pertaining > to childbirth. > For me the jury is still out on gays creating families by adopting children > - I need far more information before I can decide whether children in gay > families grow up to be well balanced adults in the same proportions as the > rest of the community. If it turns out that they do, then I may well change > my view. > Jason has quoted one paper on the subject but I'm afraid that is not enough. > > Some of my best friends have been, and are, gay. I have never met an adopted > child with a gay family upbringing. > Obviously, if gay marriage becomes the prime choice, humanity is doomed > without artificial evolution. > > S. > Imbibo ergo sum. > > _____ > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [skeptics-145] My Philosophy > Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:10:20 -0400 > > Hi Steve, > > While it is biologically true that gay couples cannot procreate, many > straight couples have also found they are unable to do so. Since marriage > is a contract of sorts with religious overtones, it seems to me that it > should be enforced and allowed without prejudice. Civil Unions, while > seeming to provide all the contractual benefits of marriage, still creates a > kind of lesser contract, similar I think to the so-called "separate but > equal" schools during segregation. It is only when the prejudicial aspects > of that system we removed that the underlying prejudice could be seen. The > schools were separate, but they were never equal. The idea of civil unions > promotes the desire of those who wish to stigmatize homosexuality- for it to > remain separate from a "normal" lifestyle. While it is preferable to gay > couples having no rights, it's like giving someone partial rights. I say > let people who wish to marry, regardless of the sexual orientation, do so. > As long as I was separated from black people, I could never really know them > or empathize with them. Since I was married to a black woman for 24 years > and have always had black friends, I no longer think of them with the > prejudice I was brought up with. It seems to me that those who oppose gay > marriage probably have few gay acquaintances or friends and thus do not > relate to them in an empathetic manner. > > Once restrictions on gay marriage are removed, society doesn't fall apart. > That's been proven time and again. > > Rick S > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Clogtowner > Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2008 10:21 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [skeptics-145] My Philosophy > > Hi y'all - this comes close to my philosophy - anyone agree, or want to kick > the crap out of > me?http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/12/nyregion/12marriage.html?em > S. > Imbibo ergo sum. > > _____ > > See how Windows Mobile brings your life together-at home, work, or on the > go. See Now <http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/> > > -- > Please Note: If you hit "REPLY", your message will be sent to everyone on > this mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > This message was sent by Clogtowner ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) from The Olive > Branch <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/> Atheists Meetup Group. > To learn more about Clogtowner, visit his/her member > <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/members/921577/> profile > To unsubscribe or to update your mailing list settings, click here > <http://www.meetup.com/account/comm/> > > Meetup Support: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 632 Broadway, New York, NY 10012 USA > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 3515 (20081011) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com<http://www.eset.com/> > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 3515 (20081011) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com<http://www.eset.com/> > > -- > Please Note: If you hit "REPLY", your message will be sent to everyone on > this mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > This message was sent by Rick Sadler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) from The Olive > Branch <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/> Atheists Meetup Group. > To learn more about Rick Sadler, visit his/her member > <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/members/4935087/> profile > To unsubscribe or to update your mailing list settings, click here > <http://www.meetup.com/account/comm/> > > Meetup Support: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 632 Broadway, New York, NY 10012 USA > > _____ > > Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows > Live. See Now <http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093185mrt/direct/01/> > > -- > Please Note: If you hit "REPLY", your message will be sent to everyone on > this mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > This message was sent by Clogtowner ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) from The Olive > Branch <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/> Atheists Meetup Group. > To learn more about Clogtowner, visit his/her member > <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/members/921577/> profile > To unsubscribe or to update your mailing list settings, click here > <http://www.meetup.com/account/comm/> > > Meetup Support: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 632 Broadway, New York, NY 10012 USA > > -- > Please Note: If you hit "REPLY", your message will be sent to everyone on > this mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > This message was sent by liz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) from The Olive Branch > <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/> Atheists Meetup Group. > To learn more about liz, visit his/her member > <http://skeptics.meetup.com/145/members/2813809/> profile > To unsubscribe or to update your mailing list settings, click here > <http://www.meetup.com/account/comm/> > > Meetup Support: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 632 Broadway, New York, NY 10012 USA > > _____ > > See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of > your life. 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