CB, if you get time, check out this link found on Naturalism.org. "Punishment: Since the retributive justification for punishment is based largely on the notion that behavior is originated by a causally autonomous self, the motive to impose such punishment may diminish once it is seen that such a self does not exist. In particular, support may drop for punitive measures such as the death penalty or prison sentences without rehabilitative amenities. More attention will be paid to the conditions which create crime, and to approaches that redeem offenders instead of further brutalizing them. See the Criminal Justice page."
www.naturalism.org/conseque.htm Taylor said >>> Agreed. But I do think there are a number of reasons for punishment: 1) Train the person not to behave that way (spanking, prison) 2) *Prevent* the person from behaving that way (prison, amputation, death) 3) Make society feel better (retribution) 4) Make the victim feel better (retribution) 5) God says so. (morality, guilt, sin, evil) I'm ok with 1 and 2, but I don't feel good about 3, 4 and 5. Naturalism is compatible with 1-4, but not 5. <<< Great. Understanding. :-) On Nov 5, 3:23 pm, CrossBow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > <<We instinctively kill those like Charlie and Bobby>> > > I smell some truth and evolutionary probability here...though it's not > pretty. > > [?] > > > > On Wed, Nov 5, 2008 at 3:18 PM, BBDD <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > No, murder is NOT most often a crime of passion. Such is called > > manslaughter. There are cold blooded murderers who need to be put > > down, not as punishment... but because those who are a certain way are > > far more dangerous than a rabid animal. I have known such individuals. > > I knew Bobby B. and Squeaky. Lived across the street from them. > > Squeaky needed therapy. Lots of it. Endless therapy. Bobby B. and > > Charles Manson just needed to be put down. Charlie couldn't help being > > the way he is. Neither could Bobby. Still they needed to be put down, > > not as punishment, but because it is the most humane thing to do for > > them and their potential victims. These people don't just kill. They > > kill slow and enjoy every minute of it. They poison all of society > > within their proximity whether you know they are their or not. When > > they lived on Alamo Square, it was called the Little Alamo or Murder > > Square. Without them being responsible directly for any of them there > > was more than a murder a week in that one block park. We instinctively > > kill those like Charlie and Bobby. In their particular cases they > > still live but are dead to society. > > >http://niggerwise.com > > > On Nov 5, 3:00 pm, Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > <<is it saying that punishment for some behaviors should be > > > considered relative to the environment that affected the criminal when > > > we > > > consider punishment like the death penalty? That we can't help > > > ourselves in > > > some situations? >> > > > > Possibly. One of the arguments against the death penalty for, say, > > > murder, is that murder is usually a crime of passion. In other words, > > > they don't think. Historically, the data did not support the idea > > > that the death penalty reduced the amount of murder. > > > > If that's true, why execute a criminal? > > > > But I think the question is more relevant to accidental crimes. If I > > > get drunk and run over a 10-year-old, why is my penalty so much > > > harsher than if I was merely weaving down the road and got pulled over > > > by a cop? In both cases, the crime is the same, driving under the > > > influence. > > > > I would argue that the penalty needs to be whatever is required to > > > stop the behavior and no more. The penalty attached to unintended > > > consequences is unlikely to be a deterrent because the unintended > > > consequences are...unintended. I don't intend to run over anyone, so > > > why should I be concerned about the penalty associated with that > > > behavior? > > > > Probably the underlying reason is that we feel that the perpetrator > > > "deserves" a harsher sentence. > > > > B60.gif > < 1KViewDownload- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Memphis Freethought Alliance" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/memphisfreethoughtalliance?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
