There is a disisdent currently in a chinese jail who was sure that Yahoo
wouldn't tell the Chinese government who he was.  They did.  It depends
on organizational priorities of the cloud host.

On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 23:22 -0500, Sean O'Connor wrote:
> As with anything it all depends on context.  In the context of
> developers/IT people and platforms, your description is a reasonable
> one for the term cloud computing.  In the consumer context, the term
> has a different meaning in it's most common use.  In that context, the
> term is used to refer to any service where the majority of the
> application's execution and storage happens on centralized servers
> which completely abstract any operational concerns from the user.
>  Examples would include gmail, dropbox, google docs, etherpad, github,
> and squarespace.
> 
> 
> All of these services allow technically competent but not necessarily
> sophisticated users to setup, configure, scale, and use systems which
> previously they would have had to have hired an IT administrator to
> setup and manage.  They don't need to worry about dealing with
> outages, running out of resources, or keeping track of backups.  This
> is enormously powerful and valuable for a very large section of users.
> 
> 
> Finally as a bit of a bonus, there are a number of collaboration type
> features which become much easier to implement when users are all
> working on a common system.
> 
> 
> If the privacy concerns are too great of a risk for you and you are
> willing to spend the time and money to operate your own systems that's
> absolutely your business and your right.  Understand however that for
> many other people, the ability to fill out a form and not have email
> infrastructure be a problem for their company anymore is incredibly
> valuable.
> 
> 
> A side note on the privacy concern/trust issue:  think about the
> incentives for Google or any other large "cloud computing" company.
>  They basically make more money in the logn term by increasing the
> number of people who use their services.  Anything they do to
> significantly violate a user's trust decreases the number of people
> who will use their service over the long term.  At the end of the day,
> they may do stupid things (e.g. expose your address book via buzz) but
> they have very strong incentives to correct those mistakes quickly and
> to learn from them.  When evaluating a service you need to look at
> more than just what could they do and think about what makes sense for
> them to do. Look at the consequences for them if they do something
> "evil".
> 
> 
> ____________________________
> Sean O'Connor
> http://seanoc.com
> 
> 
> On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 10:55 PM, Chris Knadle
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>         On Monday 01 March 2010 21:54:51 Matthias Johnson wrote:
>         > On Mar 1, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Mark Wallace
>         >
>         > <[email protected]> wrote:
>         > > I see.  the problem is that I just experienced over 60
>         hours with no
>         > > internet access.  Wouldn't that make it impossible to do
>         much of
>         > > anything with my computer?
>         >
>         > Ok so this is probably the biggest back and forth on lug I
>         have seen
>         > to date and it has morphed slightly off the original email
>         but to me
>         > this is the most damning thing about cloud computing.  If we
>         were in an
>         > always connected world it might work but we are not.  Also
>         the fact
>         > that open wifi is slowly becoming illegal these days the
>         filtered
>         > options for public wifi will probably be less than
>         desirable.  Cloud
>         > computing is definately something not needed IMO.  It also
>         brings up
>         > the issues of fair use and such.  Which laws apply?  Where
>         the server
>         > resides or the user?
>         >
>         > Matthias Johnson
>         
>         I'll throw this in, as it might answer some of your questions
>         concerning
>         "cloud computing" such as...   "Whaaat is it?!?" [Cat from Red
>         Dwarf...]
>         
>         I recently went to an IEEE meeting about cloud computing (Nov
>         2009 I think?).
>         As far as I could tell the term "cloud computing" mostly means
>         "an automated
>         method for a user to request and for a system to provision a
>         virtual machine,
>         with the specified resources".  In other words, you visit a
>         web page to order
>         a virtual box, you choose what kind of setup you want from a
>         list of
>         predefined configurations (one of which hopefully fits most of
>         what you need),
>         you click "go", and in a couple of minutes you've got a remote
>         box available
>         to you that you can ssh to, where you can modify the setup
>         from there.
>         
>         Sounded like from there you can automate spawning virtual
>         machines with
>         duplicate configurations if you need to scale some network
>         application.
>         As far as I could tell, it's mostly geared towards businesses
>         that can use
>         that kind of automation in order to handle a network load that
>         varies.  It's
>         not an end-all be-all solution -- it's essentially a niche
>         market.
>         
>         For an individual, there isn't much need for this kind of
>         system unless that
>         person is running a business like Craig's List, Paypal, etc --
>         something that
>         needs to be able to scale.  Whether "cloud computing" could
>         host services like
>         these more cheaply than doing it "in-house" isn't clear.  If
>         it isn't, then
>         "cloud computing" is essentially a solution in search of a
>         problem.
>         
>         
>          -- Chris
>         
>         --
>         
>         Chris Knadle
>         [email protected]
>         _______________________________________________
>         Mid-Hudson Valley Linux Users Group
>          http://mhvlug.org
>         http://mhvlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mhvlug
>         
>         Upcoming Meetings (6pm - 8pm)                         MHVLS
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>          Mar 3 - Sahana and 7 Years of MHVLUG Celebration
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> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Mid-Hudson Valley Linux Users Group                  http://mhvlug.org
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> 
> Upcoming Meetings (6pm - 8pm)                         MHVLS Auditorium
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-- 
Robert Mark Wallace
60 Delaware Road
Newburgh, NY 12550-3802
Telephone: (845) 566-0586

Please note my new address and update your records

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  Apr 7 - Nagios
  May 5 - Android

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