Sorry, Peter, but this line isn’t even close to the truth… "China(the worst polluter in history)"
It’s wrong in two important ways: 1. Aggregate historical emission — China cannot hold a candle to the US: http://conservationmagazine.org/2013/06/visualizing-carbon/ <http://conservationmagazine.org/2013/06/visualizing-carbon/> Aggregate Carbon Emissions from Fossil Fuel Use 1751-2006 US = 334 Gt Russia/USSR = 113 Gt China = 101 Gt Germany = 81 Gt UK = 73 Gt I’ve included the visualization of this data in this message below, if it doesn’t come through on MOPO visit the link above and scroll down to the bubble graph. 2. Per capita emissions — The average Chinese citizen uses less than 1/3 the carbon that a US citizen uses: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions_per_capita <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions_per_capita> While China has recently overtaken the US in terms of *annual* emissions (which is probably what you were referring to), the two countries are still very close and more importantly China hasn’t been at it nearly as long as the US. The US and other developed economies (Europe/Japan) are almost entirely responsible for BACKLOG of carbon in our atmosphere — even more so after you factor in population. ****I think it is extremely disingenuous to point to China’s or India's inaction as an excuse for our own inaction.**** Basically by burning gigatons of carbon over the last century the US has made huge amounts of money and gotten to the point where we have a massive, robust and fairly stable economy. Now we are trying to say that newly developing countries — who only recently began to use carbon fuel more intensively and typically only because US/Euro companies started putting factories there -- should be held to the same standard that we are otherwise we won’t make ANY changes. Sure, it may be bad for our economy to sign on to carbon emission reductions, but it’s absurd to try to reframe the discussion into some sort of "shared problem" when the US is historically responsible for 1/4 to 1/3rd of it. My $0.02. > On Oct 20, 2014, at 1:19 PM, peter contarino <pcontar...@triad.rr.com> wrote: > > Let me give you some understanding about the Kyoto protocol and the issues > the US had with it Filip. > Under Bill Clinton 1997, the Senate voted 95-0 that it was not in our best > interest to participate in this. This was a unanimous vote by both parties > called the Byrd-Hagel act. The primary concern was that it was not binding > for all nations, most notably China(the worst polluter in history) and India > and would not be in the interest of the US economically(which is one of the > things political leaders are mandated under our Constitution to do). A year > later in typical weasel fashion, Gore signed it but Clinton never submitted > it to the Senate for ratification. This was political theater on Clinton's > part so he could say he supported it and people like yourself, in the future > and ignorant of the facts, would have a tourette seizure whenever this was > brought up. > > Bush later came up with the same conclusion although he did publicly > recognize that GHG were in fact a legitimate issue and signed the > Asia-Pacific Partnership on Clean Development and Climate. This Act is of > course more bullshit theater as there is no enforcing body. > > So basically neither party under either president wanted anything to do with > this. > > Regarding DOHA, there are many countries involved and so many issues such as > agricultural subsidies, trade restrictions, industrial tariffs, and so on > that no one can agree on anything. Obama has said it should be pursued (or > something nebulous) but also said there is not enough on the table for the > U.S. This is another example of kicking the issue down the road. It's such > WTO muddle-headed dreck that it is hard to even get a grasp on what exactly > they expect to accomplish. > > With regards to Tom's other comments, I see them as someone who is > expressing his religious beliefs, perhaps in a proselytizing manner but so > what. Is that a reason to attack him and Christians(or any religious group > for that matter) in such a sweeping, generalized manner? > > -Peter > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MoPo List [mailto:mopo-l@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU] On Behalf Of Tom > Martin > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 8:23 AM > To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU > Subject: Re: [MOPO] Scarey story- not for small children or mentally > disturbed adults.. warning may cause anxiety, > > good points/// i agree Man has screwed everything up.. and your signings > where man made.. until men all change thier hearts and attitudes nothing > will change,, also I agree its true all the disease is here,, and also all > the solutions both medical and climate ect.. again its men that are > deforestation, water and air issues..caused by lack of concern for other men > and women// unless we all unite in a common goal it appears to me its pretty > clear we are about at the end of mankind... > unless you believe some laws and protocal will change 2000 years of mankinds > abuse of the world.. as far as why God would allow it?? he also states that > many will come in his name but be wolves in sheeps clothing... and so thats > why we have many using him as a moneymaking gimmick and taking advantage of > the weak , poor and sick,, again this was all foretold... many say God > should come down Fix everything and destroy those that are evil... Ok.. well > thats about everyone right?? as we all have missed the boat..so the plan as > I undesrstand it was to allow man to get itself together by choice- free > will...as that would be the best way instead of robots or slaves/// Lookk I > am nota preacher , or a messenger or anything.. But I can see it dont look > good and is getting crazier by the day... so I consider that what that Guy > said 2000 years ago was valid and so Im going with that myself.. and asking > that others be helped also but maybe im wrong and maybe in a few years > everything will be ok and the climate will be corrected and no more wars and > the banks will help the poor everyone.and all the worlds people will sing > in harmony....or........its about 5 till 12 and its about the last hour/// > its really up to you as a individual to make that choice and either fix it > or change ways or like me ask God to direct you as I am trying.. the hard > part for me is faith..and belief that hes really there and coming back,,,, > but what other choices do we have...?? > science, government medical and pharma??? we cant even stop illegal > immigrants and pot - which it seems many want anyways..so guess we will all > see what happens..so far its been following what was foretold to the > T...just look and see..however the big picture has a good ending so I just > hope thats true. for everyone > > > On 2014-10-20 01:29, filip de volder wrote: >> how interesting , not so long ago george bush and his fellow demented >> fundamentalist so-called christians refused to sign the kyoto protocol >> because god gave this planet to mankind and so all that's done is gods >> will (besides taking ecological steps would damage the american >> economy right , which is why Doha didn't get signed either ? ) , and >> you want to prey and ask that same so-called god for help ? >> and didn't your almighty god create everything , including ebola ? >> But then as far as your religion goes i'm not an expert as i don't >> have a degree in psychiatry filip >> >>> Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2014 22:01:06 -0400 >>> From: dreamfact...@hollywooddreamfactory.com >>> Subject: Re: [MOPO] Scarey story- not for small children or mentally >> disturbed adults.. warning may cause anxiety, >>> To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU >>> >>> so mopo its almost halloweeen,,, and many of you like Horror right?? >> >>> you buy spooky art posters and all... you like Hitch, King, and all >> the >>> rest... but do you really want to be scared?? if so read this if >> not,,, >>> well move along.. >>> I used to be like you and contemplated everything until I saw that >> it >>> was pretty useless... basically we know nothing... its all hocus >>> pocus... why everyone drinks is on prozac and the like is we cant >> find >>> logical answers,,, unless like me you saw OK God I surrender to ou >> .. do >>> your will... In which a college educated typical person will say..." >> >>> think critcal" and say that there is no climate change and that >>> everything can be controlled by man.......well if like me you see >> thats >>> as nuts as thinking we are able to stop ebola .. read on...If you >> look >>> in the bible revelation it shows exactly teh script what has been >>> happing and clearly states NO man will no when the end is near NO >> ONE.. >>> but we will see the signs like climate and wars and signs and >> disesase >>> and etc... it said the water will become like poisin well ths summer >> >>> InToledo they shut off our water... was it a Gove test for the >> coming >>> senerio? was it real....? who knows but I saw panic over water >> 300,00 >>> peopel fightingoverwater.... what if it was food, medical..?? it >> wont be >>> pretty >>> meanwhile... like a cheap movie script by corman or romerao. we get >>> ebola,,,, now consider this... its geting to the health care workers >> >>> themselves... and can travel fast on stuff like materials and all... >> so >>> consider whats passed around the most..// MONEY? kinda symbolic >> eh... >>> all the terrorists need to do is spread alitlle atround and the >> entire >>> country is toast,,, doe s not take a rocket scientist,,, right now >>> peopel are in denial... as it wont come here its containable.. well >> if >>> you watch the news the rate of transfer is fast as peopel that are >>> exposed to one then expose to manty and if you add intentional >> threats >>> by others,, think a terrorits now doesnt need a bomb.. they can >> simple >>> walk in a city and expose everyone...so see why I think God is the >> only >>> answer as even history showed us that plagues where the toughist,,, >> even >>> in moses time.. in middle ages and now...you cant protect against >> what >>> you cant even see or know is even there... consider the common >> cold.. >>> they have never been able to stop that and Flu and colds are >> viris...so >>> the ebola is like a super viris that can travel on just the medical >>> equipment and gowns... now that out rivals any movie script evere >> and is >>> whats actually hapening now... >>> so what can we do?,,, wellfor my frienda and family and peopel like >> you >>> ILL prya we all find safety. peace and a solution as this is some >>> serious matters ... as I see our air, water, and climate and food >> system >>> is in deep peril..so be carefull as this last part ofthe ride may >> get >>> real bumpy folks.. God bless... Btw way to furthur prove.... I met a >> guy >>> the other day whuo had some projectors .. well his business was also >> >>> disater reaction relief from disasters and he has all the clearance >> on >>> cdc stuff .. he said they are not prepared for anything like ebola// >> so >>> basicall we are on our own.. ive hear rumors that the Gov might >>> quaratine peopel in the FEma cammps who are supected of the >> virus..and >>> that could end up with cival unrest and hence martial Law.... so be >>> prepared as thsoe that have Guns and bug out bags and stuffwill be >> very >>> agressive if the Gov starts doing that.. lets hope calm minds >> prevail... >>> personally I am asking God for help...take care >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com >>> ___________________________________________________________________ >>> How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List >>> >>> Send a message addressed to: lists...@listserv.american.edu In the >>> BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L >>> >>> The author of this message is solely responsible for its content. >> >> ------------------------- >> >> To unsubscribe from the MoPo-L list, click the following link: >> >> https://listserv.american.edu/scripts/wa-american.exe?SUBED1=MoPo-L&A= >> 1 >> [1] >> >> Links: >> ------ >> [1] >> https://listserv.american.edu/scripts/wa-american.exe?SUBED1=MoPo-L&A= >> 1 > > ---- > > Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com > ___________________________________________________________________ > How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List > > Send a message addressed to: lists...@listserv.american.edu > In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L > > The author of this message is solely responsible for its content. > > Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com > ___________________________________________________________________ > How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List > > Send a message addressed to: lists...@listserv.american.edu > In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L > > The author of this message is solely responsible for its content. Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com ___________________________________________________________________ How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List Send a message addressed to: lists...@listserv.american.edu In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
