From: "Miller, Dennis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: MQSeries List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: messages out of order
Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 09:52:07 -0800
Until the dead letter queue fills, in which case, your programmers should
have their resumes ready.
There's an irresistble urge to rely on MQ to deliver messages in sequence.
Many try and get away with it for awhile. However, the restrictions are so
broad that sooner or later one of them will be violated and you will be
chasing your tail trying to figure out what went wrong with an application
that has been working for years. On the other hand, there are several ways
to definitively assure sequential order and they are not difficult. IMHO,
learn to do it right! So, my advice is:
Use message grouping or message identification techniques to
control sequential retrieval.
BTW, can't you defeat your programmers argument by making the local queue
as big as the DLQ?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)
[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:59 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: messages out of order
>
> Funny.
>
> I made another attempt to have the programmers change it to go to a
local
> queue instead of the dead letter queue. The reason they use the dead
letter
> queue is because they use FIFO. If they send it to a local queue and it
> fills, they will not be able to retrieve the messages in order since
some
> would be on the dead letter queue. Therefore, they decided to retrieve
all
> the messages from the dead letter queue.
>
> How is everyone else handling this?
> ----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Broderick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 6:24 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: messages out of order
>
>
> As a funny note. I was viewing this message through HOTMAIL. With ad's
at
> the top browser window. As I was reading it an ad for MIB II came up.
Talk
> about black suites and dark glasses!!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: "Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: MQSeries List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: Re: messages out of order
> >Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:18:44 -0600
> >
> >Tell me about it. They are usually here until 5:00. Have the MQ guys
with
> >the dark suits and glasses drop over.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Robert Broderick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> >Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 1:59 PM
> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: Re: messages out of order
> >
> >
> >Basic rules for MQ-ing. APPLICATIONS DO NOT PUT MESSAGES ON THE
DLQ!!!!!!
> >Or
> >the MQ guys with the dark suits and glasses come around in the middle
of
> >the
> >night and break your fingers!!!
> >
> >BAD Design!!!!
> >
> >
bobbee
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: "Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >Reply-To: MQSeries List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > >Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:41:16 -0600
> > >
> > >We have told apps this for years. The previous administrator thought
> >this
> > >was a good idea and we have had no luck in convincing otherwise.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: mqm mqm [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > >Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 7:27 AM
> > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > >
> > >
> > >Lysette,
> > >
> > >Why are the messages delivered to the DLQ only to be
> > >extracted and delivered to the RT.PRD.ORDFBREC.INB
> > >queue ?
> > >
> > >Seems like an odd use of the DLQ.
> > >
> > >mqm
> > >
> > >
> > >--- "Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)"
> > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Thanks for the information. Our applications
> > > > programmers are of course
> > > > saying this is not true. They insists this is an MQ
> > > > problem so I have been
> > > > looking through the manuals to prove it is not.
> > > > Does anyone have any idea
> > > > where I can find this information?
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Miller, Dennis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 3:51 PM
> > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > For MQ to always deliver messages in the same
> > > > sequence they were sent, one
> > > > of the restrictions is that you not have a DLQ.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)
> > > > [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 12:18 PM
> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > > >
> > > > > Its on the server.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Hill, Dave [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:11 PM
> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Ok. Now the picture is getting more clear. We
> > > > corrected our problem by
> > > > > delaying the application on the receiving end as
> > > > well as setting the
> > > > channel
> > > > > to stay open for a longer time. I am assuming that
> > > > this DLQ is not on a
> > > > > mainframe.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)
> > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:57 PM
> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Our remote queue is the dead letter queue.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Hill, Dave [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 1:19 PM
> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > You could be getting data locks ( resource
> > > > locking ) that is not allowing
> > > > > certain records from being "extracted" in order.
> > > > We had a problem like
> > > > this
> > > > > and it was a timing problem in a database.
> > > > > One question:
> > > > > What is the dead letter queues process?
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)
> > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:07 PM
> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > Subject: Re: messages out of order
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I need to add. The mainframe is running OS/390
> > > > communicating with a
> > > > > Windows 2000 server both running MQSeries 5.2.
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: Anderson, Lizette T. (RyTull)
> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 1:04 PM
> > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > > Subject: messages out of order
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Is it possible for messages to be delivered out
> > > > of order? Please read
> > > > the
> > > > > > following from our application programmer:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We had a problem last night. A couple of our MQ
> > > > message were processed
> > > > > > out of order. The MQ messages are for Score
> > > > Order Entry feedback from
> > > > the
> > > > > > mainframe. The queue name is
> > > > RT.PRD.ORDFBREC.INB. The sequence of
> > > > > > process the messages take to reach the queue
> > > > are:
> > > > > > -The mainframe writes records to an Adabase file
> > > > storing MQ information,
> > > > a
> > > > > > Natural program performs this process.
> > > > > > -The mainframe then reads records from this
> > > > Adabase file and generates
> > > > MQ
> > > > > > messages, a Cobol program performs this process.
> > > > > > -The MQ messages are delivered to the dead
> > > > letter queue.>
> > > > > > -The message are extracted from the dead letter
> > > > queue and delivered to
> > > > the
> > > > > > RT.PRD.ORDFBREC.INB queue.
> > > > > > -A C program process the records from this
> > > > queue.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > From looking at the debug log we know the MQ
> > > > messages were process out
> > > > of
> > > > > > sequence. The only way they could be processed
> > > > out of sequence is if
> > > > they
> > > > > > were added to the RT.PRD.ORDFBREC.INB queue in
> > > > the wrong order. The
> > > > > > mainframe process and records in the Adabase
> > > > file look to be in order.
> > > > > > So, the records should have been added to the
> > > > dead letter queue
> > > > correctly.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
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