Hey Bruce Just a couple of quick points. When I said "first conference" I meant the conference in 2018, so the first of the Oceania conferences, not the real first one! Apologies for the oversight.
And there is a draft code of conduct <https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/oceania-board/2020-November/000046.html> and various <https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/oceania/2020-November/002407.html> conversations <https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/oceania/2020-November/002408.html> around it. Regards, On Tue, 8 Dec 2020 at 15:30, Bruce Bannerman < bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Alex, > > Comments interleaved below: > > Kind regards, > > Bruce > > > > On 8 Dec 2020, at 08:27, Alex Leith <alexgle...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hey Folks > > I volunteered with SSSI for 6 years, including 3 on the Board, so I've > seen this all before. And really, we could do worse than becoming like > SSSI, in that they are an organisation with deep roots that has been around > in different variations for decades. SSSI is mostly run by volunteers, > although there are a number of paid staff too. But most importantly, it's a > group of people doing their best, and it's very easy to criticise the work > of others, and much harder to get inside and actually do the work. I can > look back at my time in SSSI and feel that I did good work. I would have > liked to be more opinionated and to have actually dived in and made some > changes that I didn't, but I've learnt from that, and I have a bunch of > great colleagues, mentors and now, to some extent, mentees in that > community. > > > > SSSI also had its destructive divisions. > > I was a former member of the Australian Institute of Cartographers and the > Australian Institute of Surveyors. > > I applauded the move to bring similar parties together under the banner of > the Spatial Sciences Institute of Australia and became a founding member. > > The SSI was a bright light on the Australian scene for a number of years, > until a small group, believing that they knew better fractured the > community and forced the additional ’S’ in SSI. > > I don’t intend rehashing old issues, but suffice to say that many former > SSI members left the organisation then in disgust, myself included. I have > no idea what SSSI is like now, but do know of a number of people who I > respect are still members. > > The lesson that I learned from that episode is that you need to bring your > community along with you. > > That requires open communications, avoiding as much as possible any > private and hidden discussions. > > I suggest avoiding the emulation of SSSI processes and policies. There is > a significant difference between an open source community and a > professional association. > > > Also remember that they supported us in running our first conference while > expecting us to make a loss! We could do a lot worse than that. Supporting > someone in their innovation, despite expectations of something less than > success is exactly how you empower someone. I'm grateful for SSSI's > institutional knowledge and its community. > > > I’m glad that you remember that! Though I don’t recall any monetary > involvement from SSSI. The financial risk was bourne by the OSGeo > Foundation. > > SSSI was one of the organisations that kindly supported us with > publicising the International FOSS4G-2009. > > Thanks in particular go to Glen Cockerton and David Sinclair. > > > I think it might be worth the new Board calling on someone from Linux > Australia perhaps to talk to the Board about how they survive the politics > and drama over time. But right now I can't imagine what I might ask someone > like that. Because you know what? I think Phil captured it right. > > > We have a new board and members new to open source communities. So be kind > to yourselves. It will take time to bed things down. > > Sorry to repeat myself, but also remember that there are people within our > community who have a wealth of experience working within international open > source communities. Some with nearly two decades experience. > > > This year has been ridiculous, we're volunteers and we need to protect > ourselves from cynicism and burnout. I trust those who I am on the Board > with, without question. It's not a matter of faith, it's respect. Basic > respect. > > > The burnout issue is a significant problem. > > IMHO, this is why OSGeo AustNZ lost momentum and petered out. We had too > few active volunteers, combined with the sustained two year effort to > prepare and run an international conference put a severe strain on things. > We all had day jobs that demanded our attention. > > > I urge members of our OSGeo Oceania community to get involved and > volunteer. You will constantly be surprised at how much you (and your > organisations) get back in return. > > > > On Ed's original question around openness and transparency, I hope > conversations like this help us, but I can't help but think that they might > be harming us. We have work that must be done, a new Board to onboard and > some kind of conference to plan next year and having the same arguments > about what perfection is does not get us any closer to that. > > > Alex, please don’t think of this discussion as a pursuit of perfection. > > In my opinion, this is a timely and necessary discussion about ensuring > that we have solid open source community foundations in place. A critical > part of this is having free, open and respectful discussions to arrive at a > community consensus decision. > > When community members feel valued and listed to, they will want to become > more involved and contribute more. > > > > The OSGeo-OCeania Community may also wish to adopt an appropriate Code of > Conduct to ensure free, open and respectful interactions. > > One such example is the Berlin Code of Conduct: > https://berlincodeofconduct.org/ > > We don’t need to reinvent the wheel. There is a wealth of experience out > there to utilise. > > As per my post yesterday, a good starting point is Karl Fogel’s excellent > book ‘Producing Open Source software’ https://producingoss.com/ > > > > (stepping down off my soapbox...) > > > > > So, like a cockroach, I'll slip back under the fridge, having survived > another pair of boots. > > > > I don’t see that this thread is targeted at any particular person. It is > more about ensuring that we have our basic foundations right. > > So, I apologise if you feel singled out. It is certainly not my intention, > and I have not seen it come up in other discussions on this thread. > > > > > > > Regards, > > Alex > > On Tue, 8 Dec 2020 at 08:07, Bruce Bannerman < > bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Thank you Adam for taking the time to contribute what must have been a >> very difficult response. >> >> I value your thoughts on this. >> >> If Osgeo-Oceania is going to survive as a viable open source community, >> we need to learn from experiences such as yours and John’s. >> >> We cannot afford to turn away and lose such talent from our community. >> >> Our volunteers are our lifeblood. We cannot afford to lose any. >> >> OK, I can see that there is an issue here. >> >> It is important that we understand the root cause of what has caused this >> rift within our community. >> >> Therefore, I urge others to also share their experiences. We can then >> move forward. >> >> It is not easy establishing and nurturing a successful open source >> community. Once it is done effectively, the community will develop a >> momentum of its own. >> >> I can see that we have been very successful at attracting new blood to >> our community. However that has also brought people who are new to open >> source communities and how they need to operate to thrive. >> >> With some effort, we can resolve this current bump in the road. >> >> To the current and former OSGeo Oceania Directors. Thank you for >> volunteering your skills and time to lead our community. You have not had >> an easy task, and it is easy for those who have not been in a similar >> position to criticise. >> >> As a community, we can turn this situation around. We have a lot of >> experience to call on, particularly those with extensive international open >> source experience. >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Bruce >> >> >> > On 8 Dec 2020, at 02:02, Adam Steer <adam.d.st...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > Hey Ed >> > >> > Thanks for initiating this discussion. My story is long and boring and >> > yes, the fundamental reason for resigning is that I literally could >> > not interact with the board anymore - because of ethical concerns, >> > because it just felt like a drain on my time and energy, because I >> > really felt like I had wasted so much time being forced into circular >> > discussions and projects (eg communications, which is still a giant >> > and growing tangle) - so I leave this discussion and the incoming >> > board with some suggestions: >> > >> > - always remember the community does not need OSGeo Oceania, but OSGeo >> > Oceania needs the community. >> > - always give people space to speak for themselves, especially in >> > board meetings. >> > - always respect peoples' efforts and experience and input, and do it >> > consistently for everyone >> > - as John indicated, operating transparently is easy and fruitful. The >> > tools are there use them >> > - as you indicated, always propose a solution when a problem is raised >> > - remember we have a broad, caring, thoughtful, enthusiastic and >> > deeply experienced community to draw on >> > - remember we have existing patterns for open and transparent >> > operation to draw on (OSGeo in particular, the book Bruce mentioned, >> > other long established chapters of OSGeo and OSM, orgs like Linux >> > Australia), and ready collaborators for taking on projects like >> > building open conference systems >> > - remember to care about ethics, particularly around how we handle >> > personal data we are trusted with and who we hand it to. Take the time >> > to learn about how companies we use (eg Mailchimp) operate instead of >> > just glossing over data issues for convenience. >> > - value transparency over bells and whistles in communication. >> > Remember http has also been around a while but we don't call it the >> > cockroach of the internet - and even fancy mailers use ancient mail >> > transfer protocols ;). Mailing lists persist because they are >> > incredibly functional and useful. >> > - avoid becoming another SSSI. >> > >> > Congratulations on being elected to the board, I hope the organisation >> > remembers its roots in this coming year. I am unlikely to spend much >> > OSGeo Oceania time for a while - however feel free to reach out about >> > any wrinkles you find that have my name attached. I've made as much >> > mess as anyone, and haven't been particularly great at handing over >> > things >> > >> > Best, >> > Adam >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Oceania mailing list >> > Oceania@lists.osgeo.org >> > https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >> _______________________________________________ >> Oceania mailing list >> Oceania@lists.osgeo.org >> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >> > > > -- > Alex Leith > m: 0419189050 > > -- Alex Leith m: 0419189050
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