Agree!! Stefan Sauermann
Program Director Biomedical Engineering Sciences (Master) University of Applied Sciences Technikum Wien Hoechstaedtplatz 5, 1200 Vienna, Austria P: +43 1 333 40 77 - 988 M: +43 664 6192555 E: stefan.sauermann at technikum-wien.at I: www.technikum-wien.at/mbe I: www.technikum-wien.at/ibmt I: www.healthy-interoperability.at Am 25.06.2012 10:24, schrieb Ian McNicoll: > Hi Sam, > > I actually did think Stefan was making an important point about > clinical modelling. If I have understood Stefan's comments correctly , > he is stating that in his experience interoperability is rarely > possible without local negotiation, compromise and detailed > understanding of the use case and shared requirements. That would also > be my view, which is why I believe that while good definition and > ontological analysis is helpful, it will never be possible to 'clean > room' interoperability without directly involving the end-use > stakeholders: Interoperability is ultimately negotiated not designed. > > The value of the archetype approach is in making this negotiation > progressively possible without asking end-users to become embroiled in > complex technical discussions. Complex and detailed clinical > discussions will still be required but that is only to be expected. > > Ian > > > > > > On 24 June 2012 22:43, Sam Heard<sam.heard at oceaninformatics.com> wrote: >> Thanks Stefan >> This is a highly technical discussion and should not be on this list. >> Cheers, Sam >> >> >> On 22/06/2012 5:28 PM, Stefan Sauermann wrote: >> >> Hello eveybody! >> Looking at this discussion, the volume it is taking weighted against the >> visible progress I ask myself if this is an efficient way to reach >> harmonised conclusions. >> >> In our experience doing the national EHR standards and the lab report for >> Austria we noticed: >> - Once you reach a sufficient level of detail it is not possible to reach >> generic (one fits all) solutions within available timeframes. >> - Data models and their descriptions only started to work after all involved >> had agreed on a specific, crisp and clear definition of the usecase. >> - No information model / description did work for all thinkable usecases. >> - We had to tailor information models to specific usecases. >> - Then bridging from one use case into the other becomes a challenge, as >> subtle differences in the information will become an issue. >> - In order to bridge information from one specific use case into the other >> we typically need to define another specific usecase. >> >> I do not see the specific usecases you are referring to. I therefore can not >> contribute to or understand this discussion. Maybe I missed something. >> Sorry! >> >> Greetings from Vienna, >> >> Stefan Sauermann >> >> Program Director >> Biomedical Engineering Sciences (Master) >> >> University of Applied Sciences Technikum Wien >> Hoechstaedtplatz 5, 1200 Vienna, Austria >> P: +43 1 333 40 77 - 988 >> M: +43 664 6192555 >> E: stefan.sauermann at technikum-wien.at >> >> I: www.technikum-wien.at/mbe >> I: www.technikum-wien.at/ibmt >> I: www.healthy-interoperability.at >> >> >> Am 22.06.2012 09:29, schrieb Gerard Freriks: >> >> Yes. >> >> It all is about classifying. >> It is all about proper definitions we all share and use. >> >> I believe that when we all interpret the definitions in our own way in our >> own data bases all is working nicely. >> >> The moment we start to exchange this data we will discover that we are not >> interoperable, >> The moment we start to re-use data in clinical decision support service we >> will discover that all systems that worked so nicely, have become problems >> to connect. >> >> As EN13606 we work at full semantic interoperability as much as possible. >> So we have to define many things, we use to produce archetypes, properly. >> Don't we all have an obligation to make semantic interoperability possible? >> >> >> Gerard Freriks >> +31 620347088 >> gfrer at luna.nl >> >> >> >> >> On 22 Jun 2012, at 02:45, Jussara wrote: >> >> Think the background of our discussions is about CLASSfying. >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> openEHR-clinical mailing list >> openEHR-clinical at lists.openehr.org >> http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> openEHR-clinical mailing list >> openEHR-clinical at lists.openehr.org >> http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> openEHR-clinical mailing list >> openEHR-clinical at lists.openehr.org >> http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org > >
