> We've got some statistics which show downloaders seem to prefer
let's see the numbers.
> DVD images over CD at about a 2:1 ratio - but we don't know if those
> downloading CD images could use DVD images instead.
The data you have in hand clearly says that you have a pile of people
that do actually download the CDROM images. This is the same as the large
pile of people out there running Solaris 8. I don't think we can simply
shut the door on them without fair warning. Well, some warning at least.
> The internal discussion thus has been based mostly on our assumptions
> about who the community members are and what hardware they have, but
> no one has yet asked the community.
I have a whack of gear here. Old stuff. Newer stuff. Weird stuff.
> Would you have a problem with DVD-only images for SX:CE?
yes and no ... let me explain
People hate change and they hate being pushed forwards when they bloody
well know that they need to just stop using the floppy drive. Or the
old QIC tape drive. Or the old 3Com 10 Mbit network hub or heck even
Token Ring or some other damn piece of history. I like my old Sparc gear
but I don't know why. Because it still works?
We do need to just issue a DVD image and move forwards.
> Do you have systems you use for OpenSolaris that don't have DVD drives
yes
in fact, no DVD or CDROM at all sometimes.
Sometimes CDROM only.
> and that you can't netinstall from another system or Live Upgrade
> from a mounted image?
thats a whole other kettle of fish.
sometimes the easy thing to do is to just boot from a CDROM and then
feed them one at a time. Sometimes I will feed in the first one only
and then use NFS to fetch the rest. I often use a CD-RW media because
I can just blank it and then repeat the process with the next release.
I have a drawer here .. full of older versions on CDROM. Its shameful
really because I am just making landfill.
This may be one of those things whose day has come and we just have to
stop the CDROM images and thus force people ( me also ) to use a DVD
or netboot situation. I don't use a floppy anymore. The CDROM has done
its job and its only a matter of time before we stop this DVD situation
also and switch to pure internet based boot services.
Oh, one last thing that bugs me. This really irks me but it is also
my own damn fault probably. I dunno. Here it is. I have a few boxes
that I term as "production" grade. That means they are Solaris 10 based
on either Update 2 or Update 3. They are well patched and even the Studio
11 patches and stuff not in the Recommended patch cluster are applied. I
buy support contracts for these machines and they work. Perfectly.
If I want to burn a DVD ISO image on this machine ( the one I am using
right now to type this email ) then I use cdrecord. I don't use cdrw
and that may be my own fault but cdrecord is just way better in my
opinion. However the cdrecord that ships with Solaris 10 does not burn
DVDs. Here is the situation :
# uname -a
SunOS titan 5.10 Generic_125101-01 i86pc i386 i86pc
# cat /etc/release
Solaris 10 6/06 s10x_u2wos_09a X86
Copyright 2006 Sun Microsystems, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Use is subject to license terms.
Assembled 09 June 2006
# pkginfo -l SUNWmkcd
PKGINST: SUNWmkcd
NAME: CD creation utilities
CATEGORY: system
ARCH: i386
VERSION: 11.10.0,REV=2005.01.08.01.09
BASEDIR: /
VENDOR: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
DESC: CD creation utilities 2.01
PSTAMP: sfw10-x20050108014014
INSTDATE: Sep 14 2006 15:02
HOTLINE: Please contact your local service provider
STATUS: completely installed
FILES: 6 installed pathnames
2 shared pathnames
2 directories
4 executables
2176 blocks used (approx)
# /bin/cdrecord -v -scanbus
Cdrecord-Clone 2.01 (i386-pc-solaris2.10) Copyright (C) 1995-2004 Jörg
Schilling
TOC Type: 1 = CD-ROM
Warning: Using USCSI interface.
Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'.
SCSI buffer size: 57344
scsibus0:
0,0,0 0) 'SONY ' 'DVD RW DRU-820A ' '1.0b' Removable CD-ROM
0,1,0 1) 'PIONEER ' 'DVD-RW DVR-107D' '1.21' Removable CD-ROM
0,2,0 2) *
0,3,0 3) *
0,4,0 4) *
0,5,0 5) *
0,6,0 6) *
0,7,0 7) *
scsibus1:
1,0,0 100) 'SEAGATE ' 'ST39173W ' '6244' Disk
1,1,0 101) *
1,2,0 102) *
1,3,0 103) *
1,4,0 104) *
1,5,0 105) *
1,6,0 106) *
1,7,0 107) *
scsibus3:
3,0,0 300) 'SEAGATE ' 'ST39102LW ' '8320' Disk
3,1,0 301) *
3,2,0 302) *
3,3,0 303) *
3,4,0 304) *
3,5,0 305) *
3,6,0 306) *
3,7,0 307) *
scsibus4:
4,0,0 400) *
4,1,0 401) 'SEAGATE ' 'ST336704LSUN36G ' '032C' Disk
4,2,0 402) *
4,3,0 403) *
4,4,0 404) *
4,5,0 405) *
4,6,0 406) *
4,7,0 407) *
The two Seagate 9GB disks are mirrored and on separate internal SCSI
controllers. Then I have 2 other SCSI controllers of which you can see
that I have an external Sun 36GB disk ( target 1 ) connected to one
of them. Funny thing .. I don't see my Sun DLT8000. Its on some other
controller. In any case ... what happens when I try to look at a DVD
from my production system? Forget burning .. just inspect the DVD :
# /bin/cdrecord -v -dev=0,0,0 -atip
Cdrecord-Clone 2.01 (i386-pc-solaris2.10) Copyright (C) 1995-2004 Jörg
Schilling
TOC Type: 1 = CD-ROM
scsidev: '0,0,0'
scsibus: 0 target: 0 lun: 0
Warning: Using USCSI interface.
Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'.
SCSI buffer size: 57344
atapi: 1
Device type : Removable CD-ROM
Version : 0
Response Format: 2
Capabilities :
Vendor_info : 'SONY '
Identifikation : 'DVD RW DRU-820A '
Revision : '1.0b'
Device seems to be: Generic mmc2 DVD-R/DVD-RW.
Current: 0x0011
Profile: 0x002B
Profile: 0x001B
Profile: 0x001A
Profile: 0x0016
Profile: 0x0015
Profile: 0x0014
Profile: 0x0013
Profile: 0x0012
Profile: 0x0011 (current)
Profile: 0x0010
Profile: 0x000A
Profile: 0x0009
Profile: 0x0008
Profile: 0x0002
/bin/cdrecord: Found DVD media but DVD-R/DVD-RW support code is missing.
/bin/cdrecord: If you need DVD-R/DVD-RW support, ask the Author for
cdrecord-ProDVD.
/bin/cdrecord: Free test versions and free keys for personal use are at
ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/ProDVD/
/bin/cdrecord: This version of cdrecord does not include DVD-R/DVD-RW
support code.
/bin/cdrecord: If you need DVD-R/DVD-RW support, ask the Author for
cdrecord-ProDVD.
/bin/cdrecord: Free test versions and free keys for personal use are at
ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/ProDVD/
Using generic SCSI-3/mmc CD/DVD driver (checks media) (mmc_cd_dvd).
Driver flags : MMC-3 SWABAUDIO BURNFREE
Supported modes: TAO PACKET SAO SAO/R96P SAO/R96R
Drive buf size : 1179648 = 1152 KB
Current Secsize: 2048
There is a README at ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/ProDVD/README that
says :
This directory includes binary versions of cdrecord-ProDVD
for various platforms
NOTE: the DVD-recording drivers have been added to the OpenSource
part on May 15th 2006 with cdrtools-2.01.01a09.
See ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha/
There is no longer a need for a key.
Thats nice .. but .. I actually have a key for the real thing from years ago
and it works fine with cdrecord BUT not the cdrecord in real production
grade and supported Solaris 10.
I have my own builds of cdrecord that will do anything and everything
thankfully :
# /root/schily/bin/cdrecord -v -dev=0,0,0 -atip
Cdrecord-ProDVD-Clone 2.01.01a11 (i386-pc-solaris2.11) Copyright (C)
1995-2006 Jörg Schilling
TOC Type: 1 = CD-ROM
scsidev: '0,0,0'
scsibus: 0 target: 0 lun: 0
Warning: Using USCSI interface.
Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'.
SCSI buffer size: 57344
atapi: 1
Device type : Removable CD-ROM
Version : 0
Response Format: 2
Capabilities :
Vendor_info : 'SONY '
Identifikation : 'DVD RW DRU-820A '
Revision : '1.0b'
Device seems to be: Generic mmc2 DVD-R/DVD-RW.
Current: DVD+R/DL
Profile: DVD+R/DL (current)
Profile: DVD+R
Profile: DVD+RW
Profile: DVD-R/DL layer jump recording
Profile: DVD-R/DL sequential recording
Profile: DVD-RW sequential overwrite
Profile: DVD-RW restricted overwrite
Profile: DVD-RAM
Profile: DVD-R sequential recording
Profile: DVD-ROM
Profile: CD-RW
Profile: CD-R
Profile: CD-ROM
Profile: Removable Disk
Using generic SCSI-3/mmc-3 DVD+R driver (mmc_dvdplusr).
Driver flags : DVD MMC-3 SWABAUDIO BURNFREE
Supported modes: PACKET SAO
Drive buf size : 1179648 = 1152 KB
Current Secsize: 2048
book type: illegal book type, Version 1 (14.1)
disc size: 120mm (0)
minimum rate: Not specified (15)
number of layers:1
track path: Opposite Track Path (1)
layer type: Rewritable Area (2)
linear density: 0.293 µm/bit (1)
track density: 0.74 µm/track (0)
phys start: 196608
phys end: 16580607
end layer 0: 2283519
bca: 0
phys size:... 16384000
Category/Version E1
Disk size 0F
Disk structure 32
Recoding density 10
Manufacturer: 'MKM'
Media type: '001'
Product revision 0
ADIP numbytes 64
Reference speed 37
Max speed 37
#
There you can see that cdrecord from sometime last year ( I can not recall
when .. a while ago ) recognizes the 8.5 GB dual layer DVD+R DL media just
fine. The version in production Solaris 10 can not. In fact, the cdrecord
provided in SUNWmkcd can not burn a DVD at all.
So maybe we should provide CDROM images until such time as any user with
Solaris 10 can be assured they will burn ? [1]
Dennis
[1] I really do have to test cdrw but .. why bother.
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