++, exactly my thoughts. I believe most people don't vote 0 for questions about the change because 'it won't count'. That's really bad, IMHO 0 should be for asking things not clear in the patch, whereas a -1 should be a 'this code here is not right'.
I believe the 0s should be tracked somehow. Regards 2016-04-10 18:08 GMT+02:00 Joshua Harlow <harlo...@fastmail.com>: > +1 from me also, > > I also use +0 for question asking and the like, because IMHO that's not > what -1 are for. As for myself losing stackalytics stats when *I* do this > (ie using +0 instead of -1), meh, I got better things in my life to > think/care about :-P > > -Josh > > > Nikhil Komawar wrote: > >> Thanks Amrith! >> >> I am a big supporter on including +0s. >> >> On 4/9/16 6:31 PM, Amrith Kumar wrote: >> >>> Thanks to Dims and Steve for bringing this up. >>> >>> It has long been my opinion that +0's are invaluable for the >>> question asking, and for getting to understand software, and unfortunately >>> +0's are lost in the noise. So a while ago, I posted to the ML [1] asking >>> about making +0's more visible. I signed up to submit a request on gerrit >>> upstream (and promptly forgot to do that). This mail thread has reminded me >>> of that. I have now posted a request for the upstream gerrit folks to fix >>> [2]. >>> >>> I believe that people don't use +0's enough because they often >>> get ignored. I know that one can be cynical and say it is because it gives >>> one no credit in stackalytics; I choose not to be that person. >>> >>> I post +0's a lot. But, I find that they are often ignored. If >>> you agree with me that +0's are useful, and could be highlighted better in >>> the gerrit review screen, please post a comment on [2]. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> -amrith >>> >>> [1] http://openstack.markmail.org/thread/nj4onttaibjmfxew >>> [2] https://code.google.com/p/gerrit/issues/detail?id=4050 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Matt Riedemann [mailto:mrie...@linux.vnet.ibm.com] >>>> Sent: Saturday, April 09, 2016 9:43 AM >>>> To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org >>>> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [all][stackalytics] Gaming the Stackalytics >>>> stats >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 4/8/2016 5:54 PM, Jay Faulkner wrote: >>>> >>>>> I know a lot of folks explicitly avoid a +0 vote with a comment >>>>> because you don't get "credit" for it in statistics. Whether or not >>>>> that should matter is another discussion, but there is a significant >>>>> disincentive to no-voting right now. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> - >>>>> >>>>> Jay Faulkner >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> -- >>>>> *From:* Dolph Mathews<dolph.math...@gmail.com> >>>>> *Sent:* Friday, April 8, 2016 1:54 PM >>>>> *To:* OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [openstack-dev] [all][stackalytics] Gaming the >>>>> Stackalytics stats >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, April 8, 2016, John Dickinson<m...@not.mn >>>>> <mailto:m...@not.mn>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 8 Apr 2016, at 13:35, Jeremy Stanley wrote: >>>>> >>>>> > On 2016-04-08 19:42:18 +0200 (+0200), Dmitry Tantsur wrote: >>>>> >> There are many ways to game a simple +1 counter, such as >>>>> +1'ing >>>>> changes >>>>> >> that already have at least 1x +2, or which already approved, >>>>> or >>>>> which need >>>>> >> rechecking... >>>>> > [...] >>>>> > >>>>> > The behavior which baffles me, and also seems to be on the >>>>> rise >>>>> > lately, is random +1 votes on changes whose commit messages >>>>> >>>> and/or >>>> >>>>> > status clearly indicate they should not merged and do not >>>>> need to >>>>> >>>> be >>>> >>>>> > reviewed. I suppose that's another an easy way to avoid the >>>>> >>>> dreaded >>>> >>>>> > "disagreements" counter? >>>>> > -- >>>>> > Jeremy Stanley >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I have been told that some OpenStack on boarding teaches new >>>>> members >>>>> of the community to do reviews. And they say, effectively, "muddle >>>>> through as you can. You won't understand it all at first, but do >>>>> your best. When you're done, add a +1 and move to the next one" >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I advocate for basically this, but instead of a +1, leave a +0 and ask >>>>> questions. The new reviewer will inevitably learn something and the >>>>> author will benefit by explaining their change (teaching is the best >>>>> way to learn). >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I've been working to correct this when I've seen it, but +1 >>>>> reviews >>>>> with no comments might not be people trying to game. It might >>>>> simply >>>>> be people trying to get involved that don't know any better yet. >>>>> >>>>> --John >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________________________________________________ >>>>> ____ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >>>>> Unsubscribe: >>>>> openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe >>>>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev >>>>> >>>>> There is also disincentive in +1ing a change that you don't understand >>>> and >>>> is wrong and then a core comes along and -1s it (you get dinged for the >>>> disagreement). And there is disincentive in -1ing a change for the wrong >>>> reasons (silly nits or asking questions for understanding). I ask a lot >>>> of >>>> questions in a lot of changes and I don't vote on those because it would >>>> be inappropriate. >>>> >>>> I also notice when "newcomers" are asking good questions for >>>> understanding >>>> and not voting on them, it shows me they are trying to learn and are >>>> getting invested in the project, not just trying to pad stats. Those are >>>> the people we look to mentor into bigger roles in the project team, be >>>> that working on subteams or eventually looking at for the core reviewer >>>> team. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Matt Riedemann >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> __________________________________________________________________________ >>>> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >>>> Unsubscribe: >>>> openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe >>>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev >>>> >>> >>> __________________________________________________________________________ >>> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >>> Unsubscribe: >>> openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe >>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev >>> >> >> > __________________________________________________________________________ > OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe > http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev >
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