Thanks, Harrison. I probably feel the same way about rational analysis as you do about golf -- may be fun for some, but definitely NOT my cup of tea! :-)
Judith-Kate, good to reconnect! Applied Improvisation and Liberating Structures -- good stuff! all best wishes, Rosa *Rosa Zubizarreta* *Diapraxis: Facilitating Creative Collaborationhttp://www.diapraxis.com <http://www.diapraxis.com/>* On Sun, Aug 3, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Harrison Owen <hho...@verizon.net> wrote: > Rosa said – “Of course we work too hard, Harrison. Yet we have a *lot* of > fun doing it! :-)” Rosa, God forbid that I become a Kill-Joy! Fun is fun > and I am all or it. It is also true that what’s fun for some is perceived > differently by others. Golf, for example is the funnest thing in the world > for millions. Personally, I have never been able to generate much > enthusiasm for whacking a small white ball, but there you go. > > > > But I think the conversation here may need to go to some other levels – > starting with the question, “Why do we do what we do?” Certainly I would > hope that we enjoy what we are doing. I certainly do. But my personal > enjoyment (fun) would not be my primary reason for my efforts. I would > hope, as I am sure you do too, that my efforts would yield some good. At > the very least that they would do no harm. And further that these efforts > might accomplish their task in the safest and most effective manner. > > > > Some years ago I found myself in deep conversation with a precocious 10 > year old. We were solving most of the problems of the world, as only a 10 > year old can – when she paused, looked me in the eye, and asked, “What do > you do?” I tried to explain to the best of my ability how I endeavored to > help organizations, and the people who constituted them to be more healthy, > productive, and useful. She listened patiently... and then said, “Oh I > see. You are a doctor for organizations.” Truthfully, I’d never quite > thought of it that way, but if it worked for her, it worked for me. > > > > Putting aside whatever difficulties I may have with the so called “medical > model of consulting,” which are several ... in this case I think the > analogue may be apt. The job of the physician is to enable people to “get > their life back.” In pursuit of this goal, they use (or should use) the > safest, simplest, most effective means, and once the objective has been > achieved, they leave. To use methods of treatment that are known to be less > effective than alternatives, is at the very least sloppy medicine, and at > worst fraud. > > > > Applying the same template to our situation can be instructive, I think. > Speaking just for myself, I will say that if I knew of any other approach > to the enhancement of organizational life (getting their life back) other > that Open Space, I would be the first to use it. Frankly, I don’t know of > any, and I have looked hard, but nothing can approach the ease of use, > economy of effort, or effective result to be found in Open Space. That is a > pretty blank statement, and it may well be true that there is “something” > out there – which would just wonderful. But I have yet to see it. > > > > Over the years I have worked with groups large and small who have been > treated to the very best practices of the times. They have been Quality > Circled, Process Engineered, Sig Sevened, and still life as they wanted it > remained beyond their grasp. Then, perhaps by desperation, they found > themselves in Open Space – and as one AT&T executive mumbled – Magic! I > don’t think it was magic at all. It is simply what happens when people > accept the invitation to be fully what they are. Seems to work every time. > > > > Did it last? In most cases, No. And the reason, as I see it is quite > simple. Having experienced a burst of life, they made the choice (actively > or passively) to return to the same conditions that got them in trouble in > the first place. They simply forgot the old dictum that if you do more and > more of what you’ve always done – you will definitely get more of the same. > Yes it is true that some of these organization thought to “capture the Open > Space experience.” This usually meant creating the Open Space Model of > Organization, replete with all the appropriate rules, positions, policies, > and procedures. And guess what, after a time, short or long, they found > themselves right back where they started. Maybe even worse because they > were now burned twice. > > > > Organizing a self organizing system is not only an oxymoron it simply > doesn’t work. But more importantly, there is no reason to try. The emergent > system is already there, operating at a level of complex interaction that > totally boggles the human mind, even very bright, well trained minds. Under > the circumstances, rational analysis is always interesting, and may even be > fun (I always thought so), but I think a better place to start is with some > deeply appreciate non-knowing. With that as a starting point I do believe > that the way will emerge. It always has. > > > > Harrison > > > > Winter Address > > 7808 River Falls Drive > > Potomac, MD 20854 > > 301-365-2093 > > > > Summer Address > > 189 Beaucaire Ave. > > Camden, ME 04843 > > 207-763-3261 > > > > Websites > > www.openspaceworld.com <http://%20www.openspaceworld.com> > > www.ho-image.com > > OSLIST To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives > of OSLIST Go to: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > > > > *From:* OSList [mailto:oslist-boun...@lists.openspacetech.org > <oslist-boun...@lists.openspacetech.org>] *On Behalf Of *Rosa Zubizarreta > *Sent:* Saturday, August 02, 2014 4:34 PM > > *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list > *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Management and Organization > > > > Bhav, you wrote "...I think OST doesn't work for the way Dave Snowden > wants to approach complexity, however that is different to the question of > whether it is a method that does work in complex space." > > > > I agree that in many complex situations, OST can be a great way to draw > out and make room for people's natural creativity and motivation. and that > little else may be needed. > > > > In other complex situations, I've seen OST work well with other methods > that are also well-suited for complexity. For example, at the Surfing > Democracy conference in Batschuns, Austria, our hosting team offered the > option of having Dynamic Facilitation for those OS sessions that wanted to > make use of that method. It worked quite well -- the only difference being > that participants who offered DF OS sessions usually booked a double time > slot, to allow for the greater in-depth exploration that we do in DF. (Of > course we work too hard, Harrison. Yet we have a *lot* of fun doing it! > :-) > > > > with all best wishes, > > > > Rosa > > > > > > *Rosa Zubizarreta* > > > *Diapraxis: Facilitating Creative Collaborationhttp://www.diapraxis.com > <http://www.diapraxis.com/>* > > > > *Celebrating my new book, "From Conflict to Creative Collaboration: A > user's guide to Dynamic Facilitation" > <http://www.amazon.com/Conflict-Creative-Collaboration-Dynamic-Facilitation/dp/1626526117/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1394491921&sr=1-1&keywords=from+conflict+to+creative+collaboration>* > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Chris Corrigan <chris.corri...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > What a fantastic post. It has summed up much if my own thinking about > Dave's dismissal of Open Space. > > > > My take on this is that I have used Open Space to address complexity > within the constraints if the cynefin framework and it works well. I have > seen OST help with conflict and create innovation. I have never seen a > silver bullet that says that "if we do this everything will be perfect". So > we have to be sensitive to things like power and resources and such. > > > > I don't know what evidence dave makes his assumptions upon but it's > entirely possible he has been around poor facilitation for a lot of his > career. > > > > And then what else is valuable about his analysis is that it causes me to > look at my own practice and see where I have been guilty of some of the > things he says. It's useful to have a critical view. > > > > I've known about Dave's dismissal of these ways of working for a long time > and he's known about my championing of these ways of working. It hasn't > stopped us having conversations online about our work and it hasn't > prevented me from using his tools. > > > > Chris > > -- > > CHRIS CORRIGAN > > Harvest Moon Consultants > > Facilitation, Open Space Technology and process design > > > > Check www.chriscorrigan.com for upcoming workshops, blog posts and free > resources. > > > > > > > On Aug 1, 2014, at 11:02 PM, Harold Shinsato <har...@shinsato.com> wrote: > > Chris - thank you again for the mention of the Cynefin framework. I very > much enjoyed your youtube presentation about the framework to the Art of > Hosting Community at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRn3BM56W74. It was > well worth the 55 minutes. I especially enjoyed your questions and answers > section. > > After I listened, YouTube presented a related video of a keynote by David > Snowden to a Lean, Agile & Scrum conference in Europe. His talk is titled > "Making Sense of Complexity". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6RfqmTZejU > > I found his talk brilliant. I enjoyed the insights, but also the > challenges. David called himself a "Constructive Irritant" or a curmudgeon. > I'm not sure I'd recommend the talk to everyone in this group - but there > is one piece that was particularly confrontational and important. I > carefully transcribed it for you here. David Snowden makes these remarks > while showing a slide of a dragon towering over two Knights, and one Knight > says "Oh No! A big, evil, DRAGON!". The other says "Quick! Somebody hold a > meeting". Here is what David says (it is at 49:05 in the talk): > > "This sort of hold a meeting mentality, or worse still, I mean if there > was an Agile version of this, it would be 'Quick let's hold an Open Space', > because we can all have a nice time and nobody will be challenged. Just to > make a controversial statement: Open Space is the enemy of innovation > because it enforces consensus. There are actually larger group techniques > certainly which we and others have developed which actually increase > conflict because if you don't increase conflict you don't get diversity and > you don't get proper testing. So the Law of Two Feet is the *enemy* of > innovation because it allows people to avoid confrontation where they need > to do confrontation. Right, it doesn't mean it doesn't have value, but it's > a contextual method." > > This statement from David actually interfered with my sleep. I made me > question for a couple hours my deep emotional investment in OST. As > mentioned earlier, I saw and still see Cynefin as a way to help promote the > use of OST. Earlier in David's talk, when he described how to work in the > complex space, his recommendations sounded a lot like an OST event. But > quote I offer from him was clearly hostile to OST. My first reaction to his > "irritant" statement was that OST does *not* enforce consensus. But other > parts of his statement raise interesting questions. Is there value in > setting up large group processes that don't allow people to avoid > confrontation? Can OST prevent needed conflict? > > My take on Open Space as a method is that it has been traversing the chasm > on the innovation cycle between Early Adopter phase, and Early Majority. I > had expected Agile to help push Open Space over to Early Majority. It > sounds like OST may already be in the Early Majority phase in the Agile > community based on David Snowden's missive against it. I've also predicted > that OST will start facing open and active hostility as it starts to break > into Early Majority. David Snowden may be some evidence this is happening. > > I'm quite curious how others receive this statement against OST from David > Snowden. > > Harrison, I quite enjoy what you've written, and I think there's something > in OST that most consultants and organizational development experts are > going to miss simply because the fundamental assumptions of their > traditions go 180 degrees in the opposite direction of Open Space, wave > riding, and the ancient mystery we might now call our self-organizing > universe. For me, I don't think there is any end to the digging, because > there is no way a "theory of everything" will ever be able to capture it > all. And still, there are some of us that have not yet tired of digging. > But my aim in the digging into game theory, Agile, Cynefin, brain science, > Tavistock and group relations, sociology, psychology, etc. etc. is not "how > to deal with massive complexity ... by ... making models, and gathering > data." The joy in the digging is not to try to get to the bottom of it. > There is no bottom. There will never be a theory of everything. But making > maps, as long as we understand their fundamental limits, is a wonderful > thing. As long as we don't confuse them with the territory. > > Harold > > > On 7/31/14 12:59 PM, Harrison Owen wrote: > > Good thinking Peggy, and having spent no small amount of time, paper, and > ink exploring the world of emergence or self organization – I can > definitely appreciate the effort. Helping people to develop an awareness of > the flow of the enterprise is definite plus. Having said that, I find > myself needing to issue a caveat. Producing a model, even a very good > model, of the flow of self organization as it relates to complexity, is not > to suggest that we can fully understand the process, even less that we > could predict or control it. My experience has been that the more I know, > in the sense of actual experience and perception, the less I understand. > Perhaps it is the advance of senility, but I find my rational capacity > totally overwhelmed and over-awed by the magnificent mystery of our > evolving cosmos. This is not simply the majesty of infinite space/time – > but equally the fantastic complexity, diversity and connectedness of the > smallest creatures. The Hummingbirds, for example who feed at my window. > The Paramecium (single celled protozoa that swim in my lake). A single snow > flake. > > > > Some might take my statement as the despairing cry of an old man. The “old > man” part is dead on... but there is no despair. Just the opposite, in > fact. It feels just wonderful! I am reminded of conversations over the > years with various “Systems Thinking” friends. Bright people all, with > enthusiasm unbounded. They were certain that if they thought hard enough, > collected data long enough – for sure they could design the perfect system, > or at least understand the one of which they were a part (their business, > etc.). They sensed victory just over the hill, and I surely wished them > well. For myself, inspired by their effort, I tried to do the same. But for > me, the harder I tried, the worse it got. In fact it became an infinite > regression into ultimate complexity. One could call it an exercise in > despair. But that is not how it felt... Liberation was more to the point > with the realization that you just couldn’t get there from here...Wonderful! > > > > But how to deal with massive complexity in real life situations if not by > thinking about it, making models, and gathering data? It is not that > thought, models and data were somehow evil or useless, but in terms of my > quest, they only led down a rabbit hole out of which I could not come. And > the harder I tried, the deeper I sunk... It felt just wonderful to just > stop digging! But the complexity of life remained. > > > > Somewhere along the line an odd curiosity captured my attention. As our > marvelous natural experiment in self organization (AKA OST) proceeded, it > dawned on me that contrary to all of my preconceived notions, multiple > groups of people of all sorts and conditions from every part of the world > seemingly engaged their complex, self organizing world in an effective and > productive fashion without benefit of prior instruction, models of whatever > sort, intense facilitation (handholding)... In a word it appeared to be a > natural act. Even more counter intuitive (counter to my intuition and > expectations) was the fact that in those (relatively few) situations in > which either I or some colleague had endeavored to “prepare” the > participants with conceptual models, exercises of various sorts, or > explanation of the process (other than the normal OS invitation to sit in > circle) there was no visible sign of improved performance, so far as I > could see, and in fact there was some indication of a decline. Now, almost > 30 years into the experiment I also have to say that my most difficult > groups, without exception, were those composed of The Professionals. Those > people who made it their business to THINK about all the details > (facilitators, systems theorists, etc.). Eventually even these folks “got > with the program” and everything happened just as it usually does in Open > Space. But the shift occurred, as I saw it, only when they stopped thinking > about it. > > > > I think there may be a lesson here. Engaging complexity is not primarily a > rational act. Even though complexity is a basic existential concern for all > of us, right up there with Death – the resolution to our dilemma will not > be found through rational enterprise (thinking about it). A major > frustration for us all! But the good news is that we do not have to travel > that route. Indeed we really don’t have to travel at all. We’re already > there! > > > > Proof is a slippery word, but I think it fair to say that the 30 year > Natural Experiment of Open Space has rendered a verdict almost as good. > Highly Probable. Given our experience of 1000’s of groups effectively > dealing with complex, conflicted, inflammable issues prepared only by a > 10-15 minute invitation/introduction...It is highly probable that the > essential skills and mechanisms were already present within the group prior > to their arrival at the circle. In short they were “already there.” No need > to think about it. Just Do it! > > > > Once done, it is then time for rational reflection. In truth our innate > capacity for dealing with complexity, once awakened, flows so seamlessly > that most people hardly notice. At the end of every Open Space in my > experience the people evidenced some real sense of joy, satisfaction, > completion... and little appreciation of how it all happened. It just was. > That is all they know, and all they care to know. That status may be more > than sufficient in the moment, but it is also true that rational reflection > in all its forms (model building, data collection, etc) can enhance the > appreciation, and deepen the experience. > > > > As one who has spent a lifetime doing all that “rational activity” from > model building to data collection (well, story collection J), I can truly > appreciate and applaud the effort. Useful undertaking, I think. BUT none of > that can hold a candle to the profound sense of wonder and awe that I > experience in the silence of my not-knowing. That is truly wonderful. > > > > > > Harrison > > > > > > > > > > > > Winter Address > > 7808 River Falls Drive > > Potomac, MD 20854 > > 301-365-2093 > > > > Summer Address > > 189 Beaucaire Ave. > > Camden, ME 04843 > > 207-763-3261 > > > > Websites > > www.openspaceworld.com <http://%20www.openspaceworld.com> > > www.ho-image.com > > OSLIST To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives > of OSLIST Go to: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list > To post send emails to OSList@lists.openspacetech.org > To unsubscribe send an email to oslist-le...@lists.openspacetech.org > To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > > > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list > To post send emails to OSList@lists.openspacetech.org > To unsubscribe send an email to oslist-le...@lists.openspacetech.org > To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list > To post send emails to OSList@lists.openspacetech.org > To unsubscribe send an email to oslist-le...@lists.openspacetech.org > To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > >
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