Hello Frank, You have an interesting approach, but I think the clou of your story is to think that pain is equivalent to hurt. Giving a mother an epidural can hurt her more than help her cope with pain of normal labour Pain in labour is fysiological and when a women can cope with the pain, it will not hurt her. The pain helps her to know her time is there to make a nest and to call the people around her that will support her. Then the way she copes with the labourpain tells her in what stage she is and also wich movements she has to make to help the baby out. Giving birth is hard labour and hard labour in any way is not without pain. Indeed pain tells you something and the woman has to be able to listen to those signals without someone telling her what to do. Believe me, women know how to give birth and fysiological pain doesn't hurt, but I can't deny that you feel it :-)))
Lieve On 07-12-2002 12:39, "Frank Jockel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear All, > > The most important right that a birthing mother has.... is to give birth > GENTLY, EASILY and without PAIN. > > What really upsets me, is that most women expect pain, and what you expect, > is what you get. And yes, I know I'm oversimplifying, however, pain is a > warning that something is wrong and there is nothing wrong with giving birth > so if there is pain, then that means there is something wrong elsewhere. > That elsewhere is how women have been programmed to think, by society, > friends, well meaning Physio's or midwives etc, that there will be pain and > discomfort. > > Pain IS NOT the natural inheritance of women. > > ( He got off his soapbox for a moment to catch his breath) > > Women's bodies are designed to give birth. Read Dr Grantley Dick-Read, > Childbirth Without Pain. > > I understand the calming effects of being in a hot tub etc, and all > comforting factors are appreciated and understood against my sorrow that the > wonderful woman is giving birth in pain and discomfort. > > And for my part, I still believe that as a matter of Physics, a baby has > bouyancy. Gravity is a myth, the Earth sucks, however. > > For a wonderful discussion on no pain births, ask Peter Jackson, Midwife, > Bowral - HypnoBirth'er. ...He loves water births ;-) > > You have a right and an obligation to ask ME to think, and that's right. I > in turn, ask you to think...what's wrong with Labour? Why does it have to > HURT? > > Frank > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Date: Saturday, December 07, 2002 21:29:04 > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] birthing in dam water > > > > Dear Frank - I endorse the comments of Mary, Jan, Sally etc. I'm assuming > > you've had extensive experience with water births to come to this > > enlightened opinion. I've never seen a newborn baby so filled with air that > > it is like a ball underwater... in fact, in my text book they have no air > > at all until they reach the surface and breath (so gently and beautifully). > > Finally, a woman belongs where she wants to be -- if that happens to be a > > birthing chair, fine, but NO ONE has the right to say YOU BELONG HERE OR > > THERE while birthing. Have you heard of woman centred care?? Thank God for > > caring thinking midwives like Pete (hug, and pat on the back from Lois). > > Have a think about it Frank. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Frank Jockel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2002 1:10 PM > > Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] birthing in dam water > > > > > > Hi, > > I just have to give my two bob's worth regarding water births... I think > > water births are the STUPIDEST idea since the Irish decided to land on the > > sun at night. > > What happens when you push a ball under water? Its bouyancy makes it pop UP > > A baby has bouancy too. So unless the mother is willing to wear a snorkel > > and mask and be upside down, pointing her perineum at the surface, the baby > > is fighting bouancy and the uterus is fighting bouancy... stupid. > > Get out of the water and onto a birthing chair where you belong and let > > Gravity do the work > > Water for fish.. > > Regards, > > > > Frank Jockel > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Date: Saturday, 07 December 2002 03:41:26 PM > > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > > Subject: [ozmidwifery] birthing in dam water > > > > Could people tell me of their experiences with birthing in dam water, we > > really don't have enough rainwater on site to use, this dam water is used > > for general washing etc it runs through the solar hotwater service but is > > quite turbid, yours in midwifery pete malavisi > > > > -- > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > > .. > > -- > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > > > > > > -- > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > > . > -- > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe.
