Dear Jeff, lists - I am sorry you sense dark shades ... But most of what I say in the NP book does not depend upon these speculations - which were prompted by somebody, I forgot who, inquiring into the notoriously murkuy waters of the beginnings of life and semiotics. What I am thinking of - speaking of chemical cycles - are ideas like those of Stuart Kauffman and Terrence Deacon. Generalizing from metabolism Kauffman argues that autokatalytic cycles in an environment of organic compounds may form the first stage of agency. I am not sure these ideas depend upon elementary issues like conservation principles or atomic numbers in anything but a trivial sense. In intellectual history I think the idea that cyclic, self-sustaining processes may play a special role in biology goes at least back to Kant (in the latter half of the 3rd Critique). But I am not sure I understand why the repetition of such ideas makes you agitated …
Best F Den 18/09/2014 kl. 07.07 skrev Jerry LR Chandler <jerry_lr_chand...@me.com<mailto:jerry_lr_chand...@me.com>> : Frederik, List: On Sep 17, 2014, at 4:08 PM, Frederik Stjernfelt wrote: 1) simple metabolism, self-sustaining chemaical cycles - whose self-sustainment implies they are prone to adapt to searching for the compounds they need to continue the cycle, Huh? I am unaware of any such "cycles". Once again, I find your assertions about the foundations of chemical logic to be a philosophical perspective that is not consistent with the empirical logic of biochemical facts. Perhaps you could search for a touch of realism that might provide a foundation for this assertion? Philosophically, one could start CSP's arguments wrt to mode of being (as in the Lady Welby letter) with the metaphysical notions of identity and relation. Secondly, you may wish to consider the physical conservation laws. Thirdly, you may wish to attempt to relate such assertions to the conceptualization of atomic numbers. IMHO, this assertion casts' a dark shadow on your central thesis of "Natural Propositions". Cheers jerry
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