Doah! My error John. Please forgive me. Walt
Walt Sommers Gettysburg Antique Phonographs 2594 Old Route 30 Orrtanna, PA 17353 walt at victrolaguy.com 717-334-0862 -----Original Message----- From: phono-l-bounces at oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org] On Behalf Of john robles Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 6:02 PM To: Antique Phonograph List Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Victor IX Hi I didn't mean to imply that the prices you quoted were iffy, that was inappropriate verbage on my part, I apologize. I meant that I personally was unclear on the price concept because I generally buy a machine for resale (cheapskate), but if I see something that I have really been searching for for myself (collector) I have sometimes paid stupid money for it. So your statement that the market determines price (even if we don't want to believe it) is absolutely correct and we are seeing it in this particular instance. Walt <waltsommers at comcast.net> wrote: There is nothing iffy about the values I showed John. I only sell antique phonographs and provide [mostly] service for the same. When I am in "collector mode" and practicing cheapskatism I am prone to pout when I can't get things like Victor 0's for $120 every time just because it happened a few times. When in "collector mode" I don't want to remember that the market itself is what dictates the price, but it does. I know of no general antique shop that offers an antique phonograph worthy of the often enormous price tag they paste to them. To see a price tag of $600 on a VV-IX in one of the antique malls usually means that the "dealers" have browsed the internet and seized on information like this very message giving no thought to the context. Regarding claims of rarity or commonality, to a person who has seen very few of a thing they will call it rare, and to someone else who sees them every day like I do they are common. There are very few sellers on eBay who genuinely care about the rarity of phonographs and to expect them all to actually study production levels just to make a few dollars on a phonograph that some dead guy used to own just ain't gonna happen. Walt -----Original Message----- From: phono-l-bounces at oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org] On Behalf Of john robles Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 4:12 PM To: Antique Phonograph List Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Victor IX I myself am iffy on the price question. If you are selling them for $550-$650 out of your shop (which I assume is an antique shop) those sales are probably to the average public who browse in antique shops and who are not knowledgeable as to the commonality of those machines, I think the valuation of $300 is specific to machines sold between collectors. While it is true that $550-$650 may be a fair price, that machine IS common and collectors usually want to buy something with a margin that they can resell it for someday, so the average collector is looking for a lower price than retail. And some of us are just cheap. :-) Walt wrote: I don't know that there is much actual experience behind statements like "it is a $300.00 machine at best" or saying that the buyer in this particular case is "an example of those not knowledgeable." The description given by the particular seller of the example noted seems quite nondescript. It doesn't say (or show) much at all. The few flowery words that are used simply disconnect the reader from the object that they are supposed to be reading about. Top notch original VV-IXs that have been carefully detailed and serviced will routinely sell for $550 to $650 right out of my shop. That is based on about 20 or so sales over the past 5 years. I have more people wanting them at that price than I can find machines for right now. (I have sold refinished pieces that are like factory new whose values are substantially higher, but I withhold those values because they actually skew the overall expectation of value in the market and do not rightly qualify as true originals as accurate and beautiful as they are.) When accurate pictures and relevant text are used to describe something and help teach people about the item they are buying through the use of specific details and views that can be used as a means of inspection, I would say that the description is valuable (as it should be). But no "description is everything". When responsible, intelligent people actually come into the possession of an item they purchased they should be able to say that they have what they were hoping to receive and the only thing that makes it better is that they can now touch and hear their Victrola. I am not referring to the unintelligent crass and impulsive people that come along who spend as little as possible and buy what they think they saw. I am to those who through careful evaluation of information make an intelligent and responsible decision who really understand what they mean when they say, "thank you". Walt -----Original Message----- From: phono-l-bounces at oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org] On Behalf Of Kuglarb at wmconnect.com Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2008 11:46 AM To: phono-l at oldcrank.org Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Victor IX I agree John, description is everything. Another example of those not knowledgeable about phonographs making a 'I gotta have it' purchase. This is a $300.00 machine at best. Brantley Williston, S.C. _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.5.6/1574 - Release Date: 7/25/2008 4:27 PM _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.5.6/1575 - Release Date: 7/26/2008 4:18 PM _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.oldcrank.org No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.5.6/1575 - Release Date: 7/26/2008 4:18 PM
