Here I laid out exactly how your premise is flawed, item by item:
On Monday, September 1, 2014 10:15:36 AM UTC-4, KeithInTampa wrote: > > This whole thread was the same identical subject matter that we discuss > today, four years later. This was my point last night: > > > > On Friday, October 29, 2010 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, KeithInTampa wrote: >> >> "We The People, Of the United States Of America" is pretty self >> explanatory..... >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Oct 29, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Jonathan Ashley < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> While the word "citizen" appears quite often in the Constitution for >>> the United States >>> , it is never clearly defined. >>> >>> If a person chose to move here from France in 1791, why would he not >>> have been part of "We the People"? >>> >>> >>> On 10/29/2010 10:53 AM, Keith In Tampa wrote: >>> >>> That is one convoluted, and I might add, WRONG interpretation >>> Michael. "The People" mean the Citizens of the United States. Not >>> illegals, not, "The People of France", etc., etc., etc....Numerous case law >>> citations on this very premise, again, I'll come back to it maybe tonight. >>> >>> Keith >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 29, 2010 at 1:41 PM, MJ <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Article III deals with the JUDICIARY. >>>> >>>> There you go again with that silliness about 'illegals'. >>>> Citizens relate (re: US Constitution) SPECIFICALLY as denoted. >>>> >>>> Items like -- for example -- Amendment IV (for simplicity) >>>> >>>> The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, >>>> papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, >>>> shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon >>>> probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly >>>> describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to >>>> be seized. >>>> >>>> restrict the GOVERNMENT from action against PEOPLE -- regardless of >>>> whether they are Citizens, Visitors, have the Government's >>>> unconstitutional >>>> permission, etc. It plainly LIMITS the Feds from doing as stated. >>>> >>>> Naturalization (or naturalisation), of course, is the acquisition of >>>> citizenship and nationality by somebody who was not a citizen or >>>> national of that country when he or she was born. >>>> Naturalization has NOTHING to do with entering/exiting. >>>> >>>> There was no claim that Citizens were something else. >>>> >>>> Regard$, >>>> --MJ >>>> >>>> I was about to say that I'd hate to live in a country >>>> where the law could mean whatever its rulers said >>>> it meant, when it occurred to me that I already do. >>>> -- Joseph Sobran >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> At 01:28 PM 10/29/2010, you wrote: >>>> >>>> Art. III referenced the Constitution and treaties, but was changed by >>>> the XI amendment. Citizens do not refer to illegals that roam onto U.S. >>>> soil and do not become naturalized. >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "MJ" <[email protected]> >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 1:14:13 PM >>>> Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans >>>> >>>> >>>> This is becoming silly. Have you actually READ the Constitution? >>>> >>>> Occurrences of 'Citizen' >>>> >>>> In Article III (describing JURISDICTION for the supreme Court): >>>> >>>> between a State and Citizens of another State; -- between Citizens >>>> of different States; -- between Citizens of the same State claiming >>>> Lands >>>> under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the >>>> Citizens >>>> thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects. >>>> >>>> In Article IV (ensuring reciprocity between States): >>>> >>>> The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges >>>> and Immunities of Citizens in the several States. >>>> >>>> Amendment XI (more jurisdiction): >>>> >>>> The Judicial power of the United States shall not be construed to >>>> extend to >>>> any suit in law or equity, commenced or prosecuted against one of the >>>> United >>>> States by Citizens of another State, or by Citizens or Subjects of >>>> any >>>> Foreign State. >>>> >>>> Dubiously Ratified Amendment XIV (aiding Lincoln's illusion): >>>> >>>> All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and >>>> subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United >>>> States and >>>> of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any >>>> law >>>> which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the >>>> United >>>> States; >>>> >>>> Amendment XV (preventing voting disqualification by group): >>>> >>>> The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be >>>> denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of >>>> race, color, or previous condition of servitude. >>>> >>>> Amendment XIX (preventing voting disqualification by group)" >>>> >>>> The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be >>>> denied or >>>> abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex. >>>> >>>> Amendment XIV (preventing voting disqualification by group): >>>> >>>> The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any >>>> primary or other election for President or Vice President, for >>>> electors for >>>> President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in >>>> Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any >>>> State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax. >>>> >>>> Amendment XXVI (preventing voting disqualification by group): >>>> >>>> The right of citizens of the United States, who are eighteen >>>> years of age or older, to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the >>>> United States or by any State on account of age. >>>> >>>> >>>> The Constitution, of course, CREATED and LIMITS the Government it >>>> created. >>>> >>>> >>>> STILL do not know what the Bible has to do with anything. >>>> >>>> Regard$, >>>> --MJ >>>> >>>> The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal >>>> government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State >>>> governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised >>>> principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign >>>> commerce; with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, >>>> be >>>> connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all >>>> the >>>> objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, >>>> liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, >>>> improvement, and prosperity of the State. -- James Madison, Federalist >>>> Papers >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> At 12:53 PM 10/29/2010, you wrote: >>>> Look at Romans 1:26-27. Also the Constitution and the amendments >>>> refer to citizens. Citizens are all persons born or naturalized in the >>>> U.S. and subject to the jurisdiction therein. Clearly it does not apply to >>>> illegals. >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "MJ" <[email protected]> >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 12:01:43 PM >>>> Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans >>>> >>>> >>>> THIS does not answer the request. >>>> Someone will need to explain this silliness about 'legal' and 'illegal' >>>> immigrants. The US Constitution provides no power whatsoever for the Feds >>>> to extend or withhold permission for entry (or exit) into any of the >>>> Sovereign States. Besides, 'migration' is a natural right. >>>> Additionally, rights are inherent in Man's being -- not permissions >>>> as you imply. >>>> Not certain WHAT the Bible may have to do with anything. >>>> >>>> As an aside, do you have any problem/difficulty with the THEFT and >>>> SLAVERY promoted by both the Ds and Rs? >>>> >>>> Regard$, >>>> --MJ >>>> >>>> "Under the law of nature, all men are born free, every one comes into >>>> the world with a right to his own person, which includes the liberty of >>>> moving and using it at his own will. This is what is called personal >>>> liberty, and is given him by the Author of nature, because necessary for >>>> his own sustenance." --Thomas Jefferson >>>> >>>> >>>> At 11:42 AM 10/29/2010, you wrote: What rights do immigrants have >>>> unless they are legal? In reference to the Bible have you read the verses >>>> on homosexuality? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "MJ" <[email protected]> To: >>>> [email protected] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 >>>> 11:24:30 AM Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning >>>> Republicans >>>> >>>> Can you POINT me to a 'platform' or similar that suggests such? Thanks >>>> in advance. >>>> Regard$, --MJ >>>> "Any man can make mistakes, but only an idiot persists in his error. " >>>> -- Marcus Tullius Cicero >>>> >>>> >>>> At 09:18 AM 10/29/2010, you wrote: >But it seems obvious that the >>>> biggest reason to vote Democrat is to >take one good look at the >>>> crazies in the Grand Opressive Tea Party and >what they will do to >>>> oppresss LGBT people, as well as a whole slew of >demographic minority >>>> groups, including immigrants, Latinos, >African-Americans and women >>>> who have been raped or victims of incest. >If you don't vote for the >>>> Democrats, you are opening the door for >bigoted hateful theocrats >>>> like the Fred Phelps Wesboro "Church" who >totally ignore Jesus' >>>> actual message of love, acceptance and inclusion >and fail to know >>>> what their Bible really says. >The Republican Agenda is anti-American. >>>> Their number one priority is >to obstruct and make The President of >>>> The United States fail. Welcome >to the Recorporate Party of Greed. > >>>> -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For >>>> options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> * It's active and moderated. >>>> Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and >>>> more. >>>> -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For >>>> options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * >>>> Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> * It's active and moderated. Register >>>> and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>> Your personal email. Anytime, anywhere. >>> Ridiculously affordable at $19.95. No contracts. >>> http://www.getpeek.com/lavabit.html >>> >>> >>> -- >>> *Your remedy is in the courts - learn civil litigation with >>> Jurisdictionary® <http://www.jurisdictionary.com/?refercode=CG0004>* >>> >>> *I Refuse To Comply With The Unconstitutional Demands Of The Federal >>> Government* >>> http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *Government is a disease masquerading as its own cure. Government is >>> only as strong as those who allow themselves to be governed are weak. "The >>> 'art' of politics is diverting attention from what's really happening. What >>> separates politicians from other criminal organizations is superior public >>> relations."- Marc Stevens "If a nation expects to be ignorant and free it >>> expects something that cannot be."- Thomas Jefferson* >>> >>> -- >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>> <http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>> >> >> -- -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "PoliticalForum" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
