As stated in a number of threads, for years, I do in fact support Israel; Israel's right to exist and Israel's right to defend itself. I am critical of a number of political positions that Israel holds, as is my right. I am more critical of American politicians who would put Israel's interests ahead of American interests.....Nothing new here Plain Ol'.....I've said this repeatedly.
On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:36 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> wrote: > Christians who reside in Israel, or on the West Bank, or in Gaza, are > treated as second class citizens. Israel restricts these Christians' use > of any infrastructure, to include the roadways, the sewer systems of > publicly owned treatment works, the libraries, etc. > --- > yet you support them. > I'd call that subservience at it's finest!!! > > On Thursday, October 9, 2014 1:31:32 PM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >> >> Because if idiots like John Hagee and other "Mega Church" ministers, and >> also the likes of former Governor Mike Huckabee, (who other than this one >> issue, I have the utmost respect and admiration for!) >> >> The term "Christian Zionist" has been prostituted and like the term "Gay >> Marriage", redefined. >> >> Just as important, folks like the Good Minister Hagee, as well as >> Governor Huckabee, Newt Gingrich, and others are obviously not well >> informed about "some" of Israel's policies.... >> >> I have a very good "online" friend, who is a writer for a number of >> Christian blogs, as well as for BarbWire, The Daily Beast and other >> publications. She is very knowledgeable on the Bible, as well as Plain Ol >> is, and well versed on Biblical passages. >> >> What this woman (who I reference), folks like Mike Huckabee, Newt >> Gingrich, and John Hagee and even Political Forum's own, "The Annointed >> One": Mark Kahle don't know, is that Christians who reside in Israel, or >> on the West Bank, or in Gaza, are treated as second class citizens. >> Israel restricts these Christians' use of any infrastructure, to include >> the roadways, the sewer systems of publicly owned treatment works, the >> libraries, etc. >> >> American media does not report on this discrimination; as European media >> does.....It's Israel's dirty little secret, and no one wants to talk about >> it! >> >> If Christians in America, and I think most politicians in America knew of >> this atrocity, you would see Israel change it's policies very quickly, or >> support for the Jewish Nation-State dry up immediately. >> >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:13 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> wrong again ... >> >> At least one in four American Christians surveyed recently by >> Christianity Today magazine said that they believe it is their biblical >> responsibility to support the nation of Israel. This view is known as >> Christian Zionism. The Pew Research Center put the figure at 63 per cent >> among white evangelicals. Christian Zionism is pervasive within mainline >> American evangelical, charismatic and independent denominations including >> the Assemblies of God, Pentecostals and Southern Baptists, as well as many >> of the independent mega-churches. It is less prevalent within the historic >> denominations, which show a greater respect for the work of the United >> Nations, support for human rights, the rule of international law and >> empathy with the Palestinians. >> >> The origins of the movement can be traced to the early 19th century when >> a group of eccentric British Christian leaders began to lobby for Jewish >> restoration to Palestine as a necessary precondition for the return of >> Christ. The movement gained traction from the middle of the 19th century >> when Palestine became strategic to British, French and German colonial >> interests in the Middle East. Proto-Christian Zionism therefore preceded >> Jewish Zionism by more than 50 years. Some of Theodore Herzl’s strongest >> advocates were Christian clergy. >> >> Christian Zionism as a modern theological and political movement embraces >> the most extreme ideological positions of Zionism. It has become deeply >> detrimental to a just peace between Palestine and Israel. It propagates a >> worldview in which the Christian message is reduced to an ideology of >> empire, colonialism and militarism. In its extreme form, it places an >> emphasis on apocalyptic events leading to the end of history rather than >> living Christ’s love and justice today. >> >> Followers of Christian Zionism are convinced that the founding of the >> State of Israel in 1948 and the capture of Jerusalem in 1967 were the >> miraculous fulfillment of God’s promises made to Abraham that he would >> establish Israel as a Jewish nation forever in Palestine. >> >> Tim LaHaye’s infamous Left Behind novels, together with other End Times >> speculations written by authors such as Hal Lindsey, John Hagee and Pat >> Robertson, have sold well over 100 million copies. These are supplemented >> by children’s books, videos and event violent computer games. >> >> Burgeoning Christian Zionist organizations such as the International >> Christian Embassy (ICEJ), Christian Friends of Israel (CFI) and Christians >> United for Israel (CUFI) wield considerable influence on Capitol Hill, >> claiming a support base in excess of 50 million true believers. This means >> there are now at least ten times as many Christian Zionists as Jewish >> Zionists. And their European cousins are no less active in the Zionist >> Hasbarafia, lobbying for Israel, attacking its critics and thwarting the >> peace process. The United States and Israel are often portrayed as Siamese >> twins, joined at the heart, sharing common historic, religious and >> political values. >> >> Pastor John Hagee is one of the leaders of the Christian Zionist >> movement. He is the Founder and Senior Pastor of Cornerstone Church, a >> 19,000-member evangelical church in San Antonio, Texas. His weekly >> programmes are broadcast on 160 TV stations, 50 radio stations and eight >> networks into an estimated 99 million homes in 200 countries. In 2006 he >> founded Christians United for Israel admitting, >> >> “For 25 almost 26 years now, I have been pounding the evangelical >> community over television. The Bible is a very pro-Israel book. If a >> Christian admits ‘I believe the Bible,’ I can make him a pro-Israel >> supporter or they will have to denounce their faith. So I have the >> Christians over a barrel, you might say.” >> >> In March 2007, Hagee spoke at the American Israel Public Affairs >> Committee (AIPAC) Policy Conference. He began by saying: >> >> “The sleeping giant of Christian Zionism has awakened. There are 50 >> million Christians standing up and applauding the State of Israel…” >> >> As the Jerusalem Post pointed out, his speech did not lack clarity. He >> went on to warn: >> >> “It is 1938. Iran is Germany, and Ahmadinejad is the new Hitler. We must >> stop Iran’s nuclear threat and stand boldly with Israel, the only democracy >> in the Middle East… Think of our potential future together: 50 million >> evangelicals joining in common cause with 5 million Jewish people in >> America on behalf of Israel is a match made in heaven.” >> >> Christian Zionists have shown varying degrees of enthusiasm for >> implementing six basic political convictions that arise from their >> ultra-literal and fundamentalist theology: >> >> 1. >> >> The belief that the Jews remain God’s chosen people leads Christian >> Zionists to seek to bless Israel in material ways. However, this also >> invariably results in the uncritical endorsement of and justification for >> Israel’s racist and apartheid policies, in the media, among politicians >> and >> through solidarity tours to Israel. >> 2. >> >> As God’s chosen people, the final restoration of the Jews to Israel >> is therefore actively encouraged, funded and facilitated through >> partnerships with the Jewish Agency. >> 3. >> >> Eretz Israel, as delineated in scripture, from the Nile to the >> Euphrates, belongs exclusively to the Jewish people, therefore the land >> must be annexed, Palestinians driven from their homes and the illegal >> Jewish settlements expanded and consolidated. >> 4. >> >> Jerusalem is regarded as the eternal and exclusive capital of the >> Jews, and cannot be shared with the Palestinians. Therefore, >> strategically, >> Christian Zionists have lobbied the US Administration to relocate its >> embassy to Jerusalem and thereby ensure that Jerusalem is recognised as >> the >> capital of Israel. >> 5. >> >> Christian Zionists offer varying degrees of support for organisations >> such as the Jewish Temple Mount Faithful who are committed to destroying >> the Dome of the Rock and rebuilding the Jewish Temple on the Haram >> Al-Sharif (Noble sanctuary of Al-Aqsa). >> 6. >> >> Christian Zionists invariably have a pessimistic view of the future, >> convinced that there will be an apocalyptic war of Armageddon in the >> imminent future. They are deeply sceptical of the possibility of a lasting >> peace between Jews and Arabs and therefore oppose the peace process. >> Indeed, to advocate an Israeli compromise of “land for peace” with the >> Palestinians is seen as a rejection of God’s promises to Israel and >> therefore to support her enemies. >> >> Within the Christian Zionist worldview, Palestinians are regarded as >> alien residents in Israel. Many Christian Zionists are reluctant even to >> acknowledge Palestinians exist as a distinct people, claiming that they >> emigrated to Israel from surrounding Arab nations for economic reasons >> after Israel had become prosperous. A fear and deep-seated hatred of Islam >> also pervades their dualistic Manichean theology. Christian Zionists have >> little or no interest in the existence of indigenous Arab Christians >> despite their continuity with the early church. >> >> In 2006, I drafted what became known as the Jerusalem Declaration on >> Christian Zionism signed by four of the Heads of Churches in Jerusalem: His >> Beatitude Patriarch Michel Sabbah, Latin Patriarch, Jerusalem; Archbishop >> Swerios Malki Mourad, Syrian Orthodox Patriarchate, Jerusalem; Bishop Riah >> Abu El-Assal, Episcopal Church of Jerusalem and the Middle East; and Bishop >> Munib Younan, Evangelical Lutheran Church in Jordan and the Holy Land. In >> it they insisted: >> >> “We categorically reject Christian Zionist doctrines as a false teaching >> that corrupts the biblical message of love, justice and reconciliation. >> >> We further reject the contemporary alliance of Christian Zionist leaders >> and organisations with elements in the governments of Israel and the United >> States that are presently imposing their unilateral pre-emptive borders and >> domination over Palestine. This inevitably leads to unending cycles of >> violence that undermine the security of all peoples of the Middle East and >> the rest of world. >> >> We reject the teachings of Christian Zionism that facilitate and support >> these policies as they advance racial exclusivity and perpetual war rather >> than the gospel of universal love, redemption and reconciliation taught by >> Jesus Christ. Rather than condemn the world to the doom of Armageddon we >> call upon everyone to liberate themselves from ideologies of militarism and >> occupation. Instead, let them pursue the healing of the nations! >> >> We call upon Christians in Churches on every continent to pray for the >> Palestinian and Israeli people, both of whom are suffering as victims of >> occupation and militarism. These discriminative actions are turning >> Palestine into impoverished ghettos surrounded by exclusive Israeli >> settlements. The establishment of the illegal settlements and the >> construction of the Separation Wall on confiscated Palestinian land >> undermines the viability of a Palestinian state and peace and security in >> the entire region.” >> >> * The patriarchs concluded:* >> >> “God demands that justice be done. No enduring peace, security or >> reconciliation is possible without the foundation of justice. The demands >> of justice will not disappear. The struggle for justice must be pursued >> diligently and persistently but non-violently.” The prophet Micah asks, >> “What does the Lord require of you, to act justly, to love mercy and to >> walk humbly with your God.” (Micah 6:8). >> >> It is my contention after more than 10 years of postgraduate research >> that Christian Zionism is the largest, most controversial and most >> destructive lobby within Christianity. It bears primary responsibility for >> perpetuating tensions in the Middle East, justifying Israel’s apartheid >> colonialist agenda and for undermining the peace process between Israel and >> the Palestinians. >> >> The closing chapter of the New Testament takes us back to the imagery of >> the Garden of Eden and the removal of the curse arising from the Fall: >> “Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as >> crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb… On each side of >> the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding >> its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of >> the nations.” (Revelation 22:1-2) Surely this is what Jesus had in mind >> when he instructed his followers to act as Ambassadors of peace and >> reconciliation, to work and pray that God’s kingdom would come on earth as >> it is in heaven. >> >> * The Revd Dr Stephen Sizer** is the Vicar of Christ Church in Virginia >> Water and the author of Christian Zionism: Road-map to Armageddon? >> <http://www.amazon.co.uk/Christian-Zionism-Armageddon-Stephen-Sizer/dp/1844740501/> >> (InterVarsity Press, 2004); Zion’s Christian Soldiers? >> <http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zions-Christian-Soldiers-Israel-Church/dp/1844742148/> >> (2007) and In the Footsteps of Jesus and the Apostles >> <http://www.amazon.co.uk/Footsteps-Jesus-Apostles-Stephen-Sizer/dp/0863475833/> >> (Eagle, 2004). For more information see www.stephensizer.com >> <http://www.stephensizer.com/>* >> >> >> On Thursday, October 9, 2014 12:24:42 PM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >> >> All Christians are "Zionist Xians" to you Plain Ol'......Your "Bark" has >> no credibility.... >> >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 1:20 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> I don't know much about Larry Gatlin, >> --- >> I do. >> >> (I find it hard to believe that he is Jewish) >> --- >> he's a zionist xian. >> >> .....Nugent? >> --- >> a great guitar player but a hateful islamaphobe. >> >> I agree with most everything uttered from his mug! I have heard his >> commentary about Vietnam, and he and I can agree to disagree there. >> --- >> It's difficult to decide which is more obnoxious: his support for the >> murderous regime in Israel; his hatred of Muslims; or his utter hypocrisy - >> a flag-waving chicken-hawk who dodged the draft. What a joke! >> >> You just hate anything that is Pro-American or anyone who would suggest >> traditional American values. >> --- >> wrong again, subservient zionist xian. >> your idea of pro-American is attacking, destroying and rebuilding shit >> holes in the middle east for resources and israel. >> and your idea of traditional American values come from archaic judaic law. >> maybe you would be happier living in israel. >> >> >> On Thursday, October 9, 2014 11:45:13 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >> >> I don't know much about Larry Gatlin, (I find it hard to believe that he >> is Jewish).....Nugent? I agree with most everything uttered from his mug! >> I have heard his commentary about Vietnam, and he and I can agree to >> disagree there. >> >> You just hate anything that is Pro-American or anyone who would suggest >> traditional American values. >> >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 12:36 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> And is that supposed to be some type of negative connotation? >> --- >> you're quick! >> >> I assume that liberals like you don't like Ted Nugent, >> -- >> I like Ted ok ... until he opens his hateful mouth. >> On dodging the Vietnam War draft >> >> Nugent told the Detroit Free Press in 1990 that he meticulously planned >> to get out of the war. He stopped bathing 30 days before going before the >> draft board and later ate nothing but junk food and Pepsi. A few days >> before his appointment, Nugent started defecating in his pants. It >> obviously worked — and it's a good thing, because "if I would have gone >> over there, I’d have been killed, or I’d have killed all the Hippies in the >> foxholes. I would have killed everybody." >> On politics >> >> Nugent's recent comments about Obama weren't the first time he blasted >> the president. He said basically the same thing in 2007, except he had a >> machine gun as a visual aid. >> >> "I think that Barack Hussein Obama should be put in jail. It is clear >> that Barack Hussein Obama is a communist. Mao Tse Tung lives and his name >> is Barack Hussein Obama. This country should be ashamed. I wanna throw up," >> he said, adding "Obama, he’s a piece of s**t. I told him to suck on my >> machine gun." >> >> Apparently the *Detroit Free Press* is Nugent's go-to outlet for hate >> speech. In this 1990 interview, The Nuge said that all people aren't the >> same. >> >> "My being there (South Africa) isn’t going to affect any political >> structure. Besides, apartheid isn’t that cut-and-dry. All men are not >> created equal." >> On women >> >> Nugent is well known for his "type" of women, namely women who might not >> be 18. His "muse" Pele Massa was 17 when they got together — he had to take >> legal custody of her from her parents in order to date. However, that >> relationship — like most of Nugent's relationships — ended because of his >> love for "alternative flesh management," or as we call it, cheating. >> >> "What’s a feminist anyways? A fat pig who doesn’t get it often enough?" >> On minorities and non-Americans >> >> He still has a rabid following around the world, whether he likes it or >> not. Apparently, he doesn't share the love. >> >> "…Yeah they love me (in Japan) — they’re still assholes. These people >> they don’t know what life is. I don’t have a following, they need me; they >> don’t like me they need me… Foreigners are a******s; foreigners are scum; >> I don’t like ‘em; I don’t want ‘em in this country; I don’t want ‘em >> selling me doughnuts; I don’t want ‘em pumping my gas; I don’t want ‘em >> downwind of my life-OK? So anyhow, and I’m dead serious…" >> >> Also, using racial slurs to describe African Americans is totally okay if >> you have black friends. >> >> "I use the word n****r a lot because I hang around with a lot of n****rs, >> and they use the word n****r, and I tend to use words that communicate," he >> said. >> >> >> so Gatlin falls into the same category? >> --- >> Larry is a zionist xian who suffers from a napoleon complex, alcoholism >> and drug addiction. >> >> >> On Thursday, October 9, 2014 8:45:32 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >> >> And is that supposed to be some type of negative connotation? I assume >> that liberals like you don't like Ted Nugent, so Gatlin falls into the same >> category? >> >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 9:42 AM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> Larry Gatlin is country music's Ted Nugent. >> >> On Thursday, October 9, 2014 6:34:25 AM UTC-5, Travis wrote: >> >> >> >> >> BareNakedIslam posted: ""Convert or die. you say? We exist to fan the >> flame of freedom and we don't run. I can shoot the cork out of a pig's ass >> at 300 yards...or an Islamic terrorist's." http://youtu.be/CWtRpJucx3U >> h/t Nick & Jenny" >> >> New post on *BARE NAKED ISLAM* >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/?author=1> AMERICAN WITH A REMINGTON: >> Larry Gatlin’s ode to Islam >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/2014/10/09/american-with-a-remington-larry-gatlins-ode-to-islam/> >> by >> BareNakedIslam <http://www.barenakedislam.com/?author=1> >> >> "Convert or die. you say? We exist to fan the flame of freedom and we >> don't run. I can shoot the cork out of a pig's ass at 300 yards...or an >> Islamic terrorist's." h/t Nick & Jenny >> >> Read more of this post >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/2014/10/09/american-with-a-remington-larry-gatlins-ode-to-islam/> >> *BareNakedIslam <http://www.barenakedislam.com/?author=1>* | October >> 9, 2014 at 3:04 am | Categories: EnemyWithin-America >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/?taxonomy=category&term=enemywithin-america> >> | URL: http://wp.me/p276zM-18uJ >> >> Comment >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/2014/10/09/american-with-a-remington-larry-gatlins-ode-to-islam/#respond> >> See all comments >> <http://www.barenakedislam.com/2014/10/09/american-with-a-remington-larry-gatlins-ode-to-islam/#comments> >> >> Unsubscribe >> <https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=7f89380f46003915c34c2cdd2b126a38&email=bovinescatologists%40gmail.com&b=fLu-%2B4a49hsaQz%7Exbl%2Fcz%3FGYq17gF.OyuU73xy5%26nYLu2mxpMX> >> to no longer receive posts from BARE NAKED ISLAM. >> Change your email settings at Manage Subscriptions >> <https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=7f89380f46003915c34c2cdd2b126a38&email=bovinescatologists%40gmail.com>. >> >> >> *Trouble clicking?* Copy and paste this URL into your browser: >> http://www.barenakedislam.com/2014/10/09/american-with-a-rem >> ington-larry-gatlins-ode-to-islam/ >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >> * It's active and moderated. 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